Do grappled targets count as willing if they want to follow a teleport


Advice

Shadow Lodge

2 people marked this as FAQ candidate.

Dimension door targets "you and touched objects or other touched willing creatures"
My character is grappling an enemy faster and his magic item casts dimension door as a command word

Do I follow with if I want to keep holding on


Grappled doesn't mean willing or unwilling.

In fact how you touch him is irrelevant, what counts is his intend - does he intend to follow or not- or whether he is unconscious and therefore automatically considered williNguyen.

Shadow Lodge

I'm the one who wants to follow along,
He's the one who cast


Then you are willing and touching: both condition are met...so you are good to go.


I don't think a grappled character counts as touched by default. If he cast any other touch spell, it wouldn't automatically touch you. He would still need to make an attack roll to touch. (If you successfully identified the spell with spellcraft when he cast it, I would let you be willing to not resist the spell, but the default is when fighting with an enemy, you try to avoid being touched by their spells).


I think this is deserving of an FAQ. There's no clear rule distinguishing whether "touched creatures" means "targets deliberately touched" or "anything currently touching you".


Kobold Cleaver wrote:
I think this is deserving of an FAQ. There's no clear rule distinguishing whether "touched creatures" means "targets deliberately touched" or "anything currently touching you".

I can only disagree, the caster is who determines what happens. If they intentionally touch (aka target them directly) a target AND that target is willing, then it works.

Someone grappling a target isn't the same as the caster touching them for purposes of targeting a spell (unless spelled out in the actual write up of the spell, a la Shocking Grasp where unintended/indirect touching causes a discharge).

Shadow Lodge

Except I am in control of the grapple
I am touching them
They cannot avoid touching me
If they could they wouldn't need to teleport away


There's a very simple answer to this found within the text of the spell itself.

Quote:
You may also bring one additional willing Medium or smaller creature (carrying gear or objects up to its maximum load) or its equivalent per three caster levels.

So even if you're grappling someone, and you cast teleport, and the grappled target is technically touched by you via grapple, and you go further and the grappled target is willing to be brought along... The final decision rests with you, because the spell says "you may".

From OP's perspective, both you and the caster of teleport have to agree that you're coming along.


Okay, yeah, Devo's caught it. I wouldn't mind letting it slip either way for a home game, though, since the "came along for the ride" situation is a common trope.


Lord Foul II wrote:

Except I am in control of the grapple

I am touching them
They cannot avoid touching me
If they could they wouldn't need to teleport away

Irrelevant, as the caster has the choice of taking you along, or not, if you are unwilling. Their choice, not yours, is the determining factor. The caster's intent is what matters, not yours.

The Exchange

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Guardian 3rd Tier Mythic Power.

Dimensional Grappler (Su): When you have an opponent grappled or pinned and it attempts to use a teleportation effect, you can attempt a Will save against the effect, even if it would not normally allow a save. If you succeed, you learn the type of teleportation effect (such as dimension door) and the creature's intended destination, and then may prevent the effect (as if using a quickened dimensional anchor, using your character level as your caster level) or accompany the opponent as if you were part of its gear with negligible weight.

If you're interested in following along a teleporting opponent.

More accessible is Teleport Tactician (though still pretty limited really) which doesn't let you follow along or prevent a teleport but let's you get an attack of opportunity in whether or not the creature succeeds in casting defensively or not.

Tetori Monks can't follow along a grappled target but at 9th level they can suppress freedom of movement and at 13th level, they can apply a dimensional anchor effect to their grapples by spending ki.

Oath against fiends can spend a smite evil to apply dimensional anchor to a teleporting Evil-Outsider 30ft away or less. They also passively project an aura out to 20ft the makes teleporting Evil-Outsiders require making a saving throw to have the teleportation effect not be prevented (Also they are one of a small collection of Archetypes that have a feat augmenting one of their features with the Painful Anchor spell which messes with Evil-Outsiders summoning or teleportation effects further).

The Cold Iron Warden Inquisitor Archetype can set up a field of energy that is disruptive to teleportation effects of evil outsiders and they can even track the location of where a teleportation effect goes if they are quick enough.

There are probably some other options that mess up or inhibit teleportation effects but these are the ones I can think of off the top my head.

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