Yes, to the subject of your hypnotic stare. Since spells are attacks, you can apply Painful Stare.
Does the mesmerist ability Painful Stare augment the damage of an area of effect spell such as fireball or call lightning?
It's an attack (an invisible creature casting fireball at an enemy becomes visible) and it does deal damage to the enemy, so I would think yes, but it also doesn't have an attack roll to hit the enemy.Thanks in advance!
What is the text for the rule?
Sometimes when PF says attack they mean something with an attack roll, and sometimes they just mean any attack. I really wish they would be more precise, but that is how it is.
It calls out precision damage which comes from attacks made by weapons so it is for attack roll based damage, not something like magic missile, which also can't use sneak attacks to add extra damage.
It calls out precision damage which comes from attacks made by weapons so it is for attack roll based damage, not something like magic missile, which also can't use sneak attacks to add extra damage.
I gotta say, that's pretty fair and something I overlooked. Not sure how you are giving other characters precision damage but whatever.
Though there are some spells you could add the damage to, like rays.
I'm not seeing any rule which require precision damage to be delivered by an attack roll. (although the most frequent examples of precision damage have additional requirements which tend to force this)
That being said, the mesmerist's Painful Stare ability states that it can only be triggered once per round, and a trigger only affects a single target. So you're not going to be able to apply this damage to multiple targets even with an AoE/multi-hit ability.
The rules also don't state that sneak attacks require an attack roll, but it is the intent.
I'm inclined to agree with you about sneak attack, but Painful Stare is a completely different ability. They both just happen to deal precision damage.The rules also don't state that sneak attacks require an attack roll, but it is the intent.I'm not seeing any rule which require precision damage to be delivered by an attack roll. (although the most frequent examples of precision damage have additional requirements which tend to force this)
That being said, the mesmerist's Painful Stare ability states that it can only be triggered once per round, and a trigger only affects a single target. So you're not going to be able to apply this damage to multiple targets even with an AoE/multi-hit ability.
Why does one need at attack roll and the other does not if neither specifically calls for one?
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If we are going to treat painful stare equivilent to sneak attack because the damage is both precision damage...
-an effect like blur will inhibit painful stare.
-invisibility will prevent it even though mesmerists have a built in mechanic to maintain hypnotic stare against targets they can't actually see.
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-invisibility will prevent it even though mesmerists have a built in mechanic to maintain hypnotic stare against targets they can't actually see.
Fun thing about that - you can maintain the stare, but it doesn't actually, by text, give you targeting ability. It's questionable if you even know the square of the target. And say goodbye to most of your spells - anything single target is useless.
I may be a little bitter.
If we are going to treat painful stare equivilent to sneak attack because the damage is both precision damage...
-an effect like blur will inhibit painful stare.
-invisibility will prevent it even though mesmerists have a built in mechanic to maintain hypnotic stare against targets they can't actually see.
Actually painful stare only works on people targeted by hypnotic stare, and you can't target something you can't see unless you have something like blindsight so you are right that being invisible would stop it.
As for the first idea I never said they were equal in all ways. I am only using sneak attack as an example of something that deals precision damage and needs an attack roll because every other ability in the game that deals precision damage requires an attack roll. The investigator also does precision damage, and it needs an attack roll, but if the argument is made that "well ___ doesnt' call out attack rolls then there are no grounds to really deny sneak attack or the investigator ability either, but I think we know that is not the intent.
You can maintain an existing hypnotic stare if blinded if you pass a concentration check, the same should apply if they go invisible while subject to the stare.