Can't use third party so I'm stuck.


Advice


Normally I'm GMing, but one person noticed my longing to be on the other side of the screen and is running a game set in Galt (hooray!) but isn't allowing third party products (boooo!).

Since I've gotten used to using third party products to do whatever I want with me being stuck trying to make a concept work with just the Paizo printed stuff I'm a bit at a loss so I need some advice.

1) I wanted to play with the Occult classes since I haven't messed around with those all that much yet and got attached to the idea of mimicking a ghost. I looked towards Spiritualist and Medium but can't really find anything that really sticks with that concept. I thought about a ectoplasmic Spiritualist but its less of getting ghost powers and more about being a goofy magus. I thought the medium would be better to get ghost powers by being possessed by a ghost or even possessing myself, but that's less of ghost powers and more of being a weird version of another class. Normally I'd just build something up with Spheres of Power or have a class from Thunderscape but without that I'm having a hard time finding ways to get be a pseudo-ghost here. How do I be a ghost?

2) What are good themes for Galt character-wise? The exact nature of the campaign is under wraps aside from 'Galt'. I went with being an executioner's son who was ostracized before being mentored by a noble interested in an innate supernatural talent I had but wanted to keep that loose enough to be able to adjust to whatever the theme is. Some sort of vigilante was around my second choice if I fail to make the ghost thing work the way I want it to.

3) Since the ectoplacmic Spiritualist was my first choice, What are good ways to make a strength focused version of it? Without dex to damage it seems not that great to go full on dex with it but I've never made a STR magus.

4) One thing about the medium that possesses themselves, the reanimated medium, I assume the rules mean that you choose a legendary spirit and you just choose that instead of being able to channel multiple spirits.

5) If all else fails I want to wield a chain and do supernatural stuff with it. What are good combat feats/builds for chain wielding with just the paizo rules? related: does the hangman vigilante's abilities work for a chain?


Hmm, you might consider more stealth related effects to act ghost-like. Hide in shadows and such. I have a fetchling slayer who's main effect is to create shadow to hide in and attack from.


Themes for Galt...hmm, someone from the former nobility or a previous defeated regime laying low or plotting (re)conquest, a random dude/tte trying to take vengeance on a currently powerful demagogue for killing a relative/loved one/friend, disillusioned enforcer (or a double agent posing as one), a non-human or another foreigner trying to survive and profit from the chaos,

As for actually being a ghost, well, Undead Anatomy IV gives that but you need to be a high-level sorcerer or wizard for it. Anything that temporarily turns you ethereal can serve in a pinch, though. For a somewhat lower level solution, Shadow projection is cool, but normally only limited to sorcerers and wizards - check with your DM if he/she would allow it in your case. Also, your shadow can be attacked and if it is "killed", you are in trouble.


Ghostly stuff:

Haunted oracle/ urban spirit totem barbarian. Maybe go for Rage Prophet prestige class.

Possessed shaman (ancestors spirit, lord spirit or maybe slums?)

Add a bit of psychometric vigilante?

Take a look at Gray Gardener/Gray Warden prc too.

Hangman Vigilante is very cool for a Galtan son of an executioner. Forget about the chain, use the noose!

Did you see the spirit channeler archetype for the medium?

I would find Geist channeled spiritualist more apropos than Ectoplasmatist.


There's the Haunted archetype that focuses more on the ghost than you, and fractured mind makes the ghost your subconcious.

A few Psychic things could work. Psychic Disciplines have a lot of things, some might fit being a ghost. and Formless Adept turns into gas.

Exciter spiritualist might be helpful in making a combat spiritualist.

The Exchange

...reads random thread..,That ghost vigilante idea sounds awesome.


Aether kineticist.

It is the one that literally goes poltergeist as its primary thing. Use the kitchen knives as a primary form of attack and then have the furniture suddenly rise up to try to murder people.

You can also throw on kinetic form so your squishy flesh body is suspended out of large body made up of your spiritul stuff.

It generally has the signs of being pseudo ghost. It doesn't explicitly have "ooooo~ you are a ghooo~st" on it, but being that focused on names and descriptions restricts people to core rogues when they want to be the sneaky guy... In practice, you are throwing around a bunch of ghost/poltergeist mechanics. Just make the 'strands of aether' into more explicit ghost goo (honestly, it isn't stated whether people can see the strands or not, so that is fair), and you seem good to go.


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I don't know what Galt is, but if you can't think of ANYTHING to do with just official material for your character, you've been using the wrong Third-Party stuff.


Dot.

Bloodrealm wrote:
I don't know what Galt is, but if you can't think of ANYTHING to do with just official material for your character, you've been using the wrong Third-Party stuff.

No, it just means he's not as fully immersed into first party things or he hasn't found proper first party options in order to flesh his character concept out in a way that would be fun for him. Nothing "wrong" about that at all.

Sovereign Court

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Bloodrealm wrote:
I don't know what Galt is, but if you can't think of ANYTHING to do with just official material for your character, you've been using the wrong Third-Party stuff.

Galt = Les Misérables.


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I'm actually gearing up to do a Galt campaign, myself. I'm gonna copy what I put down in terms of themes that I'm using. Your GM might be doing something different, but here's what I have:

Intrigue:

Galt is a dangerous place, full of suspicion and paranoia. Its most effective people are the ones who can win over the mobs or who can work under the cover of anonymity. Masked Personas can be particularly useful, both for classes that have the Dual Identity feature (such as the Vigilante), but any character can don a disguise.

You’ll require more than just anonymity to survive in Galt, however. You may need to make friends (or enemies) with the right people.

Some classes and archetypes worth considering include the vigilante and its many archetypes, as well as the bard (Masked Performer, Demagogue, and Provocateur may be particularly fitting). Inquisitors, rogues, and investigators also make for good intrigue-themed classes.

Prestige classes fitting the themes of intrigue include the Assassin, Red Mantis Assassin, Dawnflower Dissident, Master Spy, Enchanting Courtesan, Lion Blade; even the Gray Gardener itself.

Natives and Outsiders

When making your character, consider whether they’re a native to the region or someone from outside, and what their goal is. Galtans are distrustful of outsiders, but not without some reason. Spies from Cheliax, Andoran, Taldor, and Razmiran all have their eyes on the unstable region. In addition to the international intrigue, others come, either as assassins (the Red Mantis in particular despises Galt for what they deem as blasphemy in their rejection of the divine right of kings), treasure hunters (for many of the old abandoned noble villas still may hold hordes of riches), or for other purposes, such as retrieving the soul of a loved one from one of the Final Blades.

So consider your character. Are they part of the mob? An aspiring member of the Gray Gardeners? An orphan who’d like revenge? A counter-revolutionary?

And if you’re from outside Galt, what are you there for? Are you a spy working with the Twilight Talons? A member of the Pathfinder Society on your way to Woodsedge? Or maybe just an opportunistic treasure-hunter.

Violence

Galt is a violent place, and it has been constantly violent for its forty-year revolution. This takes a toll on its populace. Many of the people seem content, as long as they have a target they can be angry at have their bloodlust sated by the near-constant executions. Others would love nothing more than to see the violence and endless executions stop. Still others would have their own revolution with which to replace First Citizen Goss’s regime; hopefully for the last time.

The Mob

If there’s anything that’s more constant than the Gray Gardeners, it’s the angry mobs. Mobs can be both dangerous enemies as well as powerful tools, if you know how to use them. This campaign will be using stuff from Ultimate Intrigue, such as verbal duels. Mobs also count as audiences for Performance Combat.

Obviously, a lot of this is gonna depend on who your GM is. Most GMs might not give you a lot of wiggle-room with regards to playing pacifist characters (if your GM is accomodating, though, there are lots of neat class options and feats for it), aaaaand your GM probably isn't going to have the "mobs = performance combat" element, but I love the performance combat rules, so I'm throwing it in there, too.


Oooooh, it's some "intrigue" b!*@&~+%. Just don't play a Vigilante.


acquire ghost template?


what about a Formless Adept Psychic and then use either Variant Multiclass or the Eldrich Heritage feats for Sorcerer - Undead Bloodline

Would give you a gradually increasing in power incorporeal body plus some undead-like traits


deusvult wrote:
Bloodrealm wrote:
I don't know what Galt is, but if you can't think of ANYTHING to do with just official material for your character, you've been using the wrong Third-Party stuff.
Galt = Les Misérables.

Actually Les Miserables takes place like 40 years after the Revolution.

Think more of a grimmer Scarlet Pimpernel, or if you know French literature, Le Chevalier de Maison Rouge.


Bloodrealm wrote:
Oooooh, it's some "intrigue" b*$@&+&@. Just don't play a Vigilante.

Well, Vigilantes are thematically appropriate to the region. It's the home of the Red Raven, and the Gray Gardeners have a lot of Zealots in their ranks.


PannicAtack wrote:
Bloodrealm wrote:
Oooooh, it's some "intrigue" b*$@&+&@. Just don't play a Vigilante.
Well, Vigilantes are thematically appropriate to the region. It's the home of the Red Raven, and the Gray Gardeners have a lot of Zealots in their ranks.

The Vigilante was designed specifically to play in a whole party of Vigilantes. Most of what they have doesn't work very well any other way, especially because of Dual Identity. You can't be seen too often associating with the party in one identity or the other, limiting group time in public areas mostly to one of your identities. You also have to switch identities if you need to fight while in your social identity, and you need to not stay with the group, at least openly, to take advantage of Startling Appearance (unless you're Small and have the Go Unnoticed feat). You basically HAVE to get Many Guises and Quick Change as soon as possible just to function in a group, and those talents aren't available until 5th and 7th levels respectively.


1) There are some good ghost options, don't worry. Probably the best is Haunted Spiritualist. You play the phantom as your character, and you've got a dedicated 6/9 caster under your control that can heal you, buff you, and cast touch spells on your behalf. Not on that, but your caster can handle social situations that your ghostly form will have difficulty with. In trouble? Either hide in your pet's brain, or drain their standard actions to get a quick Enlarge Person. (At high levels, Overwhelming Phantom allows some basic possession stuff without relying on your pet caster.)

Formless Adept Psychic works increasingly well as a pseudo-ghost if you don't care for playing a phantom as your character.

As mentioned, Aether Kineticist is a good fit. At-will psuedo-invisibility and telekinetic abilities makes it pretty easy to go around doing ghostly things, although you'll have to "manifest" (become visible) in order to attack somebody. There are some other really thematic options later on, like being able to animate objects (thus allowing you to attack people indirectly without appearing).

If you want less "ghost" and more "spirit", you can have something of a zeitgeist character with the Intrigue or Streets mysteries for Oracles or Slums spirit for Shaman.

2) Themes of vengeance, anger, injustice, and rebellion are all appropriate. Galt has more or less started devouring itself, and everybody around is terrified of poking it, lest it turn on them instead.

4) Nope! You are essentially channeling your own future potential- all the things destiny might have in store for you. You might talk to the GM about playing a reckless Medium of the normal variety, with little enough self-preservation that you'll get killed and come back as a (somewhat wiser) Reincarnated Medium.

5) Best supernatural chain shenanigans is (once again) Aether Kineticist. Since you can use anything held in one hand for an Kinetic Blade with Aether, a short chain works fine. No melee feats needed except for Weapon Finesse. Once you're 8th level, you can start using Kinetic Whip freely, getting a proper long chain. (Combat Reflexes becomes a good idea here.)

Liberty's Edge

Bloodrealm wrote:
The Vigilante was designed specifically to play in a whole party of Vigilantes. Most of what they have doesn't work very well any other way, especially because of Dual Identity. You can't be seen too often associating with the party in one identity or the other, limiting group time in public areas mostly to one of your identities. You also have to switch identities if you need to fight while in your social identity, and you need to not stay with the group, at least openly, to take advantage of Startling Appearance (unless you're Small and have the Go Unnoticed feat). You basically HAVE to get Many Guises and Quick Change as soon as possible just to function in a group, and those talents aren't available until 5th and 7th levels respectively.

That's simply not true.

A Vigilante can just walk around in Vigilante Identity with the party, occasionally using the Social Identity for other specific stuff away from them, and do fine.

Or he can disdain a secret identity and use all his abilities from both identities freely (technically in the Social Identity), losing only the ability to have two separate identities.

Or he can walk around in social identity and then kill everyone who sees him fight (aside from the other PCs) if he has to fight in it. The only risk of using Vigilante Identity abilities in social identity is having the two identities connected, after all.

It's really doable, and Vigilante is still awesome under those circumstances.


For Galt possible to take mesmerist. Hate-Monger Archetype.


Lady-J wrote:
acquire ghost template?

I can help with that.

*licks knife*


Deadmanwalking wrote:
Bloodrealm wrote:
The Vigilante was designed specifically to play in a whole party of Vigilantes. Most of what they have doesn't work very well any other way, especially because of Dual Identity. You can't be seen too often associating with the party in one identity or the other, limiting group time in public areas mostly to one of your identities. You also have to switch identities if you need to fight while in your social identity, and you need to not stay with the group, at least openly, to take advantage of Startling Appearance (unless you're Small and have the Go Unnoticed feat). You basically HAVE to get Many Guises and Quick Change as soon as possible just to function in a group, and those talents aren't available until 5th and 7th levels respectively.

That's simply not true.

A Vigilante can just walk around in Vigilante Identity with the party, occasionally using the Social Identity for other specific stuff away from them, and do fine.

Or he can disdain a secret identity and use all his abilities from both identities freely (technically in the Social Identity), losing only the ability to have two separate identities.

Or he can walk around in social identity and then kill everyone who sees him fight (aside from the other PCs) if he has to fight in it. The only risk of using Vigilante Identity abilities in social identity is having the two identities connected, after all.

It's really doable, and Vigilante is still awesome under those circumstances.

I agree. Of course the Vigilante class is definitely something you have to be careful with and make sure it fits the campaign, but there are a lot of things you can do with it.

I was reading through the new Curse of the Crimson Throne and how it has a vigilante character as a prominent NPC. Its description of him was pretty clever.

[spoiler=Guy carries his vigilante gear in a Bag of Holding. He has two swords; a +2 rapier he uses as a vigilante and a +1 rapier he uses in his social guise. If forced to fight in the social guise he uses the +1 rapier and fights defensively.[/spoiler]

Vigilantes, I think, can excel in city-based campaigns and campaigns that make it easy to tell when something's gonna be "free-form RP"-type stuff and "mission"-type stuff. Again, not for every campaign, but "only when the entire party is vigilantes" is rather sillily limiting.

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