Lack of gold / wealth? How do you handle it.


Kingmaker


We're in book 2 now and it seems like everyone is behind on gear, any one else have this experience? Any good ways to acquire wealth or should we bite the bullet and draw more out of BP?


As a GM if an AP was shorting my party on gear I would throw in extra gold.
If you are not the GM you may have to use BP. I would also suggest crafting magical items.


If rational negotiation with the GM is out of the question, then here is what you do, although it will require the sacrifice of your current character.

Give all of your wealth and equipment to your group and tell them to give it to whomever replaces you in the group. Then have your naked and broke character leap off a high enough cliff/building/bridge and die. Next bring in a new character with bare minimum equipment and all their starting gold. Join the group with that new character for about a day in game, then repeat give all of your wealth and equipment to your group and tell them to give it to whomever replaces you in the group, followed by another height related suicide. Repeat until you guys feel you have the appropriate amount of gold and end this morbid cycle on a character you want to continue with, preferably your original character's long lost twin.

If rational negotiation IS possible, then just talk with your GM as a group about your WBL concerns. Hopefully they will throw you some extra gold if it's really a problem.

Liberty's Edge

I assume the character multiple suicide option is in jest.


Martin Kauffman 530 wrote:
I assume the character multiple suicide option is in jest.

Remember, assuming always makes an "ass" out of "u" and "me". :)

Although I must reinforce that rational diplomacy should always be Plan A before it comes to murderhobo level tactics.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

If rational negotiation isn't an option, what on Earth makes you think that the GM would allow the new character to join without paying for a massive state funeral at a cost equal to the new character's gold?

Don't try to game the system against the guy who can game the game world.


Sah wrote:
We're in book 2 now and it seems like everyone is behind on gear, any one else have this experience? Any good ways to acquire wealth or should we bite the bullet and draw more out of BP?

It happened to my group too at the same stage. To deal with it, we had no choice but to pick some money from the kingdom, by converting some BP in gold.

The current ruler (my PC) managed to make the check (rather hard) to avoid any unrest.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Rulebook Subscriber
Angry Wizard wrote:
Martin Kauffman 530 wrote:
I assume the character multiple suicide option is in jest.

Remember, assuming always makes an "ass" out of "u" and "me". :)

Although I must reinforce that rational diplomacy should always be Plan A before it comes to murderhobo level tactics.

As a GM I might let that shenanigan fly once if you convinced me that you just wanted to change characters, but once I saw what was happening, I would likely ask the player to leave, and retcon the shenanigans.

Now if a players said "hey I think are WBL is a little off" I would say, okay, lets all do some homework, I'll review the scenario and see whats up and you guys figure out what your characters total wealth is, then will see where we go from there. One often finds that adventures don't evenly distribute the wealth, or once party may fail to find it, likewise, the type of wealth may favour certain character types so you may be short, but your allies may be fine.

In general, we never felt short changed in Kingmaker, principally because you literally build a kingdom and print money, but the early exploration experience is a little freeform, so if you end up exploring all the RP encounters, and none of the lair full of wealth encounters then you may have the XP but not the equipment, but it balances in there end.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Rulebook Subscriber

Another statement just about power level in general, is that in the exploration phases of KM one typically has one encounter per day, one can just go nova on every encounter as their is rarely a reason to hold back resources for a second encounter.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Now, how I would deal with this is by having a neighbouring cash-rich/people-poor area send a trade mission to the PCs kingdom with "gifts" for the rulers to persuade them to allow a trade route.

Use the gifts to bring the PCs up to WBL, the trade route to bolster the kingdom (per the trade route rules), but make the contract require that the PC's kingdom provide some level of security along the route.


I haven't even remotely tried to do the math as to whether or not KM is under powered in terms of WBL. That said, as referenced above, KM is probably one of the few APs where the PCs can get by fairly well while being under the WBL guidelines. I also think the AP really encourages player crafting which can also help with the WBL (don't know if that was specifically taken into consideration though).

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Rulebook Subscriber

Yeah thanks to crafting we were way way over by the end....

We even were a major exporter of Narylstead Elemental Gems, "finest elemental gems, and must superior to Pitaxian Elemental Gems"


My group of 5 (sometimes 6) PCs had no trouble keeping up with WBL, I stopped really tracking it once they started crafting.


Hmm, maybe its just us then, there are certain things we got that I know were powerful magic items, but we haven't sold them.

I am a player not a DM, and I was looking for in character ways to work on wealth. As amusing as I found the WBL suicide machine, not quite what I was looking for.

I'll discuss some my concerns with the DM and probably deal with some BP, thanks guys.


WBL is a guideline - not a hard and fast rule. As a DM, I work on the basis that I give my characters (roughly) enough treasure to meet the combined group WBL level.

The party is expected to work out a system of distribution that works for them as a group. My current party are working through that process at the moment - in a moderated set of IC & OC conversations. They are edging towards a system that will give unequal shares - which means some PCs will have better equipment and thus be over WBL. Others will be under, but the party (as a whole) would get the 'Best bang for the GP' of the loot they have collected.

By the same score, any players preplanned character build is not my concern. If the gear the party gets doesn't suit a carefully concocted build plan - tough luck. Characters who grow according to their experience and learn to make best use of the things they find will prosper. If you sell all the stuff you find to buy some preplanned equipment - well you will actually be pushing half WBL :)

Actually, it will be more that 50% because you get full value for 'treasure' items. But TBH, so long as individual characters are no more than 50% adrift from WBL, then as a DM I am not too worried.


Sah wrote:

Hmm, maybe its just us then, there are certain things we got that I know were powerful magic items, but we haven't sold them.

I am a player not a DM, and I was looking for in character ways to work on wealth. As amusing as I found the WBL suicide machine, not quite what I was looking for.

I'll discuss some my concerns with the DM and probably deal with some BP, thanks guys.

One thing I know is that often published adventures will have plenty of treasure for wbl purposes, but that treasure may not necessarily be particularly well suited to the party, or certainly to every member of the party.

Just as an example, in a game I am playing in, the GM has handed out plenty of treasure/coin, but my monk has had a hard time finding gear that works particularly well for a monk (shops don't have it, we don't have a crafter, etc.) Money wise, we are doing just fine, it was just that I didn't necessarily have certain things that I had anticipated being available. That said, there was sufficient treasure available that our party (my monk included) is very, very effective. It just required taking a different approach than what was planned (which sometimes is half the fun). As it stands, at about 14th level, my monk just finally got an Amulet of Mighty Fists, and still does not have Monk's robes. However, he has learned how to flurry with a polearm with a x4 crit multiplier and has ready access to Enlarge Person, thereby making him a whirlwind of pain to anything within 20 feet of him.


Granted my party just started book 2, but even with 5 party members, they had done a pretty good job and keeping WBL in check.

If you are behind there are two ways to get money for an adventurer, go out and smash some monsters or get a job, aka downtime rules. If you have been completing the quests as they pop up I would think you should be pretty well in line, but if not I can totally see how players are not on an even level.

Bring it up with the GM and have them drop a couple more quests in, it is an easy way to have the party go out and pull in some cash without unbalancing things too much.


My party had early issues with treasure, but once they figured out that they could withdraw gold at a penalty, they began to configure their city builds around withdrawing gold. Once a month they would pull out gold for their own purses and then build a house to counter the unrest.

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