Your a level 20 wizard. You have three minutes to save the world.


Advice

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Charlie Bell wrote:

I think there are some faulty assumptions in some of the answers. 1) I seriously doubt there's an in-flight abort button somewhere. 2) Time of flight for most of these weapons will be substantially more than 3 minutes, so a 3 minute timeline means you can't simply destroy them at launch. You will be destroying them as they descend toward their targets, maybe even after MIRV warheads have deployed.

I also understood as part of the constraints that a) you didn't have unlimited time prior to the event to e.g., make simulacra, b) WBL wasn't a constraint, and c) no custom magic items, spells, etc. (which would also preclude time travel).

There certainly could be an abort button. If it receives the correct code (which would involve something known at the top plus something from the missile so simply stealing the code from the top does you no good) detonate the warhead incorrectly. It's blown to bits with no nuclear yield. The only additional equipment needed is the radio receiver.

As for the time of flight--they're going to go for a simultaneous launch to get maximum boom on target as quickly as possible. You're hoping to kill enemy units on the ground, you want a minimum warning for this.


Kobold Cleaver wrote:
Charlie Bell wrote:

There are essentially 2 methods. 1) stopping the nukes, 2) protecting the targets.

1) 15,000 nukes / 30 rounds = 500 nukes per round. Impossible under given parameters.

There is gate. Enlist the hordes of Heaven or Hell to save the world. Use Simulacrums to put up gates all over to evacuate the populace.

I'm sure there's some way to cheat gravity to move the earth itself out of the nukes' path, or vice versa. I'm not clever enough to find it.

Alternatively, place a web of gates in front of the missiles. That depends on how close together they are, though. If you have to put up one gate per missile, barring solar shenanigans, you aren't going to be able to pull it off in time. But if the missiles are clustered a little bit...

I've enjoyed every single comment here except the ones where the more obstreperous among us feel the need to complain about the scenario itself. Personally, I think Tacticslion has some of the most entertaining solutions, but there's a lot of fun stuff here. It's funny what you come up with when you actually try.

How many of those spells can you get off in 30 rounds? eliminating 30 missles out of 15,000 isn't going to accomplish much.


Timeless magic on a demi plane gives all the time we need.

Make a sim of The infernal duke. Recast timestop and make him go deal with the issue since he can leave while still under time stop.

Or make a time dragon and go back far enough to stop the launch.


Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
How many of those spells can you get off in 30 rounds? eliminating 30 missles out of 15,000 isn't going to accomplish much.
Mathius wrote:
Timeless magic on a demi plane gives all the time we need.

This, but you don't need simulacrum nonsense if you don't want it. As I described, you can get rid of the missiles yourself from a cozy timeless time stopped demiplane just by putting gates next to them and polymorphing them into tiny flecks of metal.

Alternatively, you could skip the polymorph any object and just make sure you put the gates directly in front of the missiles, like I believe Kobold Cleaver was suggesting. Just create a new, disposable timeless demiplane, refreshing it as necessary to finish casting gates in front of all the missiles. Then when the demiplane's duration is about to run out, you can simply dispel your own time stop. The missiles will fly through the gates into the demiplane, and the demiplane will immediately vanish, shifting you back into the material plane and eliminating the missiles permanently.


At least in some edition of 3.X, quarterstaves were free. This meant that by the crafting rules, creating them took zero time. Thus, just make quarterstaves. A virtually infinite number of them. The nukes will detonate and char the jigillion quarterstaves, but enough people will survive far below the surface of the new sea of wood. And hey, not even a wizard.


I would summon the goddess of time and then trade all of my levels and items for the ability to turn back time.

Que the intro theme for "Half-minute hero" and you have yourself a campagin!


I would start off with casting Time Stop. Overland Flight, Greater Teleport, and some high level summoning would get the ball rolling after the first Time Stop. Walls of Force to trap a few missiles in their launch silos, perhaps use Chain Lightning and Magic Missiles to disable/detonate other nukes in the upper stratosphere.

All else fails, a well timed broken Staff of Power or Bag of Holding/Portable Hole combo could result in a localized space that could shunt or absorb the resulting force of some nearer nuclear weapons.


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This thread.... is worthy of a year-long necro.

That's all I really have to say.


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Well, with Trompe L'oeil around, you can now have 83 Tiny, 80 Small, or 73 Medium sized copies of the Wizard at 20th level.

Or if you only wanted them to be 17th level, then 97, 92, or 83 respectively.

In terms of what you can get for around 12,000 gp or fewer, a Wizard with access to 9th level spell slots is pretty darn good.

Of course, it also gives us full strength access to things like Solar Angels, too, instead of half-strength simulacra.

Vagabond? wrote:
-You can cast spells on earth; After you finish casting spells, so can anyone else.

I'm slightly confused as to what this means. Does every human on the planet Earth get access to at least 1 spell slot of the appropriate level and knowledge of each spell that is cast during this exercise, like some kind of weird Sorcerer?

Or does it mean that any servitors that the Wizard had with them can only cast spells that the Wizard has already cast earlier in the exercise?


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Define save. Are we okay with surviving meaning alive but knocked back to making the Stone Age look advanced or ... ?
How much of the world actually needs saving?
How many of those 15,000 missiles do you really need to stop or do I save just New York, Beijing, Dehli and other population dense regions and oh well for the rest?
Does that 40% need only survive the initial blasts or must they survive all the catastrophic results of global thermonuclear war => climate change, warfare, starvation, etc. that will occur as a result of the initial blasts?

Putters off pondering the 3 minute window.


Kobold Cleaver wrote:
Charlie Bell wrote:

There are essentially 2 methods. 1) stopping the nukes, 2) protecting the targets.

1) 15,000 nukes / 30 rounds = 500 nukes per round. Impossible under given parameters.

There is gate. Enlist the hordes of Heaven or Hell to save the world. Use Simulacrums to put up gates all over to evacuate the populace.

I'm sure there's some way to cheat gravity to move the earth itself out of the nukes' path, or vice versa. I'm not clever enough to find it.

Alternatively, place a web of gates in front of the missiles. That depends on how close together they are, though. If you have to put up one gate per missile, barring solar shenanigans, you aren't going to be able to pull it off in time. But if the missiles are clustered a little bit...

I've enjoyed every single comment here except the ones where the more obstreperous among us feel the need to complain about the scenario itself. Personally, I think Tacticslion has some of the most entertaining solutions, but there's a lot of fun stuff here. It's funny what you come up with when you actually try.

Then that's not anything special a Wizard can do. Anyone who can get a message to a celestial could do that as that is essentially all that is happening.

"Celestial good guys, Earths in danger, can everyone with gate and teleport take a minute to help me out"


Kalvit wrote:

I would start off with casting Time Stop. Overland Flight, Greater Teleport, and some high level summoning would get the ball rolling after the first Time Stop. Walls of Force to trap a few missiles in their launch silos, perhaps use Chain Lightning and Magic Missiles to disable/detonate other nukes in the upper stratosphere.

All else fails, a well timed broken Staff of Power or Bag of Holding/Portable Hole combo could result in a localized space that could shunt or absorb the resulting force of some nearer nuclear weapons.

The think you greatly overestimate the range of effect of wizard spells and these effects and you haven't explained how you yourself would survive detonating one of these missiles.

Grand Lodge

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Summon some sort of planar creature who be mad at the Earth blowing up. Sort of like a telephone call.

"Uh, hi. Wizard here, your house is on fire. Yeah. Yeah. Mmmhm. No like there's all the bombs- ... Okay, sure well I can't really do anything except tell you. ... No I'm not allowed to use Wish ... No I mean I'm arbitrarily not allowed to ... are you dissing my build? Screw you then I have a demiplane I can chill in- forget you"

Liberty's Edge

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Before casting any spells etc., I think I'd probably set aside a few seconds to correct the grammar issue in the title ...


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Vagabond? wrote:

As listed in the title; You have 30 rounds to save the world from complete destruction. The entire nuclear arsenal of the world, fifteen thousand nukes, have been launched, and is directed to burn the world in fire. All your possessions, your demiplane, and everything you possess have been teleported with you.

If you do not save the earth, you cease to exist.

You only have to save 40% of the population.

Rules:
-No Wishes (Edit: Or miracles, or similar abilities).
-You can cast spells on earth; After you finish casting spells, so can anyone else.
-After this, gods, the planes, all of it applies to earth suddenly.
-No custom magic items.
-It actually doesn't have to be wizard, but wizard seems most applicable.
-DSP materials is available. As is Spheres of Power.
-Otherwise, follow RAW. Abuse the rules in any way you can to save the world.

If three minutes is not enough time, is 10? 30? What's the lowest amount of time you'd need.

You don't get to 20th level wizard by following the rules.........


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Quote:
The entire nuclear arsenal of the world, fifteen thousand nukes, have been launched, and is directed to burn the world in fire. All your possessions, your demiplane, and everything you possess have been teleported with you.

<a venerable blue/black-skinned and white-haired form, quite comfortable in his recliner and suddenly-transposed living room ensemble, takes stock of his new surroundings for a few moments before coming to the conclusion that no attacks are forthcoming against his activated Emergency Force Sphere>

"Who dares to play such tricks upon me?"

Quote:
If you do not save the earth, you cease to exist.

<the sylvan briefly runs mental calculations regarding the mass of a planetary body in comparison to the immolative capacity of the arsenal in question>

"That is highly unlikely, you excitable young thing!"

<he waves a hand, the hindering binds and wards of inferiors are removed, and his lamp and ottoman vanish; he smiles in knowing contentment>

"As you can see, I shall depart just as quickly as I wish, and not a moment later."

<eyelids lower slightly as dimensional anchors are reinforced around distant planar properties>

"You have not yet given me a reason to care. Do attempt to, and try not to assume that I am a summoned creature tasked to do thy bidding, for I am assuredly *not*."

<a bony hand absently strokes the muzzle fur of a bestial horror lounging comfortably beside the chair; it appraises you with glowing eyes that pierce the soul, and you grow cold as it seems to siphon life-energy>

Quote:
You only have to save 40% of the population!

<he begins laughing, at first a thin, reedy rasp, then gaining in volume and timbre until a full-throated chuckle>

"Given the fecundity of these mayflies, I am quite certain that if only a fraction of 1% survived, they would again be a seething swarm in only a few short centuries.

<he fishes a shiny rectangular object from one cashmere pocket and reading spectacles from the other; his fingers flit over the artifact, its surface sparkling with shifting colors>

"You may wish to better acquaint yourself with the history of these devices and their effects, particularly in the case of the two cities which actually were targeted and destroyed by them. These two designs, among the very first, were exceptionally inefficient and subsequently spectacularly 'dirty' in the amount of lingering toxins they spewed over the countryside. Nevertheless, humans...

<he pronounces the word with palpable disdain, as if a reagent scowling at the crumpled remains of a clumsy peasant who had stumbled under his horse>

"...survived within a few hundred yards shielded by stone walls and ceilings. They crawled out and began breeding straightaway! A few of their children were deformed, but most were not, and within scant decades there were three times as many of them as before!"

<he squints at the device again, and cackles anew>

"Ha! To this day they are still dwelling in wooden buildings in scorched climes, yet are unprepared when predictable conflagrations burn down their neighborhoods."

<he shakes his head, amusement ebbing>

"These people cannot be saved from themselves, and you are keeping me from my book. Unless you can offer me an exceptionally lucrative or otherwise highly enticing reason to lend my concern, further pestering shall prompt me to acquaint you with places considerably hotter than you foolishly imagine it will become here."

<the bony hand raises in a quick flourish, and he and all depart to from whence they were brought; the familiar's eyes remain glowing for a time, disembodied, until they too vanish>


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Sissyl wrote:
At least in some edition of 3.X, quarterstaves were free. This meant that by the crafting rules, creating them took zero time. Thus, just make quarterstaves. A virtually infinite number of them. The nukes will detonate and char the jigillion quarterstaves, but enough people will survive far below the surface of the new sea of wood. And hey, not even a wizard.

A common misconception made popular by a certain fanfic. Craft skill represents one week of work, and thus this is the minimum time to craft anything. There is variant rules to let you craft by the day by dividing by 7, but this then becomes the minimum time. There are no non house rules to craft anything other than either potions or scrolls, i dont remember which, in less than a day.

In pathfinder this extends to being able to reduce the craft time by multiples of 2 bydoubling or tripling the DC, but there is no double or triple of 0

Theres also the question of raw materials. Any claim to the gm of having the 0G in raw materials can be countered with "you have no raw materials" and both are valid claims by strict raw


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Summon an effreet and make a wish of him.


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Well once you have the timeless demi plane I feel the easiest option would be to encapsulate all the nukes in a wall of force or if the dm wants to be picky about radiation prismatic sphere. That should stop about everything about the nuke The tricky part being you only have infinite time while in your demi plane if you left you would loss a round per casting assuming 500 nukes or more. not gonna work so summon or gate rather in celestials (or whatever suits you I suppose) that can use scrolls. Send them out in mass to encapsulate all the missiles. you could also use polymorph any object and turn them into food items to simultaneously cure world hunger.

Alternatively use a combination of gate and scrying to find superman and have him gather them all up for you and throw them into space or a gate to the abyss because who would even notice if you nuked the abyss? (where talking full power fly around the world to reverse time move at millions of times the speed of light superman.)


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Teleport to the major world leaders. Charm/Dominate them. Order them into ordering the abort/self destruct of the missiles. Since we are talking about a Wizard on Earth, well, Heads of State on Earth are going to have very poor Will Saves, and it is highly unlikely they will make their saves. Within 30 rounds you should have effected the abort order of several of the major world powers, and at the very least turned Armageddon into a terrible accident.

You probably don't need to teleport to each location. Aren't there ways to cast spells through your scrying devices?

Since we are talking about Earth, there are media outlets with global or near-global reach. A high level Bard with good media coverage should be able to Charm the world into aborting the attack.


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Vidmaster7 wrote:

Well once you have the timeless demi plane I feel the easiest option would be to encapsulate all the nukes in a wall of force or if the dm wants to be picky about radiation prismatic sphere. That should stop about everything about the nuke The tricky part being you only have infinite time while in your demi plane if you left you would loss a round per casting assuming 500 nukes or more. not gonna work so summon or gate rather in celestials (or whatever suits you I suppose) that can use scrolls. Send them out in mass to encapsulate all the missiles. you could also use polymorph any object and turn them into food items to simultaneously cure world hunger.

Alternatively use a combination of gate and scrying to find superman and have him gather them all up for you and throw them into space or a gate to the abyss because who would even notice if you nuked the abyss? (where talking full power fly around the world to reverse time move at millions of times the speed of light superman.)

A 1st Edition D&D Wall of Force should contain a nuclear blast: all the nuclear blasts, but the area of effect of a wall of force is limited, and the world's nuclear arsenals would not be released from only a single launch site, but from several all over the world targeting several points all over the world. It would require a lot of level 20 wizards with metamagic feats to cover the world with magic missiles.

I was thinking it might be funny to cast Lighten Object on the whole planet, reducing "g" for the missiles and making them all fly off into space or something. But remembering that the AoE of Lighten Object is 1 cubic foot/level, you would again need quite a few Wizards casting several metamagically enhanced Lighten Object Spells right on the Earth's core before you made an impact on g. I'm at work and don't feel at liberty to do the necessary number crunching here and now.

Sovereign Court

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

You could use prismatic walls, instead of wall of force. The missile no matter what type of damage blasts definitely don't count as meeting the requirements to go through prismatic walls.


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Scott Wilhelm wrote:
Vidmaster7 wrote:

Well once you have the timeless demi plane I feel the easiest option would be to encapsulate all the nukes in a wall of force or if the dm wants to be picky about radiation prismatic sphere. That should stop about everything about the nuke The tricky part being you only have infinite time while in your demi plane if you left you would loss a round per casting assuming 500 nukes or more. not gonna work so summon or gate rather in celestials (or whatever suits you I suppose) that can use scrolls. Send them out in mass to encapsulate all the missiles. you could also use polymorph any object and turn them into food items to simultaneously cure world hunger.

Alternatively use a combination of gate and scrying to find superman and have him gather them all up for you and throw them into space or a gate to the abyss because who would even notice if you nuked the abyss? (where talking full power fly around the world to reverse time move at millions of times the speed of light superman.)

A 1st Edition D&D Wall of Force should contain a nuclear blast: all the nuclear blasts, but the area of effect of a wall of force is limited, and the world's nuclear arsenals would not be released from only a single launch site, but from several all over the world targeting several points all over the world. It would require a lot of level 20 wizards with metamagic feats to cover the world with magic missiles.

I was thinking it might be funny to cast Lighten Object on the whole planet, reducing "g" for the missiles and making them all fly off into space or something. But remembering that the AoE of Lighten Object is 1 cubic foot/level, you would again need quite a few Wizards casting several metamagically enhanced Lighten Object Spells right on the Earth's core before you made an impact on g. I'm at work and don't feel at liberty to do the necessary number crunching here and now.

There's always the witchspam way of increasing CL: a witch with the coven hex can increase the effective CL by 1 of another witch with the hex. Take leadership, make all of your followers witches. (For the CL required to lighten the entire earth in one cast, compression techniques and noble scion loops may be required)


Oh, hey, I'd already posted here. Hah! I'd forgotten!


The Sideromancer wrote:
Scott Wilhelm wrote:
Vidmaster7 wrote:

Well once you have the timeless demi plane I feel the easiest option would be to encapsulate all the nukes in a wall of force or if the dm wants to be picky about radiation prismatic sphere. That should stop about everything about the nuke The tricky part being you only have infinite time while in your demi plane if you left you would loss a round per casting assuming 500 nukes or more. not gonna work so summon or gate rather in celestials (or whatever suits you I suppose) that can use scrolls. Send them out in mass to encapsulate all the missiles. you could also use polymorph any object and turn them into food items to simultaneously cure world hunger.

Alternatively use a combination of gate and scrying to find superman and have him gather them all up for you and throw them into space or a gate to the abyss because who would even notice if you nuked the abyss? (where talking full power fly around the world to reverse time move at millions of times the speed of light superman.)

A 1st Edition D&D Wall of Force should contain a nuclear blast: all the nuclear blasts, but the area of effect of a wall of force is limited, and the world's nuclear arsenals would not be released from only a single launch site, but from several all over the world targeting several points all over the world. It would require a lot of level 20 wizards with metamagic feats to cover the world with magic missiles.

I was thinking it might be funny to cast Lighten Object on the whole planet, reducing "g" for the missiles and making them all fly off into space or something. But remembering that the AoE of Lighten Object is 1 cubic foot/level, you would again need quite a few Wizards casting several metamagically enhanced Lighten Object Spells right on the Earth's core before you made an impact on g. I'm at work and don't feel at liberty to do the necessary number crunching here and now.

There's always the witchspam way of increasing CL: a witch with the coven hex can...

Ah, the death star coven. But of course.


Baval wrote:
Craft skill represents one week of work, and thus this is the minimum time to craft anything.

You can roll for a week of work, but as you yourself go on to say, you can complete something in half a week of work, or even smaller fractions and it will be an existing item instead of existing in some limbo state for the remaining 3.5 days.

Baval wrote:
There is variant rules to let you craft by the day by dividing by 7, but this then becomes the minimum time.

Crafting progress by day is part of the base rules, not a variant rule. Combining crafting by the day and exceeding the result by some multiple of the target price, you can make something in 8 hours of work, 4 hours of work, 2 and 2/3 hours of work, 2 hours of work, 1 and 3/5 hours of work, 1 and 1/3 hours of work, and so on.

It still never reaches 0, though, unless somehow the rounding down general rule could be applied here in such a way to round something down to 0.

You'd have to reach 1/4800th of the crafting time per day in order for it to take 6 seconds and be accomplished in a single round, which means you'd need to get 4800 times the necessary result. Which if it actually had a value could be conceivably possible for low value items at very high level, but only if you allow for raising the DC of the check deliberately multiple times instead of only one time, which is one of those gray areas. 20 ranks + 3 class skill + 20 Arcane Reinforcement + 10 Int + 5 Crafter's Fortune + 5 Visualization of the Mind + 5 Genius Avaricious would yield 68, multiplied by 65 that's 4420, which I believe would allow one to make a 1 sp item in 45 seconds, so 8 rounds, while a 1 gp item would be ~65 seconds or 11 rounds.

The whole idea of multiples of 0 is the really problematic angle, and that along with the whole question of raw materials are the real ways it fails, not that it isn't technically possible to craft things in ridiculously short periods of time by RAW if you crank numbers up high enough.

Such as by having some method to generate wealth, an intelligent construct, and continually increasing its intelligence score after maxing out its HD. That can get you a crafter with an arbitrarily high Int Bonus that will yield very fast crafting times.

Which brings us to another gray area, whether you can make more than one such craft check in a day or if one could whip up a longsword in a minute or two and then not be able to make anything else until after 24 hours had passed or if you can do as many as you want, but once you hit the 8 hour mark you cannot keep working or attempt to craft again.


<The excitable young thing attempts once again to enlist arcane support...>

*poof*!

<A disheveled gnome appears and looks up from an enormous workbench strewn with formula books and equipment emitting noxious fumes. His head is almost entirely obscured behind a contraption of myriad lenses and automated tools that hiss and whirr as they move on articulated limbs seemingly with a mind of their own.>

"Ey, wot's this all about, now, laddie? Be quick! Be quick! We are busy!"

Quote:
The entire nuclear arsenal of the world, fifteen thousand nukes, have been launched, and is directed to burn the world in fire...

<An up-stretched hand interrupts.>

"'Earth', ey? I haven't been paying attention to that place for a long while. Too many interminable 'dark ages' where all advancement ceases. Plain lost track of them. So many other more interesting realms, you know. I wonder, have they progressed beyond cruciform steel and the horizontal bellows yet? That's where they were stuck for millennia the last time I checked in."

<He moves a pile of junk to one side, then rapidly executes a series of button presses and swipes on the workbench. A large illuminative display purrs to life under its crystalline surface.>

"Fire, hmm? Well, now, you have come to *just* the right fellow for that! 'Nukes', you say? That term I am unfamiliar with, unless you're referring to the rubber-soled shoes which seem to be all the fashion these days. Some of the chaps into electricity have been raving about the benefits of those. But anyway, we shall see what this out-of-the-way cul-de-sac world has been up to."

<Practiced hands cause shifting patterns to dance on the console.>

"Ho-ho! Look at this! Ha-ha, that's a nice one! What potential! Pity, though, that they replaced the U238 third-stage tamper with lead and robbed the experiment of half the projected yield. Hmph. How disappointing. And they appear to have ceased development not long after that. Started making them smaller and smaller, explaining it away as improvements in accuracy. Lies for public consumption, I presume. Something *clearly* scared them off...."

<Elsewhere, warning klaxons shriek in alarm as quantum polynomial shielding firewalls inside secretive installations are hacked with ease and the rich bounty of their mainframe databanks exposed for cloning by an unknown intruder whose IP cannot be traced.>

"Ahh.... So that's what they found... Yeesss.... A 'Fourth Stage', they called it. Quark-level degenerative collapse unleashing the might of a neutron stellar-core detonation! -- How many cultures across the 'verse came so far and couldn't figure it out? Or tried, only to annihilate themselves from existence without a trace. But these fellows actually managed, albeit only at the theoretical, mathematical stage. ...but then their bowels turned to water and they sealed their research away. How gripped with fear they were. And rightfully so, heh-heh...."

<Pausing to scratch the remaining strands of hair on a bald pate, the gnome is clearly talking wholly to himself at this point and ignoring you entirely.>

"1.21 gigatons, so *that* is the key number toward breaking the electron valence shell orbital energy of the carbon atom and unlocking the REAL power, -- and all easily obtainable with a sufficient quantity of Lithium-7, a fairly common element. ...A cubic-kilometer of the stuff would suffice, I should think, for the three orders of magnitude advance required over this primitive 'Tsar' mechanism. The true solutions are always as simple as they are elegant. ...Teller and Ulam, these two were right to hide what they discovered, for on such a low-mana world they would have never been able to escape."

<The gnome certainly seems to know his stuff, and while that would otherwise imply he would be ideal for solving your imminent ICBM-arrival dilemma, you cannot avoid a sense of unease. Have you made another error in your choice of gating subjects?>

"Thistlewottle, I always figured you were entirely off on the wrong track. Completely full of it. To think of all the time I've wasted trying to duplicate your worthless procedures. Your academy lectures were turgid, ropy toss as well. But instead of firing you, they claimed you were the best. But the answers fall into place at last, and it makes sense: they employed you to deliberately lead us astray. It is the only rational explanation, and I *will* see you all pay for it."

<A thick, worn volume is plucked from a shelf and unceremoniously heaved to the floor. The gnome seems pleased to see it lay there with a cracked spine. But not quite enough, as he brings his arm up and points carefully down an extended index digit.>

"Bang!"

<An incandescent beam streaks from the tip of his finger to the book, dead-center, and it explodes in a geyser of fiery confetti and acrid smoke.>

"Minimally satisfying, but only the start. Now let's get down to some *serious* work!"

<A violent sweep of his arm brusquely shoves suddenly unimportant materials off the remainder of the bench. A second display light up beside the first, and his stubby fingers move adroitly and ambidextrously in a rapid blur over both of them as if a maestro of the steam-organ were unleashed over layered banks of keys. You wait patently for many long minutes, until clearing your throat secures his attention.>

"But where are my manners? I am neglecting that which brought me as its guest."

<He lifts his headgear, which swivels upward on a hinge to rest upright above him like a weird tiara. His face is hideously scarred and burned from multiple mishaps, which you gather he must wear as a badge of pride given that healing or concealing his countenance would be trivial for one of such means.>

"*Thank* you, m' boy, for bringing all of this to my attention, for my lifelong ambitions can finally be fully realized. How *ever* could I repay you?"

<He grins wolfishly, and you are quite certain that you see flames dancing in fey pupils as it dawns upon you that he is thoroughly and murderously sociopathic, possessed of a malevolent intelligence that cares not for the plights of lower mortals. Icy dread clutches your heart. What have you done? What have you done!?>

<It dawns upon you that only divine intervention can save you now....>


Coidzor wrote:
Baval wrote:
Craft skill represents one week of work, and thus this is the minimum time to craft anything.

You can roll for a week of work, but as you yourself go on to say, you can complete something in half a week of work, or even smaller fractions and it will be an existing item instead of existing in some limbo state for the remaining 3.5 days.

Baval wrote:
There is variant rules to let you craft by the day by dividing by 7, but this then becomes the minimum time.

Crafting progress by day is part of the base rules, not a variant rule. Combining crafting by the day and exceeding the result by some multiple of the target price, you can make something in 8 hours of work, 4 hours of work, 2 and 2/3 hours of work, 2 hours of work, 1 and 3/5 hours of work, 1 and 1/3 hours of work, and so on.

It still never reaches 0, though, unless somehow the rounding down general rule could be applied here in such a way to round something down to 0.

You'd have to reach 1/4800th of the crafting time per day in order for it to take 6 seconds and be accomplished in a single round, which means you'd need to get 4800 times the necessary result. Which if it actually had a value could be conceivably possible for low value items at very high level, but only if you allow for raising the DC of the check deliberately multiple times instead of only one time, which is one of those gray areas. 20 ranks + 3 class skill + 20 Arcane Reinforcement + 10 Int + 5 Crafter's Fortune + 5 Visualization of the Mind + 5 Genius Avaricious would yield 68, multiplied by 65 that's 4420, which I believe would allow one to make a 1 sp item in 45 seconds, so 8 rounds, while a 1 gp item would be ~65 seconds or 11 rounds.

The whole idea of multiples of 0 is the really problematic angle, and that along with the whole question of raw materials are the real ways it fails, not that it isn't technically possible to craft things in ridiculously short periods of time by RAW if you crank numbers up high enough.

Such as by...

In pathfinder everything you say is true. The original post was about 3.5 so my initial address was to that.

With any non 0 item it is technically possible to reach an insignificant crafting time and therefore make the crafting effectively infinite, but the results required even for a 1 copper item is ridiculous as you pointed out. For a 0 cost item they are impossible because 0 has no multiples.

Unlike magical crafting there is no limit to mundane crafting, as it is measured in weeks or days instead of hours. Therefore there is no 8 hour crafting limit, if you roll high enough to make something in a quarter of a day it takes you a quarter of a day, and you can then try again with a new item. The only limit is you have to announce how long you intend to craft at the start in at least 1 day increments, but that is functionally meaningless since unless you dont finish the item the result of your check determines the actual time you take.

So in theory you *could* bury the nukes in a near infinite number of items that cost 1 copper, but not in quarterstaves. However since youre not longer dealing with a free item you now need that money, and in that event theres no point in the actual crafting, just bury the nukes in the actual coins.


Copper coins actually had a use? Who knew?


They are also conductive.


Seems like a good time if ever there was one to announce drawing from a Deck of Many Things. Who knows maybe I'll draw "Avoid any one fate" or "Know the solution to my next dilemma". Pretty sure nothing the Deck can do to me is worse than what's going to happen in 3 minutes :P


Most likely you end up with a treacherous henchman, some old property, or an extraplanar loaf that hates your guts.


Sissyl wrote:
Most likely you end up with a treacherous henchman, some old property, or an extraplanar loaf that hates your guts.

None of which will matter in about another 2 and half minutes. And of course he'll hate my guts as I just doomed his backside unless he has some quick ideas on saving the world.

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