How could I handle playing a paladin in this campaign?

Hell's Rebels

So I'm wanting to play an Iroran paladin for a run through of this but the DM seems to think that it wouldn't work well due to going against the law and one of the pc's is a vigilante melee build who knocks people out then kills them along with various unlawful activities. These were the problems I was presented with as to why a paladin would be an issue and frankly I find these bad reasons and am a tad tired of bending over backwards to accommodate this table solely at the expense of my enjoyment so I'm wanting to ask would it really be that hard to make a paladin that could work in this campaign? If not how could I pitch it?

Main things to address I suppose would be:
1. Not abiding by Kintargo's laws, prioritizing the aspects of "good" over lawful, maybe pointing to that too many laws of Kintargo can't be considered to follow good aligned principles. Also screw Devils.
2. How to handle the nonlawful actions of the party and not holding me responsible for the decisions of other party members whose actions I can speak against but can't, and shouldn't be able to, actually control. Is it against paladin conduct to not hold others to the same standard I hold myself too? I'd like to play him, as far as moral decisions with the party, as a moral compass, always there to point you in the right direction But never dictating that you must go that way. Along with not personally carrying out certain unsavory tasks I'd object to i don't see this as too obstructive, maybe it is? Idk.

Silver Crusade

I don't think a paladin is inherently at odds with the AP as written. How a lawful good individual reacts to Barzillai Thrune's rule is something that comes up. I don't know that Irori would be the best choice of deity.

However, if your GM is telling you not to play a paladin, I would ask them question #2. If they're going to be holding you accountable for your party's actions, you're going to end up at odds with the GM and the party.

Couple of things to keep in mind your not allowed to consort with evil people as a Paladin unless your deity code specifically allows it. Second based on what I know of the campaign (would have to download the players guide to be certain) I think some of the things that are going to come up are going to put the campaign at odds in general.

Edit: had rebels confused with vengeance so other than the fact that the players guide does point out several times that Lawful can be an issue you still have to worry about the no consorting thing possibly.

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Play a Grey Paladin. This allows for NG or CG Paladins. You can also try to prevent the deaths of prisoners and even use the argument that the Silver Ravens don't want to emulate House Thrune while resisting it.

Alternatively, play a War Priest.

My advice as a GM currently running a Hell's Rebels campaign.

1. The takeover of Kintargo could quite easily be perceived as unjust, if not unlawful. The clear violations of basic human rights, as well as the near transparent deposing of the previous Lord-Mayor. It could easily stir a citizen to action, to do what's RIGHT for the people and impose new, just, and lawful rule.

As for 2...

This is where the real problem playing a Paladin comes in. Execution of the unconscious might be against a Paladin's moral code, depending on how your GM ruled it, and how big of a deal you want to make it in RPing. Something to consider is that you are essentially in war-time, and that peaceful protest, and coddling your enemies does no good when they will not be showing you similar mercy. I would agree with the idea that Irori is not necessarily the best choice for a Paladin in this game, however. Shelyn would be a nice choice, Iomedae as well, though keep in mind the Glorious Reclamation plays no role in the AP itself, and my personal favourite choice for a Paladin in Rebels, Sarenrae.

I'd also consider talking to the player who's running the Vigilante. See if you can get him open to holding off on the kill-crazy executions. If you can figure out how to craft an interesting character arc for the both of you, the campaign will be richer for it.

It's important to know that being lawful, doesn't mean following the laws of a country.

A paladin would obviously be opposed to House Thrune ruling any place, so it's not surprising that you would find a paladin in Hell's Vengeance.

Choosing Irori had two purposes for making this work, one the archetype looks fine but that's not super relevant, the other one is that the archetype states: " Irori offers no universal paladin code— each paladin in his service creates his own code as part of his spiritual journey, seeing the adherence to such a self-formulated creed as one of the many tests one must face to reach perfection." So I was thinking I could use this to have most of my virtuous ideals things that I only hold myself too, certainly not averse to explaining their merit or advocating them to people, but not holding others up to them necessarily.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

I think a paladin is far from impossible for Hell's Rebels.

In HR, you are dealing with essentially three possible scenarios:

1) Ongoing civil war and conflict that claims innocent lives. This is a chaotic situation and a humanitarian disaster. A paladin should not stand for this, and would want to see a resolution to the situation.

2) Thrune wins. Because they use brutal and Evil methods, a paladin should not stand for this either.

3) Rebels win. An unknown quantity, but likely (because the rebels are predominantly Good and Neutral) not as Evil as Thrune. Of the three choices, this should be the one any logically thinking paladin should strive for.

A paladin can't let the situation drag on (it's chaotic and claims innocent lives) and they can't let Thrune continue a brutal and oppressive rule (it's Evil). For a Lawful Good individual, the logical conclusion should be to help the rebellion seize power and establish a new order that is less Evil than the preceding.

It is noteworthy that in the PRD, paladins are expressly forbidden from working together with Evil, but there is *no* similar ban on working with Chaotic. Working with Chaotic is, RAW, more acceptable than working with Evil. The only arguably problematic part of the PRD paladin code is that she must "respect legitimate authority", but a paladin who can see the discontent in the streets could very logically argue that Thrune's authority is, while *legal*, no longer *legitimate* -- Thrune has lost the mandate of the people, and is only using legal trickery to keep its hold.

What's more, as the AP goes on, the party should discover various things that should only reinforce the paladin's decision. IMO, as certain things are revealed, it should only become easier and more obvious for a paladin to side with the rebellion.

A paladin is easy to justify. Thrune's regime is unjust and its laws shouldn't be followed by just people. In fact, a central aspect of the game is getting a LG Hellknight to side with the rebellion.

As far as god to revere, I wouldn't recommend Irori or Sarenrae because their faiths are all but absent from the city in an organized sense. On the other hand, Abadar and Shelyn are great choices because they have churches in the city. Paladins are better off with support from a church and your character could be a great "in" with either church for the Silver Ravens.

The heart of your problem is going to be other players, especially if they're hostile to the idea. If that's the case, I don't know what to tell you, you probably need to play this PC with another group. On the other hand, if you're all comfortable with roleplaying disagreements between PCs and not assuming they must be solved by fights to the death, it could be a good chance for moral questions and compromises which would make interesting roleplaying.

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