Implementing Magic: VampByDay's guide to the Occultist


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PossibleCabbage wrote:
*shrug* The one time I played an Occultist, I didn't take Necromancy at all in 15 levels since it didn't really fit the character. You can do without it.

Of course, you can do without almost anything for keeping in a character concept. Just disliked how necromancy was shown no love when it's one of the more powerful options for melee, ranged, debuffers and casters. Undead minions to keep oponents away, give you tactical advantage, mitigate damage, deliver touch spells...

Also it's one of the only undead builds that are worth it in pfs since you can't keep them.


Hmm wrote:

Angelkin Aasimar have bonuses to Strength and Charisma, not it. Peri Aasimar have bonuses to Int and Charisma.

The only strength & int races that I know are Male Lashunta, some Skin Walkers and dual-talent humans.

Hmm

Ru-Shi Dhampir


How viable reliquarian archetype occultist?

Liberty's Edge

PhD. Okkam wrote:
How viable reliquarian archetype occultist?

It's not bad at all.

They trade a focus implement for a domain, and lose about as many focus points as they'd probably have invested in it anyway. What this means is...

+ Access to a whole bunch of spells Occultists can't normally get. Restoration Subdomain is an example of this.
+ Domain Powers are in line with the focus powers of comparable level.
+ Domain Powers have their own uses per day, don't use focus.

- If you see any focus schools as 'must-have', you're delaying them and getting less points to invest in them. So make sure you want that domain.
- Unless you're getting something like the travel domain you aren't getting both a resonant power and focus power right away. There aren't many good level 1 focus powers so you may be fine with this.
- You are forced to get all the domain spells from 1-6. You get less flexibility for spells chosen.

Overall, the archetype is a small cut in flexibility/efficiency for some unique options the Occultist doesn't normally see. It takes a little more fiddling with numbers and careful deliberation, but very often those domain options more than make up for the minor losses.


And what domain would advise melee occultist and archer occultist?


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PhD. Okkam wrote:
And what domain would advise melee occultist and archer occultist?

The Protection domain or Defense subdomain both have the advantage of granting you an automatic scaling bonus to resistances identical to the resonant power of the Abjuration school. If you aren't keen on a lot of the Abjuration focus powers, it's a strong alternative to give you a lot of Abjuration school spells with the resonant power (freeing up your cloak slot) without the need to invest focus in it.

Darkness (and some of the sub-domains) domain gives you some fairly interesting choices of spells, and also a free Blind-Fight feat at level 1. It's a bit trickier to find deities with this domain, though.

Travel is always strong, especially for melee. Access to some great spells, bonus to movement speeds, ability to bypass difficult terrain. Liberation can be similarly useful, but the spells are arguably weaker in a lot of cases.

War/Tactics has Weapon Master at level 8, which depending on how feat starved you are could be very useful. Spells aren't bad either.


PhD. Okkam wrote:
How viable reliquarian archetype occultist?

I almost created an reliquarian, but then I realized that although the spells are now divine, they are still intelegence based. With the number of mental focus points being wisdom based by everything else being intelegence, including the DCs of your focus powers, it requires too much.


That just means as a reliquarian, you probably don't want to be focusing on implements that allow/require saving throws. So stay away from Enchantment, Evocation, and Necromancy but the standard combat oriented Occultist wants Transmutation, Divination, Abjuration, Conjuration, and Illusion more than those implements anyway.


PossibleCabbage wrote:
That just means as a reliquarian, you probably don't want to be focusing on implements that allow/require saving throws. So stay away from Enchantment, Evocation, and Necromancy but the standard combat oriented Occultist wants Transmutation, Divination, Abjuration, Conjuration, and Illusion more than those implements anyway.

Or focus on spells with saving throws or care about bonus spells.

You are still an intelligence based caster. Saving throws and bonus spells are intelegence score based. Tge only thing wisdom based is the number of mental focus points you get.


From my experience, the thing you want more than absolutely everything is "more mental focus points". Last time I played an Occultist (vanilla) I had 34 MF points at level 15 and that wasn't nearly enough.

I guess I didn't *need* the 12 in Divination, but always-on "See Invisibility" and 60 feet of Blindsense is fantastic.


PossibleCabbage wrote:

From my experience, the thing you want more than absolutely everything is "more mental focus points". Last time I played an Occultist (vanilla) I had 34 MF points at level 15 and that wasn't nearly enough.

I guess I didn't *need* the 12 in Divination, but always-on "See Invisibility" and 60 feet of Blindsense is fantastic.

I agree. I just think it sucks in order to get a domain it costs making the stat that determines your number of mental focus points, not your casting stat.

How did you get 34 MF points?
Lvl 15=15
Extra mental focus (1 time feat)=2
Which would mean an intelegence of 44 or 45 for the +17 intelegence modifier.
Max in intelegence race is 20, +3 for level increases, +5 for max inherent bonus, +6 for headband of vast intelect, +3 for being venerable age. That is 37 intelegence. How did you get another 7 intelegence?

Scarab Sages

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Merm7th wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:

From my experience, the thing you want more than absolutely everything is "more mental focus points". Last time I played an Occultist (vanilla) I had 34 MF points at level 15 and that wasn't nearly enough.

I guess I didn't *need* the 12 in Divination, but always-on "See Invisibility" and 60 feet of Blindsense is fantastic.

I agree. I just think it sucks in order to get a domain it costs making the stat that determines your number of mental focus points, not your casting stat.

How did you get 34 MF points?
Lvl 15=15
Extra mental focus (1 time feat)=2
Which would mean an intelegence of 44 or 45 for the +17 intelegence modifier.
Max in intelegence race is 20, +3 for level increases, +5 for max inherent bonus, +6 for headband of vast intelect, +3 for being venerable age. That is 37 intelegence. How did you get another 7 intelegence?

I'm guessing elf, half elf, or halfling, FCB is +1/2 level to mental focus. Stupid good.


VampByDay wrote:
Merm7th wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:

From my experience, the thing you want more than absolutely everything is "more mental focus points". Last time I played an Occultist (vanilla) I had 34 MF points at level 15 and that wasn't nearly enough.

I guess I didn't *need* the 12 in Divination, but always-on "See Invisibility" and 60 feet of Blindsense is fantastic.

I agree. I just think it sucks in order to get a domain it costs making the stat that determines your number of mental focus points, not your casting stat.

How did you get 34 MF points?
Lvl 15=15
Extra mental focus (1 time feat)=2
Which would mean an intelegence of 44 or 45 for the +17 intelegence modifier.
Max in intelegence race is 20, +3 for level increases, +5 for max inherent bonus, +6 for headband of vast intelect, +3 for being venerable age. That is 37 intelegence. How did you get another 7 intelegence?

I'm guessing elf, half elf, or halfling, FCB is +1/2 level to mental focus. Stupid good.

I never noticed that. My occultists have been melee. I agree,that is stupid good.


VampByDay wrote:
I'm guessing elf, half elf, or halfling, FCB is +1/2 level to mental focus. Stupid good.

Yup, that's it. Certain races getting an extra 50% mental focus is just absurdly better than what any of the other FCBs are.

I also took the "extra mental focus" feat.


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cavernshark wrote:
PhD. Okkam wrote:
And what domain would advise melee occultist and archer occultist?

The Protection domain or Defense subdomain both have the advantage of granting you an automatic scaling bonus to resistances identical to the resonant power of the Abjuration school. If you aren't keen on a lot of the Abjuration focus powers, it's a strong alternative to give you a lot of Abjuration school spells with the resonant power (freeing up your cloak slot) without the need to invest focus in it.

Darkness (and some of the sub-domains) domain gives you some fairly interesting choices of spells, and also a free Blind-Fight feat at level 1. It's a bit trickier to find deities with this domain, though.

Travel is always strong, especially for melee. Access to some great spells, bonus to movement speeds, ability to bypass difficult terrain. Liberation can be similarly useful, but the spells are arguably weaker in a lot of cases.

War/Tactics has Weapon Master at level 8, which depending on how feat starved you are could be very useful. Spells aren't bad either.

I really like reach builds for Occultists, and the Nobility Domain can be very nice for a Reach Cleric style build. The Inspiring Word ability is great for buffing allies, and Divine Favor is a standard self-buff for Reach Clerics. The Luck Bonus will stack nicely with many of your Focus Powers.


Good to have some free Occultist guide out there. ;)


So looks like Occultist got a big power up in form of Panoplies ey?


Thanks for the guide! Are you still updating it periodically?

I suspect that the Trappings of the Warrior make the Battle Host no longer worth considering (since panoplies aren't available to that archetype, and since full BAB on a 2/3 caster is a pretty huge upgrade).

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