Good wands for a non caster?


Advice


I have a rogue with a +11 to UMD and it's gonna go up as a level up. We got a magus and an inquisitor in the party but no other casters. I plan on using wands as plan b's, such as scotching ray and vanish (vanish is packing a caster level of 2 though.) Any other spells I should consider?


Burning Hands, or another level 1 area effect damage spell for the inevitable swarm. Bless Weapon, for dealing with evil outsiders and undead. Maybe a generic party buff like bless.


CLW surely!

Scarab Sages

A brief list of the first level ones I like....
Longstrider, keep watch, mage armor, magic missile(for run-aways and incorporeals), vanish(if you have an improved familiar that can wand, or wand to give a decent momentary buff to another character), protection from evil, endure elements and enlarge person.

There are plenty of good second level wands... but I'll just talk about the one.
Instant weapon will produce a masterwork weapon of your selection made out of force. This means it can harm incorporeal creatures without the miss chance or half damage.

Grand Lodge

Fairey fire!

Invisible enemies are a pain.

Grand Lodge

Do not forget Cure light wounds (5.5hp on avg. per charge) or Infernal Healing(10hp over 10 rounds per charge) as they give good healing for the cost. 15 gold a charge. The CLW can even be a attack vs Undead if need.

Dark Archive

Always handy to have:
* A form of healing (be it Cure Light Wounds or Infernal Healing)
* Something with combat purpose (Bless for simple buffing, Faerie Fire/Glitterdust for invisibles, Magic Missile, Stone Call, Scorching Ray for damage, Obscuring Mist vs ranged ambush/getaway)
* Something with out of combat purpose (Comprehend Languages, Endure Elements, Keep Watch)

Also some circumstancial ones: Kreighton's Perusal, Locksight, Pass without Trace, Speak with Animal, Commune with Birds (Tengu only) and Residual Tracking.

I myself are very fond of Residual Tracking. It is always fun to know exactly what you are tracking (visible gear and all), and the potential knowledge checks you can do afterwards. Really helpful with devising tactics and stuff. I'll admit it is a less useful spell if you never go for tracks and stuff.


HyperMissingno wrote:
I have a rogue with a +11 to UMD and it's gonna go up as a level up. We got a magus and an inquisitor in the party but no other casters. I plan on using wands as plan b's, such as scotching ray and vanish (vanish is packing a caster level of 2 though.) Any other spells I should consider?

You should seriously consider taking Vanish as a magical talent. along perhaps with prestidigitation or message for the requisite minor.


Heightened Awareness


Shield. If you can find the opportunity to use it before combat.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Lorewalker wrote:

A brief list of the first level ones I like....

Longstrider, keep watch, mage armor, magic missile(for run-aways and incorporeals), vanish(if you have an improved familiar that can wand, or wand to give a decent momentary buff to another character), protection from evil, endure elements and enlarge person.

Much that I use here. Also Shield and Reduce Person if you are an archer or come infiltration time


Did no one mention Grease? Because Grease. So versatile - disarm the baddie (okay, this one isn't super effective on a wand because of the really low DC but still it's an option), escape a grapple, cover your escape all with one spell!

Scarab Sages

Obscuring Mist is a good one. Its great for shutting down ranged attacks and providing cover for retreat or an ambush.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Swift girding is a nice one to have on hand. A great emergency spell for when there's a surprise attack on your camp, and all of your melee types are out of their armor... (Though scrolls might be better than wands here, since you're unlikely to need *50* charges of swift girding.)


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Mudball is the most powerful 1st level wand.

Scarab Sages

Dave Justus wrote:
Mudball is the most powerful 1st level wand.

It's useful to enable an ally rogue to sneak attack or to negate AoOs, but it's pitiful save dc means the blindness ends at the beginning of the target's turn.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Imbicatus wrote:
Dave Justus wrote:
Mudball is the most powerful 1st level wand.
It's useful to enable an ally rogue to sneak attack or to negate AoOs, but it's pitiful save dc means the blindness ends at the beginning of the target's turn.

Sure. But if you delay until after their turn, they are blind for all of your allies turns, with all of the negatives (more than you just mentioned).

I don't think you will find anything else offering comparable power.


Dave Justus wrote:
Imbicatus wrote:
Dave Justus wrote:
Mudball is the most powerful 1st level wand.
It's useful to enable an ally rogue to sneak attack or to negate AoOs, but it's pitiful save dc means the blindness ends at the beginning of the target's turn.

Sure. But if you delay until after their turn, they are blind for all of your allies turns, with all of the negatives (more than you just mentioned).

I don't think you will find anything else offering comparable power.

Also, don't forget that you can ready an action to cast mudball at an enemy during their turn, blinding them throughout any of their actions and for an entire round afterward - including your own next turn, which is perfect for a rogue.

Grand Lodge

if you run into a lot if undead a wand of disrupt undead is a good investment for 50 gp

Scarab Sages

grimdog73 wrote:
if you run into a lot if undead a wand of disrupt undead is a good investment for 50 gp

At low level yes. After level 5 or so there is always a better option you could be taking than spending a standard action for a 1d6 touch attack.

It does make for a fun way to detect undead though.

Sovereign Court

It depends on your budget of course, but consider that you can buy 6 level 1 wands for the price of a single level 2 wand; so a level 2 wand had better be really good to be worth it.

The only level 2 wands that I'd even consider would be: lesser restoration (sometimes you need to help everyone multiple times), admonishing ray (ranged nonlethal damage), scorching ray (ranged arson/damage) and invisibility (cloaking the whole party makes so much possible).

Level 1 wands worth it IMO are:

Cure light wounds
Cure light wounds
Cure light wounds

Alarm - 2H duration. Use it to make sure you're not surprised from behind when exploring somewhere you're not supposed to be.

Air Bubble - sometimes everyone needs underwater action, so a wand is a good way to scale up in a pinch. Make sure to affect yourself first so you can keep saying command words even underwater.

Blade Lash - a plausible combat spell

Comprehend Languages - although a few scrolls for your inquisitor also works.

Decompose Corpse - if the campaign warrants it

Deja Vu - moderately nasty lockdown. May cause GM frowny face. No save.

Endure Elements - when you need this, everyone else tends to need it at the same time as well

Enlarge Person

Faerie Fire - few classes have it on their spell list. Not needed if your friends can cast Glitterdust since that spell's bigger area is a big asset.

Feather Step - nice duration

Heightened Awareness - +4 bonus to initiative

Ill Omen - if an ally is fond of SoS/SoD.

Infernal Healing - if you're okay with the alignment. Even more efficient than CLW, but the longer casting times makes this less effective for stabilization.

Long Arm - good buff

Longstrider - good buff, great duration

Mage Armor - depending on class and how much you fear incorporeal enemies

Monkey Fish - duration is long enough to get somewhere

Mount - if you're in the sort of campaign where overland travel speed matters. Can be a backup plan if you're behind enemy lines and the alarm is raised.

Obscuring Mist - if the enemy is better at range that you are, change the rules of the game. That includes entrenched enemy archers, enemy casters with an unfortunate spell selection, and monsters that rely on reach and AoOs to be scary. But be careful not to let enemies use this as their cover to escape. It's good stop an ambush aimed at your party.

Protection from Evil - against enemy mind control for example. Or if the enemy likes summoned monsters.

Remove Fear - a PC that spends three rounds running away is also three rounds away from coming back to save you. Keep your friends close.

Shield - you have only so many actions available at the start of combat, so should you really use it on this? Only bother if it'll bring your AC high enough to make a difference. Otherwise it's better to avoid being attacked.

Silent Image - as long as you pick plausible images, people may never disbelieve them. Use it to make something to hide behind. Hide your ambushes.

Unseen Servant - pick up disarmed weapons, open doors from a distance, or many other things. Very versatile.

Unwelcome Halo - especially if you're a valid target yourself. An unusually low-level answer to darkness-spamming enemies.

Vanish - you can also make an ally invisible with this, allowing the ally to move around the battlefield without provoking. This one is worth buying at L2 to enable you to get into SA position as well, or to set up maneuvers without AoOs.

Scarab Sages

Alter Self is great for a level 2 spell for it's sheer versatility. It's an infiltration/disguise spell, a combat spell, a darkvision spell, and a breathe water spell all in one.


Imbicatus wrote:
Alter Self is great for a level 2 spell for it's sheer versatility. It's an infiltration/disguise spell, a combat spell, a darkvision spell, and a breathe water spell all in one.

The list just goes on and on:

Auto-detect nearby creatures, even if they're invisible.
Follow tracks by smell, even when untrained and taking 10.
Gain a +5 bonus on stealth checks.
Fit into small spaces.


Rogue eh?

My Gnome is a 2nd lvl Counterfeit mage. So far all he has are wands of Cure Light wounds, Endure Elements (too many jungle and Planet Hoth adventures have actually made it worth it) and leadblades.

Thing is ...he's also a 6th level polearm fighter so Leadblades works for him. Tis not everyone's pint of Dwarven stout but for the gnome that he is .... tis his. (2d6+13 damage, crits on a 19).

After this it's time for Protection from evil - for the will saves - and that's the lot. 4 wands and done.

In 2 levels time he gets a daily chosen wand that he gets to draw as a free action ...and works without a UMD check...as a standard action.
So other wands work for out of combat stuff - Leadblades for the no hassle casting and then walking up to the mob of baddies, giving it a bit of "come get some you lanky pants" and seeing if having 6 attacks of opportunity with a reach weapon (by that time 2d6+19 with crits at 17) has the minerals or not.

Others would go with Bull strength.
Some with shield.
Some with being Fantastic.
Or flying.

Pick all the out-of-combat fix wands you want, and then pick something flavoursome to your character: my gnome has a +4 chip on his shoulder about his small size. Leadblades and power attacking are his way of dealing.

So, if it's not too late...and your GM allows it ...and no one else can help ..and if you can find a mentor ..then maybe you can retrain as a Counterfeit Mage (dun de dun dun, dun dun dun ...)

Just retrain and go with the flavour.


Blade tutor's spirit is rather good for any martial that has consistent attack penalties, so TWFers and THFers. Little more expensive since you actually need to shell out for the higher caster level, but still reasonable for the benefit provided. Just get it crafted by a magus.


Invisibility can be handy.

Grand Lodge

I'll mention Faerie Fire again, invisibility is really annoying to have to deal with.


Mirror image is very nice for melee participants. Especially if you can get a higher caster level version; still pretty nice.


Huge thanks for all the suggestions. I'll be keeping a few of these in mind for when I come into money ingame.


Hum. I'm taking a lot of these suggestions for myself..
Out of curiousity. Is there something non class specific that improves wands? I know there are things like "staff like wand" wizard thing and a few magus arcana.
But any open ones?

Though I suppose VMC for magus isn't terrible anyway.


Harleequin wrote:
CLW surely!

Nah, get Infernal Healing instead. It's even in the Hell's Vengence player guide so you don't need any books.


deuxhero wrote:
Harleequin wrote:
CLW surely!
Nah, get Infernal Healing instead. It's even in the Hell's Vengence player guide so you don't need any books.

I would but this character is kind of a Caydonite and would never touch that spell unless it was the only way to keep a friend alive.


deuxhero wrote:
Harleequin wrote:
CLW surely!
Nah, get Infernal Healing instead. It's even in the Hell's Vengence player guide so you don't need any books.

Well they did release a good version called "Celestial healing"

Its from "Arcane Anthology" if you need a book reference, it does the exact same thing as infernal just good aligned.


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Dracoknight wrote:
deuxhero wrote:
Harleequin wrote:
CLW surely!
Nah, get Infernal Healing instead. It's even in the Hell's Vengence player guide so you don't need any books.

Well they did release a good version called "Celestial healing"

Its from "Arcane Anthology" if you need a book reference, it does the exact same thing as infernal just good aligned.

And much worse. Look at the duration.


Avoron wrote:


And much worse. Look at the duration.

Quite possible that Infernal healing will get the nerfbat in the future then perhaps?

The Exchange

Ghost sound and silent image can help you land sneak attacks if you get creative

Spider climb can let you get the drop on people (literally)

Grab a few scrolls of true strike for landing those important hits

Scarab Sages

Dracoknight wrote:
Avoron wrote:


And much worse. Look at the duration.
Quite possible that Infernal healing will get the nerfbat in the future then perhaps?

It's possible. If they reprint it Horror Adventures, or if ISWG gets a second printing, they could change the duration to match celestial healing.


Imbicatus wrote:
Dracoknight wrote:
Avoron wrote:


And much worse. Look at the duration.
Quite possible that Infernal healing will get the nerfbat in the future then perhaps?
It's possible. If they reprint it Horror Adventures, or if ISWG gets a second printing, they could change the duration to match celestial healing.

It's Celestial healing that needs errata. Currently, potions of Cure Moderate Wounds are more cost-effective than a wand of Celestial healing. Infernal healing could be reduced 50% and still be worthwhile, which means you are probably right that that they'll change it to be 95% less powerful.


I think Celestial Healing is OK as a potential option for arcane healing. The "free ride" with Infernal Healing has been nice, but if Paizo changed it I couldn't really complain too hard. It isn't like the cost of wands of CLW really cripples a party with standard WBL. On the other hand, tracking the charges is kind of a nuisance, so a more streamlined method of healing between combats without Channel Energy would be nice.

- Mirror Image is one of the best defenses in the game
- Touch of the Sea is cheap, and having a Swim speed can come in handy
- Frigid Touch stops full attacks from almost anything without SR (for better action economy you could use the wand to recharge Spell Storing armor and then efficiently choose which full attacks to stop as the need arises)
- If you can afford it, Glitterdust can be nicer than Faerie Fire in some ways
- For a Rogue I guess that Greater Invisibility is tough to beat though the cost could be a concern

As an aside, the "Scotching Ray" from the OP makes me think of a 0 level spell which protects carpets and upholstery.

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