Your Relationship With The Occult Classes

Product Discussion

Kineticist- I love this class so much, it fills a niche like no other it is a non-spell casting blasting that focuses on spell powers and supernatural abilities. My only problem is that because it so different it needs a lot more support since unlike other class that derive most of there power from spells and feats, this one does from it's wild talents.

Medium- Not real big on this one and it is a complex class at that. but I do find the concept interesting and would still like to see the 52 spirits based on the harrow/taro cards.

Mesmerist- I like this class, it's like the spiritual successor of the beguiler but much more interesting. I really love it's hypnotic stare and touch treatment abilities.

Occultist- Not real big on this one as well, though it is an interesting concept. My big problem is it one of the more complex classes in the book and I am not big on classes whose power is completely derived from objects.

Psychic- I like the class though not flavorful as the others. It needs more types of disciplines to flesh it out.

Spiritualist- My second favorite class in the book and it adds a new companion mechanic as well. I like the concept, abilities, and it's spell selection.

I haven't yet made a character concept with the Occult classes, but I do have some thoughts:

Kineticist: Love the idea, but the Burn mechanic seems like a horrible hack, even if it turns out to be balanced in power. Also, the (non-)replacement for Burn for the Overwhelming Soul archetype makes it Underwhelming.

Medium: Seems highly dangerous to the user, maybe even more so than the Alchemist. I'll second the motion for fleshing out the Harrowed Medium that was in the Playtest, although this is so different it might need to be an alternate class instead of just an archetype.

Mesmerist: Seems overpowered, but not to such an extent that it wouldn't be easy to fix. Give targets of Hypnotic Stare a Will Save to recognize that they are under Hypnotic Stare, and I could call it good.

Occultist: Cool concept. Divine archetype also looks cool, although I haven't done any careful balance analysis.

Psychic: Needed concept, but feels like Psychics are meant mostly for interacting with each other in a separate world, and Psychic Duel seems like something that only Psychics can really do, so if you're up against a Psychic, you need to have a Psychic of your own.

Spiritualist: Cool concept, but the different Spirits seem rather uneven in quality.

Occult archetypes of non-Occult classes: Sorcerer Psychic Bloodline really should have been an archetype, like Id Rager archetype of Bloodrager. Mindblade Magus and Psychic Detective (Investigator) seem about right at first glance5. I might have missed a couple of others. Would have liked to have seen Psychic archetypes of Inquisitor and Witch.

Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Kineticist: I enjoyed playing an undine hydrokineticist in a one-off game, but I did find that the class was complicated to keep track of.

Medium: I am thinking of playing a Spirit Dancer Medium in my next campaign. The Medium in that one-off game was an impressive melee fighter -- but I would really like to see how one works out in campaign play assuming different roles. Note that incurring enough influence to lose control of your character is strictly voluntary -- the only involuntary way to incur influence is by breaking a taboo, and accumulating 5 influence that way causes you to lose your spirit (and thus your power), not your own free will.

Mesmerist: The iconic for this one biased me -- this class seems to make a better villain than hero.

Occultist: Looks even fiddlier than the Kineticist but not as fun.

Psychic: Looks like a Sorcerer variant with a modified spell list. I think we will have one in our party in our next campaign.

Spiritualist: I have already played a Summoner, and this does not really look different enough to interest me. I suppose I might consider playing the Ectoplasmist archetype if I am in a group that has other essential roles covered.

Dragon78 wrote:
Mesmerist- I like this class, it's like the spiritual successor of the beguiler but much more interesting. I really love it's hypnotic stare and touch treatment abilities.

I wholeheartedly disagree with this. The mesmerist really misses the feel of the beguiler, but that's not an issue because the mesmerist was meant to be its own thing. If you're looking for something that fully embodies the spirit of the beguiler check out this conversion, it's incredibly fun to play.

Silver Crusade

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I've had a hard time getting into the occult classes. A lot of my interaction with Pathfinder is through APs that were written before occult adventures existed, so occult PCs seem tacked on and not considered. (You know, because they weren't.) Which is pretty much how I feel about psychic magic in general. "Oh, yeah, you've been playing around in Golarion for nearly 10 years now, and you've never heard of psychic magic, but really, it's been here all along." I'd like it better if it was less effort to back-integrate it.

That said, the occult classes do have some neat tricks. There's a psychic playing in my Skull & Shackles game, and she can do some neat self-heals and uses murderous command to great effect. I personally have an idea for an occultist that I'd like to execute, though every time I think about building it, I look at the class and say, "Nope, too complicated to deal with right now."

I think I'm turning curmudgeonly. The ACG was like, "Oooh, fun new classes to me!" And Occult Adventures was like, "Do we need these?" And the vigilante makes me want to flip a table. So... power to the people who still love new classes.

I feel like I need a PhD to understand Occult Classes.
There's so many things, you have to read 10 times more than a normal class, and you're not even sure if you're optimizing decently.

I tried to get into them, but wasn't able to. And APs usually are ran with 15 pt buy, but most of us use 20, which makes classes already more powerful

Eliandra Giltessan wrote:
I've had a hard time getting into the occult classes. A lot of my interaction with Pathfinder is through APs that were written before occult adventures existed, so occult PCs seem tacked on and not considered. (You know, because they weren't.) Which is pretty much how I feel about psychic magic in general. "Oh, yeah, you've been playing around in Golarion for nearly 10 years now, and you've never heard of psychic magic, but really, it's been here all along." I'd like it better if it was less effort to back-integrate it.

Actually there were regions of golarion that were known for psychic magic before pathfinder was even a roleplaying game. Vuldra especially iirc.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

My wife is mesmerising, does it count?

Still haven't checked any of them out, I find new paizo subsystems tedious. Also kinda burned out on checking new classes at all if I'm not going to play them (and currently they are not an option).

Kineticist: I've been playing a geokineticist in a fairly slow-running emerald spire campaign since the playtest and I've enjoyed it quite a bit. Especially impressed by how the different elements cater to different playstyles, and just how much expanded element expanded my tactical options.

Medium: I was super hyped for the playtest version and its ability to bind spirits in sequence for cool combos. Really let down by the finished product. It's competent, but I'd likely stick to one spirit through most of the campaign and then what's the point? Quite possibly my least liked class in the game as it stands.

Mesmerist: Recently got to play this after retiring an old cleric of mine. I really like playing debuffers and the spell-list and the cool and varied lass abilities really appeals to me. It's much more interesting than what I initially though when the classes were announced, and it's my new favorite class, period.

Occultist: Really like the flavor, and the mechanics seems fine if a bit hard to get into. It's on my to-play list, but that list is quite long as is.

Psychic: I understand the need for this class to be a thing, but I'm just not all that excited for another full-caster when presented alongside more mechanically interesting classes.

Spiritualist: Not a fan of pet-classes, so I've barely even looked into this one.

SylverFox wrote:
Dragon78 wrote:
Mesmerist- I like this class, it's like the spiritual successor of the beguiler but much more interesting. I really love it's hypnotic stare and touch treatment abilities.
I wholeheartedly disagree with this. The mesmerist really misses the feel of the beguiler, but that's not an issue because the mesmerist was meant to be its own thing. If you're looking for something that fully embodies the spirit of the beguiler check out this conversion, it's incredibly fun to play.

That link doesn't work . . . .

UnArcaneElection wrote:
SylverFox wrote:
Dragon78 wrote:
Mesmerist- I like this class, it's like the spiritual successor of the beguiler but much more interesting. I really love it's hypnotic stare and touch treatment abilities.
I wholeheartedly disagree with this. The mesmerist really misses the feel of the beguiler, but that's not an issue because the mesmerist was meant to be its own thing. If you're looking for something that fully embodies the spirit of the beguiler check out this conversion, it's incredibly fun to play.

That link doesn't work . . . .

That's quite odd, it was working when I posted the message. This link should be working.

I've played a Psychcic and a Kineticist personally and seen a Mesmerist at the table.

Psychcic- It plays as an extremely focused archetype of Sorcerer. It's spell list is alright with at least a few options for spells at each level that will likely apply to any given situation.

Kineticist- I love the concept of the class but have been suffering through actually playing one. The class doesnt have much support from Paizo yet and currently feels like there are only two "right" ways to build for each element, your stats, feats and powers will be predetermined by your choice of starting element and if you want to be melee or ranged, Despite supposedly being so free with its feats there is actually very little choice to be made with the class.

Mesmerist- Its an alright counter part to the bard. There are a few tricks they can pull that are situational but fun. For most players going with a Bard will accomplish much the same goal.

Well the kineticist is an odd ball class since it doesn't have the plethora of options available since most classes are martial and/or spell casters. So it can't take advantage of the many, many feats, spells, and equipment that would help most other classes. This wouldn't be so bad if next year we were getting more class focused books but instead we are getting a codex and new game system. I doubt Horror Adventures will have a lot of kineticist stuff, at least not as much as I would like to see anyway.

Speaking of Horror Adventures, the occult classes hopefully will get a lot more love in general since they can fit horror themes well.

Kineticist - Ah, Kineticist! I really, really like kineticist, if only because it's the only class currently in Pathfinder that makes your constitution matter for more than your hit points and saves! Add in the sheer tankiness that is Earth/Aether Kineticists, and the extremely low number of feats you need to round out your class abilities, and you're set! Sure, some people may dislike Burn, but I think it's a nice new mechanic to help level things out somewhat.

Medium - I'll give Medium this much: It's really flavorful. It's not really good, but it is flavorful. Most of the spirits are rather underwhelming, and it can be difficult to get some of them at times. Then there's the super-situational class abilities, like the one that lets you counter haunts. Really, it's just not something I have room for in most of my campaigns.

Mesmerist - Much like the Kineticist, I love the Mesmerist. I will gladly admit that most of this comes from Painful Stare and Psychic Inception, however. But woo boy, Psychic Inception alone makes this an incredible class. Though I am somewhat biased to like Enchament spells, so....

Occultist - And this class is a bit... Much. It's not really imbalanced or the like, from what I can see, it's just really a bit complicated for my tastes. I still don't fully understand the class, and its complexity has chased off more than a few of my players as well.

Psychic - It's another full caster, with some additional goodies. Since I tend to ban most full casters anyways, I really don't care about this class.

Spiritualist - Hello, best 1 level dip class ever! Two skill focus feats, a +4 to most will saves you need to roll, and the ability to shunt a dominate into the phantom you'll never summon as a dip anyways?! F!&& yeah, that's worth the dip for any martial out there! As a stand-alone class, though? ... Eh. It's not horrible, but I'd prefer it as a dip regardless.

SylverFox wrote:

{. . .}

That's quite odd, it was working when I posted the message. This link should be working.

So I'm not the only one who has problems with links and formatting going from apparently working to non-working . . . Anyway, this one works -- it points to the thread of which the first post indirectly links to conversion (updated all the way through Ultimate Intrigue) of a 9/9 arcane caster with spontaneous casting with expanded number of spells known and partial Arcanist-style hybrid prepared/spontaneous casting, d8 HD, 3/4 BAB, 2 good Saves, and eventually the ability to bypass all spell resistance with some setup. So I think it goes to the right place . . . .

Class I've played - Medium
I have one character that is multi-classed by has 4 levels of medium marshal spirit. I really see this class as a pick one focus and stick with it class. The Champion seems interesting though and I'm wanting to try it out sometime.

Classes that I think I'd like to try out - Kineticist, Occultist
Occultist seems like a fun option for a smart magical fighter that would have quite a different feel from the magus.
Kineticist just seems cool, though it does start off slow.

Kineticist - I like the class, but I have a hard time getting over how the Burn mechanic ended up being implemented.

Medium - I like the idea but it doesn't seem to bring a whole lot to the table. I've never had the opportunity to play one, though.

Mesmerist - The mechanics are cool but I feel like it has a hard time standing up. I've never been big into the enchantment though.

Occultist - My absolute favorite of the classes. A huge amount of build variety, free full-plate in an archetype, and the ability to play a pawnshop hero are all big pluses.

Psychic - meh

Spiritualist - WIS based summoner? I don't know, the closest I ever got to playing one was an Id Rager.

Occult Classes and my gaming group moving into Pathfinder are what have really gotten me into Pathfinder. And I feel like off the back of them I have started to build a reputation for knowing what I am doing with the Kineticist which I hope to expand into proper 3P works. I currently have a few projects in fact which should see publication.

I, unfortunately, haven't gotten to play most of the Occult Classes. Though, I am playing a Psychic Bloodline Sorcerer and I have found it to be quite potent. I'm actually rather glad it is not an archetype as Crossblooded shenanigans have abounded. The GM elected to let Crossblooded stack with other archetypes in the way suggested in the FAQ about Wildblooded. So, I have been getting away with a Psychic/Kitsune (Everyman Gamer) Tattooed Sorcerer with Words of Power that picked up Cunning Caster.

Psychic casting has really been more flavorful to how I envision casting in general. It's so primal, I'm actually rather sad I can't do WoP another way than Psychic Sorcerer as the two mix thematically. But, the Psychic spell-list does look really cool and Undercasting gives you some of the WoP advantage into your games. I can say for certain if I make another full caster it will be Psychic. I'm actually rather looking forwards to that. But, I want to see a few more options for Psychic first.

Mesmerist I like in terms of tone and idea. Enchantment and Illusion are always my go tos. However, I just keep wondering why I wouldn't play a full caster instead. I suppose the answer to that is Psychic Inception, but the idea they can shake of my spells for a round and suddenly my new buddy is an enemy again... I'm not sure. This is one of those classes that is on my radar, but just missing that little nudge to get me into it. If you just copy and pasted the Kitsune Sorcerer FCB then a Kitsune Mesmerist would be really cool.

I also really like the theme of the Fey Trickster. But, the spell list... I find it really weird they can't keep one illusion or enchantment spell from every level on their list. Do they qualify for the Fey Spell feats? Even if yes, that's a feat tax for a Mesmerist to become a Mesmerist... I really don't like that even though I love everything else about the archetype. It's something I would very must consider playing if I felt like I was too married to illusion and enchantment. But they are the best spells so. :p If a race like Catfolk get a FCB for adding an additional illusion and enchantment at a level they can cast and it worded so that Fey Trickster can cheat in those spells I would love it.

Actually, wait, are Catfolk terrible? What is the casting stat of a Fey Trickster??? If they cast in JUST the same way as a Hunter it's Wisdom right? But, Fey Veil and Mesmerist Tricks are Charisma based. It really feels like it should be Charisma based casting... Being mixed stats AND lacking illusions/enchantment makes this one a tough sale. I would be fine with mixed stats being the cost of getting those illusions and enchantments though. Even though that would restrict me from Catfolk. (Sad day.)

Occultist is a short squat Wizard. It gets a lot more abilities and powers at the cost of being only up to 6th level. If the Wizard is an Elf the Occultist is a very portly Halfing. If you like playing Wizards, but want to be broader instead of have the best spells in the game, play an Occultist. Ultimately, the restrictions of spells on your list and spells learned means I have no interest. In our home games magic items are usually more random and I hate trying to keep track of all that junk. That makes this a decisive no for me. But, I never really liked the preparation of the Wizard anyways.

Spiritualist isn't hard to grasp. You are a summoner/hunter with a Phantom instead. And Phantoms are, well, pretty cool. It's kind of a shame there isn't that much for Phantoms right now, but it's a good gimmick. Show me more, I'm interested.

Speaking of, I really love the Shadowdancer idea and they do have possibly the best "Let's make Shadowdancer obsolete" archetype. I never really cared so much for the Shadowdancer's shadow, but I have to admit it does a good job nerfing the only overpowered part of the Shadowdancer (str damage) while making the terrible parts playable. My one disappointment is that it doesn't feel very dancery. I think I might skip on this one if I play spiritualist, as much as I love shadow stuff. That's fine though as base spiritualist looks really fun to me.

Medium, I just don't get. I haven't seen one. I don't care. It's just... I don't really understand how this can be strong and I don't see anything that makes me want to understand.

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

The Kineticist is cool. Has balance issues and its design makes it hard to expand, but it's thematically pretty cool and solid enough.

The Medium has an awesome concept on paper but doesn't execute it well. A bunch of the spirits just aren't very good and ultimately because you're still limited by ability scores and feats you aren't going to be as flexible as the class pretends it is.

So more often than not you're just going to use one spirit, maybe two in special circumstances, and call it a day.

Mesmerists are awesome. Cool mechanics. Nice themes. Very solid 6th level caster all around.

Occultist is also great. Has some issues with how narrow its spell list is, but it's really fun and unique but not nearly as complicated as many people seem to think it is.

Psychic - I really want to like this class but I wish they'd done more with it than just make it a variant sorcerer. It's also got a pretty narrow focus in its spell list that I'm not a huge fan of. Not a bad class and the huge number of exclusive spells is fun, but still feel like it could have been more.

Spiritualist - Necromantic spin on the Hunter. Awesome. Very fun class. Phantoms have nice mechanics, solid spells. The casting stat seems weird to me, almost feels like it's Wisdom based just because they didn't have a wisdom based Occult class.

Runs into some worrying issues where there are certain spells and archetypes that have different effects based on your spirits and those options have not been expanded with splatbooks though, which sucks.

I'd like to see more archetypes that expand what you can do with the phantom and on the flip side I'd like to see an archetype that marginalizes the phantom in favor of the Spiritualist's spells, because hey, we don't really have a battle necromancer yet. All in all good stuff.

Kineticist: Great class! You can finally have a character built around telekinesis rather than tacking it on as a mid-level spell. All the elements really allow for a lot of concepts, and it's fun to walk around with such a great fortitude save and pool of hitpoints. Not many class skills, but the ones it has are good. Playing an Aerokineticist right now, building towards being able to slowly suffocate people at will while hovering out of reach.

Medium: My expectations from the awesome Harrowed Medium in the playtest made the class a bit of a let-down for me, but I've started seeing more uses for it (especially with the feats it's gotten. Its primary roll as a martial class means it's not a great fit for my play style, but the flexibility is great for always being able to contribute.

Mesmerist: Another great class. Targets will saves with the DCs of a full caster, gets a great selection of spells, and has Touch Treatment to prevent being locked out of casting. Tricks and stare improvements are gravy, and Painful Stare means you can contribute something to combat. Wish we had a selfish archetype to get multiple tricks in themselves, or even better, a feat. Never end up playing one, though, because Psychic is so good.

Occultist: An interesting take on spontaneous casting. It's not quite up my alley, but I'm thrilled to have a more interesting option than Intensified Shocking Grasp Magus for gishes. I had a build, but Psychometrist Avenger Vigilante won my heart over with full BAB. A player has one, and the flexibility provided by implements is indespensible and keeps him "casting" for the full adventuring day.

Psychic: Everything I wanted from Sorcerer. Rebirth is so great I have trouble using the other options. One flexible spell makes spontaneous casting so much better! Still, Pain and several others are really nice. Int based full caster that has good class skills is also a pleasant change.

Spiritualist: The archetypes really help this, since casting stat variations are nice. Phantom is strong utility out of the gate, but doesn't do a lot in combat other than soak damage. Still, all the emotions means it supports lots of playstyles, and the feat to use spells to change the emotion temporarily makes it a blast.

Most of my characters are Occult classes now. I only venture out for pure martials, animal companions, and stuff that's lifting occult class material to another class.

Havent really used most of them yet, pretty much only one got my attention enough that i decided to use it instead of the other previous classes.

Spiritualist: Im a fan of all pet classes and favor them over the others, even more because i never play a PC without a companion, be it a familiar,AC...

Found this class fun to play, OUTSIDE combat, i havent managed to create even a single decent combat spiritualist, mostly mine manage only to deliver weak debuffs or do subpar damage compare to others after we level up a few levels.

Still use the class if i believe my team can "carry" my PC through the fights haha.

QuidEst wrote:
Psychic: Everything I wanted from Sorcerer. Rebirth is so great I have trouble using the other options. One flexible spell makes spontaneous casting so much better! Still, Pain and several others are really nice. Int based full caster that has good class skills is also a pleasant change.

I've been looking at that one a lot... Trying to decide if it is actually worth it. What I find really weird is that it says when you prepare spells, but you don't prepare spells? I guess that means you can always wait to find out what you need and spend an hour getting it. Alternatively, maybe that qualifies you for Magical Epiphany and you can worship Nethys to be able to get any spell you want as a Standard action.

Speaking of, I wonder if you can take Versatile Spontaneity as a psychic. I can't see a reason RaW why not. You just don't happen to need to meet prerequisites because psychic isn't included in there.

I dunno, I'm torn between that and Shadow right now. Wisdom and a better selection of abilities besides from that one is very tempting. Plus, the Shadow spells are good flexibility and getting those spells from the Darkness domain while regening phrenic points is nice.

I always prefer Cha over Wis, and I'm using it to grab unshadowable spells like Rope Trick or the Possession line. In your case, Shadow is probably a good fit unless you wanted some specific spell.

My relationship is one of love and understanding.

Kineticist: It's the most original idea Paizo's had in a long while, which is why I'm sad to see it feels like they were way too cautious with it. The concept is very interesting and I really want to like it, but I really wanted to play an airbender more than Firestarter, and I am not a fan of the whole "cast from hit points" thing Burn's got going on. The class is also annoyingly complicated to level up. Feels like it needs a lot of system mastery to play at all well but will otherwise have serious performance issues.

Medium: Another interesting concept but feels like you're a little too at the GM's mercy. It kind of annoys me that when Paizo finally responds to my complaint that magic is too easy, consistent, and safe, they use it to punish the two more outside-the-box classes in this book while leaving the ones that don't try anything new untouched.

Mesmerist: It's a pretty nice class. I initially just scoffed at it as a bard with the serial numbers filed off, but they're similar but different in ways I've come to appreciate more over time. Overall I like it.

Occultist: Didn't care for it at first, but it's quite a nice class once you get used to it, and I've come to really like it since. The implements system and their powers is pretty clever and it comes across as having a lot of the feel of a wizard without being nearly as game-breaking. Probably the best class in the book.

Psychic: Boring. Didn't feel it deserved to be as pushed as it was, but then it is the 9th-level caster so of course it was.

Spiritualist: Seems pretty inoffensive, but no play experience with it. Would probably stick to Hunter for a wisdom-based pet class.

QuidEst wrote:
I always prefer Cha over Wis, and I'm using it to grab unshadowable spells like Rope Trick or the Possession line. In your case, Shadow is probably a good fit unless you wanted some specific spell.

I actually almost always go for Cha over Wis. The Storm Druid I'm still working on for a game being the one exception. For obvious reasons, but even then they have 13 Cha. (Granted, my worse roll was a 12 that went into int. XD ) But Samsarans are just so perfect for a Psychic and Student of Philosophy makes it really hard not to go for that on an Int based caster. I'm not sure what would be as good a race for a Cha based Psychic. There's some races like Catfolk and Sylph I've been wanting to play I could shoehorn in, but nothing that really stands out to be as exemplary. Though, I guess I could just play Samsaran and be without the +2 in the right stat.

While I am familiar with how most of the classes function, I really only have experience with the Mesmerist. Played through levels 3 to 12 so far and I can say without a doubt that it is one of the most adaptive classes I have ever used..

The direct and indirect support you give your party is significant. You can take any encounter with a single main threat and turn it into a joke. You can debuff attack, saves, SPELL RESISTANCE, SPELL DC'S... ALL WITH A SWIFT ACTION.

The Mesmerist tricks let you bring a great deal of defensive power to bear without eating up your action economy! I can't tell you how many times Mesmeric Mirror has saved my team mates a thrashing.

And I haven't even gotten into Touch Treatment being able to straight up remove conditions that would otherwise have led to a world of pain. It's like having an extra ten spells of 'remove x or y or z' without having to expend your spell slots.

Suffice it to say this class is now one of my all time favorites. Right up there with Druid, Barbarian and Magus.

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Kineticist Definitely one of my favorite classes, it's a shame Paizo hasn't done much to support it...even just including two or three new wild talents in a few player's companions since Occult Adventures would help a lot. Fortunately, third party to the rescue. Even restricted to Paizo, I like them, though.

Medium Not really interested...the playtest version was a lot more interesting to me, the published version is eh. I'll stick with Radiance House's update of the binder over this one, sadly.

Mesmerist Love 'em. Action-wise they're pretty slick, swift action hypnotic stare, free action mesmerist tricks, and either move and a spell or attacks. Plenty of skill points, they're helpful to allies, debilitating to enemies, and have a nice selection of tricky spells. Was never able to get into the bard, but the nega-bard mesmerist was definitely a hit for me.

Occultist Haven't played this one, but they seem pretty cool. Kind of a different take on the wizard archetype, I like the flavor at least, and unlike the actual wizard, I can see myself playing it.

Psychic Haven't played one of these either, but they seem nice enough. A spontaneous full caster with some various tricks, but Intelligence-based, which seems nice for the skill points. Not super-interesting, but would play one.

Spiritualist Ehhh. I generally prefer summoners, which can have similar flavor. I do think their spell list is a bit interesting as a healer, and the phantom is kind of thematically interesting, but lacks much customization, and I can still use similar flavor with eidolons...hell, Ultimate Campaign even had a background for summoner that worked similarly. I could see myself playing one, maybe, if I wanted to be a more healy summoner, though spirit summoner with a life spirit would probably be higher priority...

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

After a few months to digest the new mechanics and tinker with some concepts:

Kineticist - Pretty solid; not as good at pure damage as a dedicated archer, but few characters are; has some nice tricks and utility; the additional material in Occult Origins (Void and Wood elements) helps, but the class could stand a bit more support.

Medium - Shrodinger's adventurer; basically able to take on almost any role, with one day of preparation; in many campaigns (especially one with a lot of travel) it will probably be best to take the relic channeler archetype to focus on a few specific choices for each spirit; excels as an item crafter (having access to the cleric list when channeling a hierophant spirit or the sorcerer/wizard list when channeling an archmage spirit); some flavorful support on channeling specific spirits from Golarion's history; if anything, this class may have too many options, resulting in analysis paralysis.

Mesmerist - For everyone who wanted to play a real trickster; very well designed as a debuffer with some unique ways to shape combats using mesmerist tricks; even weapon damage gets a boost with Painful Stare; well supported with additional archetypes and other options.

Occultist - A lot of potential in this class; the mental focus and focus power mechanics take a bit of effort to absorb, but this is sort of a more metal version of the investigator; in effect, the class receives two types of "spellcasting" between actual spells and the focus powers; the resonant powers provide long-term bonuses, as well; the available archetypes are very flavorful and the examples of unique implements are generally well done; with a bit of effort, this class could be made to fill the "artificer/gadgeteer" niche that many wanted out of the alchemist.

Psychic - The pure caster of psychic magic; in some respects, I think this class would work better in a campaign without other 9-level casters; on the other hand, it does a better job of filling the "mentalist" role than a sorcerer, witch, or wizard; the disciplines and archetypes really emphasize the esoteric nature of psychic spellcasting; some very interesting support material (love the psi-tech stuff in Occult Realms).

Spiritualist - Similar in some respects to the summoner and the hunter, but less combat focus and more utility; the Shared Consciousness and Bonded Manifestation abilities also mean the phantom can contribute even when it isn't performing its own actions (not to mention attracting less attention, while still being readily available); a wide range of support material and options.

For me, the OA book is such a heartbreaker. They had some great ideas in the book but the execution for the most part is just poor. Kineticist, Medium, and Occultist stand out as classes that were nearly great, but crippled by bad design choices.

Medium: First, Guardian and Champion should've been combined, they each feel like half of a martial class. Next, the channeling should've followed the mechanics of the druid; x times per day you can switch spirits, but it takes an hour and you give up a point of influence. As it stands, the class is really bad.

Occultist: Great flavor, but crippled by a horrible spell selection and magic advancement system that basically takes away your ability to pick the spells you want. On top of that, the absence of any swift action buffs means that you will be useless in combat unless you have 3 rounds to pre-buff. Just bad design choices all around on this class. Otoh, aura sight and object reading are awesome, but not enough to overcome their weaknesses. Stuff like Legacy Weapon and Aegis should be swift actions, that would actually make the class playable.

Kineticist: Ugh, where do I even begin? Poor damage or poor accuracy, pick your poison. Also, lack of wild talents means you don't have any meaningful choices, and the vast majority of the existing talents are awful. Also, Burn. Just such a sad, disappointing class.

The only one that I've had a chance to play is the Kineticist, and I have to say I cannot possibly be more happy with it. I was one of the biggest supporters of the burn system in the beta and I'm still a supporter of it now, I vastly prefer it over arcane pool style systems where there is a hard limit on how many resources you can spend.

The Occultist is one that I gave up on early in the beta, but I'm really happy with the way that it turned out; focus powers are incredibly good, so much so that the poor spell selection is more of a limiter on what would be a class overpowered to the 9th level if it had a spell list more comparable to other classes. Really need to find a good chance to play one of these.

Can't really say too much about the others. The Psychic is great because it allows the Psychic Investigator to exist. The Mesmerist isn't really a style of play that I'm interested in. The Medium strikes me as the ultimate PFS class and... not much else. Spiritualist is pretty low on my list of classes to play.

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occultist.. it turned into a rant and i dont' want to take a giant space up:

Occultist: Pretty much the class I’ve always wanted. It can do many things and change as needed, spontaneous. Previously I really only played alchemists but now I’m really only going to play occultists. It has a lot of issues though—but not ones most people mention. I don’t think its complicated at all, it is more book keeping but not really that difficult after you notate what is what, and make a note on each of your normal “builds” (i.e. I have a melee/maneuver MF build and a Blaster MF build that I can switch between days. I just have all the changes written on a note and can easily switch in half a min or so). The main problem with the class seems to be…. They didn’t account of action economy and therefor “debuffed” many things because they probably tested the class with the buffs on. As my friend put it “It fell into the trap of more recent Pathfinder stuff, they’r reeling back from perceived power level upping, but they’re pulling back so hard it gimps sand makes things nearly unplayable in a lot of cases.”
The only issue I have is that so many of the buffs start as standard and will always remain standard. But I think it was built assuming you readily would have the buffs… Stuff like Legacy weapon, Aegis etc, those are all so similar to the magus’ weapon thing.. They should seriously be swift actions. Plus, in that situation I don’t know why you are limited to only one property; I don’t think the magus one limits to one? Really Magus is the closest similar class but the aims are different. But because of action economy of many of the tools of occultist, along with their duration, mean that most of the buffs that magus more or less automatically has is thrown out. Really soo much of what the assumption for legacy and aigis is that, “you can tailor it to the situation” which.. you can’t really. Not as a standard action. Not like a magus can. Really.. they should start as standard actions, become move actions and become swift actions eventually.

The spell list too has some issues. It limits some ones that really should be in this class and it has many buffing spells again (in any and all categories) which … really you won’t be using much unless you have a swift metamagic rod. Further the attack spell is pretty limited. There really should be an effective attack choice at each level.. Level one is fairly ok-but you really should have Magic Missle. It’s a staple of the game AND it seriously fits the flavor.. “Summon forth the pained memories of this item, fly forth!” summoning the pain of the past users to damage the targets with it. For the same reason level 2 really should have that Non Lethal Force damaging version of Scorching Ray. That would go a long way to fixing it.. Right now I chose Darkness for level 2 because there really was no other choice there for something that would be useful in all of time and DCs. I mean they touted that one could build a blaster occultist.. but really can’t, not unless you want to stay in super duper close proximity while your blasting.. which is more a gish thing than a blaster. And that could have been fixed with just adding 2 spells to the list. Just small finer things like that, making sure every spell level for every category has a chose for any given play style. Just doing that would have been great---The occultist doesn’t get many known spells so making sure what you can get fits your character is extremely important. But the spell list just doesn’t afford most main playstyles a choice. Leveles 1 and 2 just show it best. I think they really just chose those spells assuming “its magus like so lets give it shocking grasp and a small aoe, who cares about level 2 its just going to be metamagic’d”
So.. really either the legacy weapon/aegis like stuff should have been swift. Or there should have been a feat available to take at level 8 or 9 that would allow you to spend a single Mental Focus of the school in order to swift cast a level 3 or lower spell, then at a higher level can spend 2 for higher spell levels.
Stemming from that, and on the topic of Evocation school. I feel like that spell list assumes that you will be investing heavily in it and expects you to be using the abilities semi often.. But really most people won’t, and shouldn’t have to the point of the spells is to have access even if you aren’t focused in that implement. Further Evocation implement isn’t really that polished. The bonus for Mental Focus is kind of a joke. It should be a 1mf to 1 damage buff or it should relate to Dice somehow, either 2 MF for 1 damage per die, or more realistically (and even with other schools) 3MF to 1 damage point per die. This would line it up with most other implements and other classes. The main elemental damaing thing NEEDs more than 30 range, It should have more range as you level up.. Just give it the damn 25+ 5 per 2 levels that spells normally have! For Elemental blast.. why in the hell does it cost 2? That is too much for less damage than a fire ball and far far less range. Make it 1MF point. Other schools have some insane use spells that only cost 1mf and last much longer (mind eye, telekinesis, fly, etc). Really the less range and less damage equals out the element on command portion of the thing. No damn reason to penalize the cost. Shaping too needs a different cost. It should NOT cost 1 MF per square. It should be 1 mf per spell and up to INT squares spared. That is reasonable to what has already been established in the previous game.

Really.. the occultist is supposed to modular monster… but it limits too much to be able to do that reliably. You can mostly do it, but not as well as previously set examples Magus and Bard and Inquistor being the most similar to me. and honestly making it weaker is a bad design choice. Make it equal, the bag of tricks the occultist can do would equal out what the other classes can do-If only they could do those tricks properly. Without spellstirke, they’ll never be as spellsword as a magus-but if their buffs were swift action to apply to themselves they could do decent. They’ll never buff like a Bard, but if the buffs were scaled from standard to swift, then they could spend around (swift/standard) to bufgf up their allies equipments-making them a focused buffer instead of the Bard’s mass buffer. Just a few small changes would change the Occultist from a stalled used car to a new working car-isnt pretty or shiny, doesn’t do as well as speicality vehicles but it can do everything well enough.
As it is, it has a lesser form of “rogue” issue where its unpolished and unrealistic to real world scenarios. Like the rogue, which looks like it can do a lot of damage-and was balanced based off the idea that Sneak Attack, and many other things in theclass —but failed to account for real world situations, and such, the occultist looks like it has all these tricks and awesome stuff, and a lot of it is, but it literally can’t do even half of them in a reasonable fight or time-so the engine just makes a lot of noise but it doesn’t pull the load that it should.

TLDR: The occultist is the class I've always wanted, I love it and will probably mostly only play occultists when i have the option. But . It simply wasn't polished.Or at least it wasn't polished while thinking about the modularity the class is suppose to have. It seemed to be polished.. while thinking of other classes(either in comparison, or as if they only built that style of occultist) not itself.
The occultist just gets compared to the other classes too much and was hampered because of it. They either built it to avoid walking on others territory (lack swift action buff issue), or they built things because they just viewed the class as a psychic version of the class (a lot of the spell choices are very stinted to a magus like spell list and build). It needs to be better isolated and polished after that. The spell list needs to be expanded, while thinking about all the possible builds. The spells known is so small that the spell list needs to be big and varied enough that anyone has a valid choice at any level.. as it stands that really isn’t true (more so with Evocation than the others. This is basically the Magus spell list. The occultist isn’t limited to only being a CQC caster and in fact I think is more suited to being a long range spell slinger with melee abilities-or the reverse depending on the focus)
Mesmerist is also the class I’m super excited and have always wanted. Debuff central. Love it, but I haven’t played or built much so I can’t speak as to the class as much as the Occultist. The limited tricks is a bit of a pain-it feels like there should be an archetype or some sorta choice to put multiple tricks on just yourself, or always be able to put a trick in you and then one in some other person.

Kineticist: I love this one. Maybe it's weak, or so people seem to say, but I've never seen a Kineticist fail to be fun.

Medium: I like this one more for GMs than for players. A single Medium (of at least 2nd level) adds neat improvements to a dungeon as a whole.

Mesmerist: Is okay. Doesn't jump out to me as amazing, but isn't bad.

Occultist: I like the Occultist. Statting one is a bit complicated, but most of my experience with the class has been fun.

Psychic: Has been kinda boring, but I've only seen Psychics at levels 1 and 2, and I get the impression that it probably picks up later on.

Spiritualist: Haven't tried this one yet. No experience.

Kineticist: YES PLEASE :D ! My favorite class, hands down ^_^ Hey, wanna play a class with an AT-WILL scalable ability? Here ya go!

Medium: Would like it if it wasn't tied to specific locations... which you cannot easily find everywhere you go...

Mesmerist: Hmmm... I'm a bit unsure about a class which key ability cannot affect multiple targets at once... Wasting one use for each target seems rather pointless.

Occultist: While it might be difficult to get every item to be an implement, I really love the class and its relic hunter vibe.

Psychic: Bah... It's okay I guess... I'm not interested that much into full spellcasting classes...

Spiritualist: I get the general idea, but I feel like something is missing, like more emotional foci or something similar to evolutions. Should every Anger Phantom be the same? Not too sure about it...

Dark Archive

Kineticist Love the idea. Hate the burn mechanic, but hey, there's an Archetype that does away with it, and even another class Archetype that grants Kinetic Blasts, so I don't *have* to use burn!

Medium Eh. I like the idea, but I think I'd prefer one that channeled the gods or something (although the pantheon for Golarion is pretty large, and that would take a lot of wordcount...).

Mesmerist Reminds me of the Alchemist, in that it's got three really cool ideas shoved willy-nilly into a single class. I could play an entirely Stare-based Mesmerist *or* an entirely Trick-based Mesmerist, but as it stands, both options seem like half-measures, and then there's stuff like Touch Treatment, which I don't 'get,' and them not having access to the 'psionic attack/defense mode' spells, which I also don't get, since they seem thematically appropriate as all heck for this class.

Occultist Neither fish, nor fowl. Nor anything I'd want to deal with. I love versatility, in theory, but, it turns out, I totally prefer overspecializing... I embrace this hypocrisy.

Psychic Doesn't seem to have enough individualization to warrant it being something other than a new school of Wizardry or bloodline for Sorcerers or flavor of Witch.

Spiritualist I always thought the Summoner was a great 'chassis' to build other variants, like a 'Dread Necromancer' who had an undead Eidolon and more necromancy than conjuration, or a 'Shadow Summoner' who had a shadow eidolon and more illusion than conjuration, or even a 'Thrallherd' who replaced the eidolon with a perma-charmed minion, and had more enchantment than conjuration. The Spiritualist is just that seed bearing fruit. Cool.

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