Augment Summoing + Superior Summons versus Dimesional Agility Feat Tree.


Advice


I am playing a half-elf unchained summoner synthesist with an azata eidolon in the Giant Slayer AP. I have already taken Scion of War for my first feat because I have +5 ability score in my charisma. I plan on taking arcane strike and power attack for my 3rd and 5th lvl feats. My party consists of a dwarf druid with a big cat animal companion, an elf unlettered arcanist with a hare familiar, and a Divine Hunter Paladin. Our group just hit lvl 3 so I am still deciding on my 3rd lvl feat and spell.

My role in the party is basically the melee/tank build. I am basically supposed to take all the aggro and damage for my team. The druid and his animal comapion will probably be helping with this later on after they get a few more lvls under their belt. My AC is pretty decent and I will have around 28-30 AC by the time I reach 5th lvl, and if I take arcane strike and power attack I should be able to dish out the damage too.

But as of right now I am in a bit of a conundrum. At a previous play session my group was attacked by a big wave of orcs, my PC took all the hits like a champ, many of the rolls my DM was rolling was missing my synthesist because of his 21 AC. But wouldn't you know it, my DM rolled and confirmed a crit on the last roll and knocked my synthesist unconscious. He was later stabilized and healed, but he could no longer summon his eidolon for the rest of the day. I had to use his summon monster ability for the rest of the day. I can summon up to 8 times a day thanks to having a high charisma modifier. Surprisingly I am finding my PC's summon monster ability to be more useful than what I thought it would be since I was planning on having my PC stay in his eidolon suit as much he can.

I plan on having my synthesist take the large evolution at 8th lvl and then going huge when he hits lvl 13. Right now my group does not have a dedicated healer, but as I was looking up more of the monsters my PC can summon as he lvls up I am seeing a lot of the creatures have healing abilities my party can capitalize on and use. I know by going huge my PC will not be able to wear his eidolon suit all the time due to the size constraint in small areas and dungeons and will have to rely on the summon eidolon spell to get it when my PC needs the eidolon suit. This means I will be relying more on the summon monster ability. Both of these will benefit if I take augment summoning which requires me to take spell focus conjuration. Plus superior summoning will be nice too. This will both make the eidolon suit and my summons stronger. I also realized spells like grease and glitterdust will benefit from this too because of the higher DC save thanks to spell focus conjuration.

But my synthesist is also a biped that uses a manufactured weapon as his primary weapon. By taking the dimensional agility feat tree which my PC will start qualifying for at 7th lvl thanks to the maker's jump ability he gets at lvl 6th. After getting Dimensional Dervish my PC will have the equivalent of a teleporting pounce ability, which in my opinion is pretty broken.

Both these feat trees are powerful in their own right, I am just trying to decide which would be better for my PC. The augment summoning route is a solid and safe choice with a good return versus the feat investment. As for the dimensional agility feat tree option, having a huge teleporting PC with pounce sounds cool, but when you think about the mechanic of it, I am not so sure. First off my PC only has a speed of 30ft, I can double this by casting haste on him which would effectively give a 60ft speed which when using the dimensional dervish feat would give him a total of 120ft when teleporting and attacking. I can't help but think my PC's huge size would encumber him while using this ability, so I am not quite sure how the mechanics would play out on this. I am also limited on how many times I can use it because of how many times my PC can cast dimension door a day.

So there you have it, I am posting this in hopes of which one people will convince me to take. I am also open to other ideas or suggestions. Any input would be greatly appreciated.


First suggestion is the party should get the druid a wand of cure light wounds. It doesn't give you a dedicated healer- quite. But it gets you a lot closer than you would expect for its cost. Staying alive is generally a good idea.

You only get to dimension door 1/day at level 6. To take all the feats to dimensional dervish will take you to level 11. Then at level 12 you can use the dimension door SLA 2/day and cast dimension door 4 times a day. Now, finally it is starting to get really good.

The summoning feats, you need focus conjuration at lvl 3, then augmented at 5 and superior at 7. It starts to pay off well at lvl 5. There are also other feats that offer summoning buffs and options you can add.

That is the way I would go. The campaign may well end before the dimensional stuff really kicks in. Your party seems to need you in melee and failing that needs your monsters.

I don't know how much of your campaign is spent where a huge eidelon can't go but I would think carefully before excluding my eidelon from many locations. Pathfinder Society players find they cannot have their merely large animal companions around a lot of the time.


I agree with Joynt Jezebel.

I appreciate that the appeal of the Dimensional Dervish line is pretty high, but it takes so long to pull off that it seems to be best for characters created at a high level, rather than those leveling from 1st on up.

Summoning is going to be a more consistent and diverse option for you I think, and Spell Focus and Augment Summoning both pull their weight.

One caution though: given that two allies have 'pets' you may want to consider avoiding clogging the turn order with high numbers of summons, in which case you may decide against Superior Summons. Of course, if you do, there are lots of other good summoning-related feats to work with instead.


You should expect to be knocked unconscious regularly as Giantslayer progresses. I'm GMing a campaign in the latter half of book 2 and the reality of fighting giants is such that you're going to get hit and hit hard. In that vein, having summons tank for you is probably a lot stronger than trying to take the hits yourself. So for the role, being able to summon stronger creatures and wade in to help them fight or boost up after they fall will probably be more useful than pseudo-pouncing.


The Steel Refrain wrote:
One caution though: given that two allies have 'pets' you may want to consider avoiding clogging the turn order with high numbers of summons, in which case you may decide against Superior Summons. Of course, if you do, there are lots of other good summoning-related feats to work with instead.

This one does not understand the true nature of power!

There is no such thing as too many slaves. Muh Huh Huh.


Joynt Jezebel wrote:
The Steel Refrain wrote:
One caution though: given that two allies have 'pets' you may want to consider avoiding clogging the turn order with high numbers of summons, in which case you may decide against Superior Summons. Of course, if you do, there are lots of other good summoning-related feats to work with instead.

This one does not understand the true nature of power!

There is no such thing as too many slaves. Muh Huh Huh.

Ha ha ha... fair enough! I definitely concede it's a very powerful option.

It's just an option that I prefer to avoid personally, to avoid slowing down the game and boring/annoying the other players while they wait for you to finish up with all your summons. My view is that turns take long enough at high levels.

If you decide to go with Superior Summons, OP, I'd recommend that you try to ensure that you've done everything you can to have their stats ready to hand (cue cards, maybe), so you can flip through their turns as quickly and efficiently as possible.


Oh, I actually agree it is a valid concern.

But when it comes to summoned creatures, I think that taking the sort of measures you mention in your last paragraph, along with knowing your summon options and how to use them and taking decisions pretty quickly avoids most of the problems.

Having an extra critter isn't what really slows things down. It is looking things up and reading descriptions and weighing options that really slow things down.


Joynt Jezebel wrote:

Oh, I actually agree it is a valid concern.

But when it comes to summoned creatures, I think that taking the sort of measures you mention in your last paragraph, along with knowing your summon options and how to use them and taking decisions pretty quickly avoids most of the problems.

Having an extra critter isn't what really slows things down. It is looking things up and reading descriptions and weighing options that really slow things down.

Yeah, we are on the same page :)


Thanks for all the input and advice guys. I think I still will be taking arcane strike and power attack at 3rd and 5th lvls. After that I will start taking at least spell focus conjuration and augment summoning at 7th and 9th lvl. The reason being is that I am a synthesist after all, if I took summoning feats any earlier I might as well be playing a regular unchained summoner. Still on the fence about superior summoning though.

As for keeping track of the summoned creatures' stats. I have found this site called Summoner's Scribe. It has all the regular creatures stats for summon monster and summon nature's ally spells. It even includes options for applying the bonuses you get from the augment summoning feat as well as the templates you get from others. All I need at the table is my iPad to look up the stats.


Great site, swordfalcon. Thanks for linking it!

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Advice / Augment Summoing + Superior Summons versus Dimesional Agility Feat Tree. All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.