Wall of Force and See Invisibility / True Sight


Rules Questions


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

Hi to everyone.
I'm a wizard with see invisibility on and i'm in front of a wall of Force...what happen?

Can i see the "invisible" wall the spell describes?
If yes..this block my line of sight now? Or is stille transparent?
If i have True sight on me instead of see invisibility something change?

If i still can see through the wall of force i have another question:
Another wizard is on the other side of the wall of force and cast on himself "invisibility"...
I can see him? See invisibility work through the wall? Same for True sight?

Thank you in advice for the answers.


I'd do it the same as when you use See Invisbility and see an Invisible Stalker or other innately invisible thing. Ie you see a fuzzy area. You can still see through the Wall, but know that there is an invisible wall there.

And See Invisbility works on yourself so you'd still be able to detect an invisible wizard on the other side.


"You can see any objects or beings that are invisible within your range of vision...."

I'd argue the Wall of Force is neither an "object" or "being," so would not be impacted by See Invisible in the first place. Wall of Force is a "force" effect, so is no more an object than is a Magic Missile.

That being said, Gilarius' interpretation is probably the best interpretation.


Thank you for the answers..i think, at this point, that there is no official description of what is "Force" and how is his aspect.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

So, someone with see invisibility wouldn't see another with mage armor or shield active because those are force effects, too?


Pathfinder Maps, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I would rule that you could see such magical effects under those circumstances, and that they would not block your line of sight.


Sticking with the object or creature line is probably safest. A wall of force (or mage armor or shield) isn't just an invisible wall (or shield or suit of armor) or a wall of material on the ethereal plane. You don't suddenly cast the spell and see gravity all around you, or see magnetic fields of force, or suddenly see the 'hostile force or tingle' from an otherwise 'invisible' spell or one without visible effects.

You don't see the ethereal wind on the ethereal plane any more than you see the normally invisible wind on the Material Plane, no matter how 'force'ful it is. You wouldn't see the area of effect of reverse gravity

There's a difference between invisible and 'invisible'. Is it easy to explain? Maybe not. Not being an object or creature is probably the easiest way to go with it, though. For instance, darkness isn't just invisible in a room when you turn the light on. You can't see it just because you have see invisibility or true seeing on. It's not some creature lurking in the light. A hellcat, on the other hand, in the same circumstance would have natural invisibility in a brightly-lit room. See invisibility would work in that case.


Watch the movie Predator.

That.... that's what 'see invisibility' does - it's about as good a way to explain it as anything.


Ckorik wrote:

Watch the movie Predator.

That.... that's what 'see invisibility' does - it's about as good a way to explain it as anything.

What part of the movie Predator explains see invisibilty? Because I can't think of one. You might have to be more specific.

If you mean the active camouflage of the Predator, that's not invisibility, that's more like displacement or blur. True seeing, however, would negate the miss chances of firing at a creature using that technology.

If you are referring to the predator's spectrum range of visual scanning, such as infrared or ultraviolet modes, that's still not really how see invisibilty works. Using infrared would negate invisibility certainly, as the spell does not otherwise hide sounds, scent, or thermal trailings (or footprints or spilled blood) but infrared wouldn't reveal an ethereal opponent nor does see invisibility say anything about how much body heat a creature or object needs to give off in relation to its effects. An invisible fire elemental and an invisible chair are just as noticeable to see invisibility. There may be visible waves of heat distortion near the fire elemental of course, but that's not relevant here (other than pointing out that those distortions wouldn't look any different under the effects of see invisibility or true seeing either.)

If you mean the part where Arnold Schwarzenegger was coated in mud and thus 'invisible' to the predator's vision, having see invisibilty wouldn't have helped either. He wasn't invisible, just outside the perceivable range of the predator's visual ability (like infrared and ultraviolet are to us). Certainly we'd say they're in the 'invisible' spectrum (in relation to us), but casting see invisibilty (or even true seeing) when you're outside doesn't blind you with a suddenly full spectrum of visible red and blue light.

Again, even in Predator 2, when the government trapped the alien in the Slaughterhouse, it couldn't see them (using infrared) because of their sealed suits. They weren't visible to his vision, but they weren't invisible. Luckily, one of his scanning modes allowed him to spot their beams of light from their flashlights and thus deduce their location. Even then, the light from the flashlights wasn't 'invisible' it was clearly visible (which is why the G-men were using it, to see in the dark), so see invisibilty would have been useless to the Predator. Similar to being red/green colorblind also wouldn't make red and green colors suddenly visible to you with see invisibility even if an invisible creature was wearing a red and green cloak.

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