Scenario: You're a pit fiend who gets summoned via planar binding into a properly anchored and protected summoning circle


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Why would you even want a real pit fiend? That sounds risky. Why not just make 1000 simulacrums of them instead


Why a Pit Fiend when you can have a Solar


Cuz evil is cooler, duh!


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edduardco wrote:
Why a Pit Fiend when you can have a Solar

I figured it was 'cause planar binding is a wizard spell, and solars tend to be best called by Clerics, since they can actually control them.


Ashiel wrote:
edduardco wrote:
Why a Pit Fiend when you can have a Solar
I figured it was 'cause planar binding is a wizard spell, and solars tend to be best called by Clerics, since they can actually control them.

Augment Calling + Caller’s Feather and you can have a Solar with Planar Binding or Ally, or you know you can just cast Gate augmenting your CL to 22


Callers feather was a huge tip, combined with augmented calling and spell perfection that would let a wizard hit 24hd


Ashiel wrote:
edduardco wrote:
Why a Pit Fiend when you can have a Solar
I figured it was 'cause planar binding is a wizard spell, and solars tend to be best called by Clerics, since they can actually control them.

or to be more accurate, they are on a stronger basis when ASKING for a favor. No one "controls" a solar... or a pit fiend for that matter.


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Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
or to be more accurate, they are on a stronger basis when ASKING for a favor. No one "controls" a solar... or a pit fiend for that matter.

RAW, you can with gate. But, yes, I much prefer this. Also, since the advent of mythic, I've assumed the majority are actually some kind of mythic rank.


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Buri Reborn wrote:
Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
or to be more accurate, they are on a stronger basis when ASKING for a favor. No one "controls" a solar... or a pit fiend for that matter.
RAW, you can with gate. But, yes, I much prefer this. Also, since the advent of mythic, I've assumed the majority are actually some kind of mythic rank.

Mythic kicks things so far out of the norm, that I really don't think that standard assumptions can apply, so I generally don't include it when I'm talking general assumptions, any more than I would have included epic when talking about old D+D.


Yeah I don't even use Mythic.


Lastoth wrote:
you have your one wish for the year still available. How do you use it to remedy the situation, keeping in mind that all forms of dimensional travel are blocked via the anchor and none of your abilities can cross the circle line?

I might try to go along with whatever this person wants me to do, so I can corrupt their soul and all that. But, if I don't want to do that, I think I know what to do.

If none of my abilities can cross the circle, then the answer seems pretty simple to me. Get rid of the circle. My first thought is to wish that the circle isn't there, and then I realize that I don't need the wish at all. I can dispel greater magic at will, so I just spend round after round dispelling until its gone. If that doesn't work, then I will use my wish if I have to. Then I'll try to immobilize them with power word stun or hold monster. I summon a demon for support, and proceed to try and kill this guy. If they're too powerful (like if they have an army or are epic-level/mythic) then I teleport away as soon as I've dispelled everything, and do anything I can to prevent them from summoning me again, but if they are persistent then they will probably eventually succeed, and I will have no chance but to work with them.


Can't. Nothing you do can hamper the circle. You cannot affect it. Period. That's the point. If you could, it would be trivial, since most anything you're seriously going to use greater planar binding for tends to have things like at-will dispels and summoning.


Ashiel wrote:
Can't. Nothing you do can hamper the circle. You cannot affect it. Period. That's the point. If you could, it would be trivial, since most anything you're seriously going to use greater planar binding for tends to have things like at-will dispels and summoning.

I overlooked that. You telling me this made me think to look at greater planar binding another time, and then I realized that you actually can't even use it on a pit fiend. No planar binding can be used on a pit fiend because even the greater version only affect creatures up to 18 Hit Dice. Pit Fiends have 20 Hit Dice. So the situation doesn't really work in the first place.

But I'll look past that. So, I can't really break out, and a spellcaster powerful enough to get that spell is either a sorcerer, wizard, or summoner. with a will save of at least +9 (unless they have a wisdom penalty or have some other problem like insanity). Thus, using illusions most likely won't work. So the best course of action is really just to make a deal with the devil with them.


Ashiel wrote:
Can't. Nothing you do can hamper the circle. You cannot affect it. Period. That's the point. If you could, it would be trivial, since most anything you're seriously going to use greater planar binding for tends to have things like at-will dispels and summoning.

Surely at least some things you can do could indirectly affect the circle, like asking the binder "Can you please turn off this circle?". Otherwise you can't speak or interract with the world in any way.


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Ashiel wrote:
Can't. Nothing you do can hamper the circle. You cannot affect it. Period. That's the point. If you could, it would be trivial, since most anything you're seriously going to use greater planar binding for tends to have things like at-will dispels and summoning.

I'm going to repeat the "regardless of local conditions" clause of wish teleport. Saying "what about this or that" is moot because no other spell behaves like that. Plus, wish is intentionally special. Still disagreeing there.


You're dimensional anchored during the process, and local refers to issues of space, but you still have spell effects that are preventing you from leaving. As written, local conditions, based on the definition of the word local, would mean irreverent of the destined location. It says nothing about allowing you to ignore spells affecting you, which would be important to note if it did allow you to ignore things like dimensional anchor.


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Pit fiend wishes it can poop as much poop as he desires, then proceeds to poop until the entire circle is filled with poop. Taking a dump is not an ability or attack. Does the circle keep the poop from covering it through gravity?


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Ashiel wrote:
You're dimensional anchored during the process, and local refers to issues of space, but you still have spell effects that are preventing you from leaving. As written, local conditions, based on the definition of the word local, would mean irreverent of the destined location. It says nothing about allowing you to ignore spells affecting you, which would be important to note if it did allow you to ignore things like dimensional anchor.

Note that wish belongs to the universal school. Spells in general have no problem changing their type depending on which version of them you want to use. Yet, wish has no such clauses. It also isn't strictly "teleporting." You simply are in one place and appear in another regardless of local conditions. It's not even called teleport. It's transport. Again, spells that teleport or act as teleportation are always marked as such except, for some reason, wish. Wish defies all the effects that apply to dimensional anchor. Even in its lengthy list of spells it blocks, and only similar spell-like abilities, doesn't include wish while - yes, yet, again - wish gets all kinds of mentions in other spells. Wish is clearly above and beyond any other spell that behaves in a similar way. Not even dimensional lock includes wish.


Most pit fiends are likely to spend most of their time in a fortress with forbiddance on to prevent being called in the first place. They have enemies that want them dead who have the power to do so if they go out on their own. Therefore they likely spend most of their time at home. When they do go they guards and contingencies in place for this kind of thing.

Assuming finite number of pit fiends it is likely that you will not find one available to call. If they are infinite in number they you will get one but it is likely to want to be called. It could also be new or careless but that is less likely.

Imps have have commune once a week and a pit fiend can have as many of those as he wants. A summoner may be protected by mind blank but the fiend would know something is going to call him.


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I would save my wish and instead offer it to the naive apprentice when the master leaves. The only demand I would have for the apprentice is that they leave an item at the start of what will inevitably be a rube goldberg series of events that ultimately cause a drip of wax to fall on the circle and free me. Then I would take my revenge on the mortal that dared to summon me in the first place, sparing the apprentice that they might start on an epic quest to avenge their master and ultimately defeat me before my plans can reach fruition.


Would wishing for some third party to come and ruin the circle work? Like I wish for the nearest orc to come here and ruin the circle without fail or choice?


Buri Reborn wrote:
Ashiel wrote:
You're dimensional anchored during the process, and local refers to issues of space, but you still have spell effects that are preventing you from leaving. As written, local conditions, based on the definition of the word local, would mean irreverent of the destined location. It says nothing about allowing you to ignore spells affecting you, which would be important to note if it did allow you to ignore things like dimensional anchor.
Note that wish belongs to the universal school. Spells in general have no problem changing their type depending on which version of them you want to use. Yet, wish has no such clauses. It also isn't strictly "teleporting." You simply are in one place and appear in another regardless of local conditions. It's not even called teleport. It's transport. Again, spells that teleport or act as teleportation are always marked as such except, for some reason, wish. Wish defies all the effects that apply to dimensional anchor. Even in its lengthy list of spells it blocks, and only similar spell-like abilities, doesn't include wish while - yes, yet, again - wish gets all kinds of mentions in other spells. Wish is clearly above and beyond any other spell that behaves in a similar way. Not even dimensional lock includes wish.

Yes to this, not that you'll find much other support id wager.


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nicholas storm wrote:
Pit fiend wishes it can poop as much poop as he desires, then proceeds to poop until the entire circle is filled with poop. Taking a dump is not an ability or attack. Does the circle keep the poop from covering it through gravity?

This idea is pretty good and needs further discussion

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