When does Karzoug start scrying on the PCs?


Rise of the Runelords

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Spoiler:
I'm almost completely finished reading the anniversary edition cover to cover again and I'm trying to determine when exactly I should start having my PCs roll wisdom saves to block Karzoug's scrying spells. I know some DMs might roll these in secret but I kind of the like idea of ramping up my players' paranoia even more.

I think the earliest he could possibly have any clue is if the lamias Xanesha or Lucrecia manage to get away and send him a message somehow. That said, he might not bother wasting his time scrying on them rather than "more dangerous/ important" individuals until after they kill Mokmurian.

Thankfully, my players are still in the beginning of Skinsaw Murders so I've got plenty of time to choose, but I'd love some advice!


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

After Mokmurian's death, potentially. But really, after they forge their Runeforge weapons is when he'll become serious about it.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Note that a runelord can scry the surroundings through a Sihedron Medallion he created. It's assumed that all of them found in the campaign were made by Karzoug.

I've been having Karzoug scyring on my PCs since they picked up a Sihedron Medallion after killing Xanesha. One of the PCs decided to start wearing it and using it. They don't know about it since it's through the medallion, so there's no invisible sensor to see when they've been using see invisibility. And I've been mentally noting that Karzoug has been scrying on them more frequently as they progressed in the campaign. Now they are in Book 6, finishing up the encounter at the cabin. By the time they get to Karzoug, he'll know everything about them (spells, tactics, weaknesses, etc.).

Dark Archive

ckdragons wrote:

Note that a runelord can scry the surroundings through a Sihedron Medallion he created. It's assumed that all of them found in the campaign were made by Karzoug.

I've been having Karzoug scyring on my PCs since they picked up a Sihedron Medallion after killing Xanesha. One of the PCs decided to start wearing it and using it. They don't know about it since it's through the medallion, so there's no invisible sensor to see when they've been using see invisibility. And I've been mentally noting that Karzoug has been scrying on them more frequently as they progressed in the campaign. Now they are in Book 6, finishing up the encounter at the cabin. By the time they get to Karzoug, he'll know everything about them (spells, tactics, weaknesses, etc.).

Problem with that its outright said that Karzoug can only scry on people he is aware of. So he couldn't scry on Nualia as Xanesha recruited her on her own and never had chance to inform Karzoug about Nualia.


Karzoug should absolutely be aware of the PCs after the Mokmurian fight, though.


He can scry on them after Xanesha, if you decide that he got lucky to tune in for her fight with party. If not, well, getting "busy line" with Xanesha while trying to monitor her progress is not a cause for him to worry. He is expecting some attrition in his minion ranks. Party , probably, appears on his radar if Lucrecia manages to send a message spell to lamias at Jorgenfist. They will send it to Ceoptra, and she to Karzoug. Two hits in short spawn of time on his agents - this is not a coincidence for him (greedy and paranoid for potential rivals who can challenge him and take away his riches, power, knowledge, etc.). Beeing smart, he'll probably keep an eye on Mokmurian and task lamias at Jorgenfist to do the same. But I agree, that after Mokmurian he should start scrying them or using Sihedron Medallion, if they have one.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
CorvusMask wrote:
ckdragons wrote:

Note that a runelord can scry the surroundings through a Sihedron Medallion he created. It's assumed that all of them found in the campaign were made by Karzoug.

I've been having Karzoug scyring on my PCs since they picked up a Sihedron Medallion after killing Xanesha. One of the PCs decided to start wearing it and using it. They don't know about it since it's through the medallion, so there's no invisible sensor to see when they've been using see invisibility. And I've been mentally noting that Karzoug has been scrying on them more frequently as they progressed in the campaign. Now they are in Book 6, finishing up the encounter at the cabin. By the time they get to Karzoug, he'll know everything about them (spells, tactics, weaknesses, etc.).

Problem with that its outright said that Karzoug can only scry on people he is aware of. So he couldn't scry on Nualia as Xanesha recruited her on her own and never had chance to inform Karzoug about Nualia.

While you're correct about your statement about Nualia and "her" medalllion, I'm confused by your wording. ckdragons doesn't mention Nualia.

I'll have K start surveying the party after the kill X. While he'll be amused at first that they've managed to kill her, he'll get more and more concerned with the party's progress the further we progress along the story arc, increasing the frequency with which he spies on the PCs.

Ruyan.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

His words after they kill Mokmurian and then the Runeforge belay that concern. He thinks of the PCs as insects or worms. They are nothing like the legends of old, before the world came tumbling down. Killing a couple lamia? So what? They didn't stop what he wanted (greedy souls). They are stumbling around in the dark and don't know where he is or how to stop him. Or even who he is at first.

He won't care.

But with killing Mokmurian, they go on his radar. If he realizes they have Sihedron medallions, he'll start keeping an "eye" out for them, just out of idle curiosity. And after the Runeforge, he'll realize they are perhaps a slightly more significant threat. But he also would feel they can't stop him escaping the Runewell. And once he's out of there, he can bring his army forward... and then nothing can stop him.


RuyanVe wrote:
CorvusMask wrote:
ckdragons wrote:

Note that a runelord can scry the surroundings through a Sihedron Medallion he created. It's assumed that all of them found in the campaign were made by Karzoug.

I've been having Karzoug scyring on my PCs since they picked up a Sihedron Medallion after killing Xanesha. One of the PCs decided to start wearing it and using it. They don't know about it since it's through the medallion, so there's no invisible sensor to see when they've been using see invisibility. And I've been mentally noting that Karzoug has been scrying on them more frequently as they progressed in the campaign. Now they are in Book 6, finishing up the encounter at the cabin. By the time they get to Karzoug, he'll know everything about them (spells, tactics, weaknesses, etc.).

Problem with that its outright said that Karzoug can only scry on people he is aware of. So he couldn't scry on Nualia as Xanesha recruited her on her own and never had chance to inform Karzoug about Nualia.

While you're correct about your statement about Nualia and "her" medalllion, I'm confused by your wording. ckdragons doesn't mention Nualia.

I'll have K start surveying the party after the kill X. While he'll be amused at first that they've managed to kill her, he'll get more and more concerned with the party's progress the further we progress along the story arc, increasing the frequency with which he spies on the PCs.

Ruyan.

The thread could use more spoiler tags. My reply certainly does.

Spoiler:

I think the point may have been that Karzoug never knew Nualia had the medallion so he doesn't know the pc's have it. Therefore he can't scry on them. My reading of the item description is that Karzoug has to know John has a medallion to scry on John. He scry's on a specific person via the medallion, not he scry's on the medallion to see whatever/whomever happens to be holding it.

What exactly is the likely return, in gamespeak, to Karzoug scrying? What value does it provide for him to start scrying anytime before Book 6? Will Karzoug take different actions based on what he learns? Keep in mind, you may have troubles later if the pc's suspect or discard the sihedron items...

It seems reasonable for the pc's come to his attention with the death of Mokmurian. Does Karzoug's brief interaction with the pc's at the end of Book 4 justify him knowing that Bob is wearing a medallion? Maybe. What would he learn? And then do? He could learn the pc's are exploring the ruins under Sandpoint, getting the secret of Runeforge from the Scribbler or trying to go to Runeforge. What does he do? Send more minions to stop them? Not a bad idea though off-script for the AP. I don't know what else he might learn - the pc's abilities and tactics are likely to change as they advance in levels (and explore Runeforge) so learning about them seems most appropriate for Book 6. It seems likely Karzoug focuses much more on who owns the rings vs. the medallions. It also seems he could/would learn much more about the pc's powers, tactics, etc. via his images in the Pinnacle.

Dark Archive

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Yeah, thats what I meant. I also used Nualia as example that sets up why Karzoug can't be scrying pcs after Xanesha, unless he does somehow coincidentally scry on Xanesha during the fight like it was suggested earlier.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Hm, the wording in the item's description is certainly ambiguous.
Thanks for all the insights!
I'll think it over for my campaign--first they have to kill X anyway...

Ruyan.


So, given that the Divination school of magic didn't exist in Thassilon, how does everyone justify him scrying and using arcane sight and the like- are they folded into some other ancient school of magic? Considered Universal? It's not earth-shattering for me, this seeming conflict, but it was a bit jarring to start thinking about scrying on the PCs and then reread that divination wasn't a thing 10K years ago.


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mousmous wrote:
So, given that the Divination school of magic didn't exist in Thassilon, how does everyone justify him scrying and using arcane sight and the like- are they folded into some other ancient school of magic? Considered Universal? It's not earth-shattering for me, this seeming conflict, but it was a bit jarring to start thinking about scrying on the PCs and then reread that divination wasn't a thing 10K years ago.

Didn't exist? Not sure about that, my understanding was that the Runelords did not consider Divination a worthy peer of the sin-based schools which is not the same as the magic didn't exist.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Not exactly.

"The school of divination stood outside the rest in Azlant arcane society, viewed as a "universal" school that no wizard should ignore" - From The Shattered Star in Shards of Sin.


"School" being the operative word in my statement...

There's room for someone to make the argument that the magic wouldn't have existed back then, but I'm not making it. I'm wondering how much focus should be given to tool that was viewed as inferior.

That quote reads as odd, logically, cy. Don't want to dismiss it, though: what an interesting paradox that a field of magic should be both unignorable, and yet "outside" arcane society. Was it like the occult to them? That statement raises more questions for me than it answers.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Lost Kingdoms, and especially Shattered Star cover Thassilon pretty good.

Divination was pretty important to them, it's how they found out Earthfall was about to go down, and enacted their contingencies. But, it's not infallible. :-)


haha- not being worthy of a school devoted to it, but being important to them makes divination sound like the Kardashians of magic!


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Well, they did go down in flames, so that certainly gives hope for our future. :-D


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Maybe they didn't want to know TOO MUCH of the future.

Scarab Sages

mousmous wrote:
haha- not being worthy of a school devoted to it, but being important to them makes divination sound like the Kardashians of magic!

Not quite - the schools of magic are specializations, except for the 'universal school' that all wizards, regardless of their specialization study. Keeping divination spells in the 'universal school' can make sure (lets say when studying magic at some academy) that no wizard can ignore divination magic during his/her school days.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

There's definitely some dissonance between info given in Runelords and Shattered Star. I definitely remember reading some stuff in Runelords, where divination was considered a "lesser school," which is why there wasn't an eighth virtue of rule that was later corrupted into a deadly sin. Somewhere along the line, Paizo decided that outright derision for divination wasn't appropriate, so it became a "universal" school in Shattered Star. I can massage the story to make this work, of course - in universe, historians didn't know all that much about Thassilon, so they assumed that "no eighth sin = lesser school," but after the discovery of the library beneath Jorgenfist, Runeforge, and Xin-Shalast, enough accurate information to portray life in Thassilon was recovered to reevaluate the old assumptions.

An interesting thought occurs to me - if divination was considered a universal school back then, what if there wasn't a divinatory school at that time? What if there were only seven schools of magic, and all divination spells were considered "universal" at that time? Ten thousand years later, magical experimentation and practice has caused a divergence, and diviners are now a thing.


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Except, of course, the Azlanti and other contemporaries of the Runelords were practicing divination just fine.

Everyone else in the world could specialize in divination fine; its the Runelords that are the divergents.

Xin and the Runelords are in essence the wizard version of heretics.

Thassilonian magic in functionally a super-specialization, and the Runelords arbitrarily decided that divination wasn't worthy of super-specialization.


Zhangar wrote:


Thassilonian magic in functionally a super-specialization, and the Runelords arbitrarily decided that divination wasn't worthy of super-specialization.

Which is where I'm at when I ask the question about Karzoug scrying on the party. I suppose I'm jumping off the deep end to suggest he wouldn't do that, though.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Yeah, he would start as soon as he could. Dude's been in stasis for ten thousand years, he's gonna want to know what's happening as soon as possible. Remember, his plan is to hit the ground running. :-)


mousmous wrote:
Zhangar wrote:


Thassilonian magic in functionally a super-specialization, and the Runelords arbitrarily decided that divination wasn't worthy of super-specialization.
Which is where I'm at when I ask the question about Karzoug scrying on the party. I suppose I'm jumping off the deep end to suggest he wouldn't do that, though.

Divination being "unworthy" of hyperspecialization doesn't bar the Runelords from still making use of it - just like they make use of spells outside their specializations. Runelords can't cast their opposition school spells but everything else is fair game.

(And the mythic runelords, Xanderghul and Sorshen, quite probably used opposition school spells. Xanderghul's feats of conjuration were every bit as impressive as his feats of illusion, and conjuration is normally barred for Pride mages.)

And so Karzoug will use divination, because it's simply another tool in the box (much like the evocation spells of his hated rival Alaznist).


I believe it's now time to ask ourselves, being willing to scry on the persky PCs, HOW the great Karzoug the Claimer, Runelord of Greed and sovereign of Shalast, will actually Use his scrying attempts against the Pcs. Assuming he starts to be worried after M death, I would suggest the following:

1) Karzoug identifies the pcs that is most like minded to him and tries to convert him to the glories of sin magic (even if he fails, this should add tension between pcs about the possibility of a traitor in their ranks).

2) Karzoug tries to give pcs "false information" about himself and his strenght: he could always appear as a red dragon, for example, o a vampire, making pcs ready to fight such beings (imagine they show an holy symbol to him just to see him laughing).

3) Karzoug finds the pcs weakness and strikes at them! Pcs allies start to disappear and then Karzoug shows a group of golden statues, pulled over a cauldron of boiling metal with him holding the blueprints of a golden throne of interwined bodies ...

4) Karzoug sends minions to vex the pcs. These should be APL+2 battles, and also show off the glory of the Runelords. I would suggest to send either demon assassins (maybe from Lamashtu) or a strike force of storm giants backed up by a summoned angel ...


Karzoug gets info about the PC's from the people who were marked and killed by the PC's as they were fed into this Runewell. This is mentioned in the last book/chapter.

Grand Lodge

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Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I had Karzoug take note of the PCs when they killed Xanesha.

He started observing them in earnest when they fought Mokmurian.

He started watching them closely once they entered Runeforge.

When they arrived at the Spires of Xin-Shalast, he started watching them obsessively around-the-clock.

They're battling Karzoug next session. He's ready for them. :D

-Skeld

Silver Crusade

Is he capable of scrying on them inside Runeforge? I thought the magic of the place protected it from that sort of thing.


I don't see any reference to Runeforge blocking scry attempts. Page 253 (AE) goes into some detail about traveling to/from Runeforge but doesn't say anything about scrying. So I would assume normally cast scry attempts or Runewell-powered scry attempts (within its specific set of restrictions - AE p.425.) would work. With penalty for being on another plane, of course.

The Occluding Field around the Pinnacle does block scrying (AE p. 345) which might be what you remember.

Grand Lodge

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Or you can ignore all that silly rules mumbojumbo and have Karzoug scry on them regardless because it's useful to the narrative and makes him seem all that more powerful (he can do things the rules say he can't do!).

-Skeld


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

I will have him start scrying them after the Runeforge. He will sense them make the Dominant Weapons and very likely learns of their presence in the Runeforge when they take out the Mithral Mage.


Stepchild of the Sun wrote:

I'm almost completely finished reading the anniversary edition cover to cover again and I'm trying to determine when exactly I should start having my PCs roll wisdom saves to block Karzoug's scrying spells. I know some DMs might roll these in secret but I kind of the like idea of ramping up my players' paranoia even more.

I think the earliest he could possibly have any clue is if the lamias Xanesha or Lucrecia manage to get away and send him a message somehow. That said, he might not bother wasting his time scrying on them rather than "more dangerous/ important" individuals until after they kill Mokmurian.

Thankfully, my players are still in the beginning of Skinsaw Murders so I've got plenty of time to choose, but I'd love some advice!

Might not be a huge deal to some, but that's a hell of a spoiler in your title line, people can read it without even entering the AP forums...

...like one of my players just did. We agreed that they would avoid this forum, but the most recently active topics still pop up on the overall view. They knew that Runelords were involved (obviously, given the AP title), but my inclusion of Seven Days to the Grave and a bunch of season 4 PFS scenarios had them leaning towards Krune or Sorshen possibly being the final boss. Or Alanzist, given their initial discoveries beneath Sandpoint. Now they know for sure that its Karzoug. Thanks for that.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I agree, people have been lax with keeping things behind spoiler tags and too much information in titles.

Players need to use these forums too.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Okay. Personally, if I was a player and saw "When does Karzoug start scrying on the PCs" I'd assume spoilers and not enter the thread.

That said, you have been adding material to the AP. Your players don't know how much you changed. You can at any time alter the end - hell, you could use the last module for Shattered Star and have them fight Mecha-Wizard.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

As a counterpoint, it's not too hard to come up with a vague title with a warning of spoilers.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

And countering your counterpoint, preciseness helps GMs know which threads to go into. When I'm searching for help there are keywords I can use that lead me to viable threads. For that matter, the Wiki page talks about the group fighting Karzoug. You have to specifically try to avoid being spoilered on who the big bad of Runelords is.


Tangent101 wrote:

Okay. Personally, if I was a player and saw "When does Karzoug start scrying on the PCs" I'd assume spoilers and not enter the thread.

That said, you have been adding material to the AP. Your players don't know how much you changed. You can at any time alter the end - hell, you could use the last module for Shattered Star and have them fight Mecha-Wizard.

Actually, I'm doing exactly that (Xin/SS for the final battle/book), but that doesn't mean the Karzoug battle and his direct involvement as the big bad pulling all the strings isn't a huge part of the campaign. Plain and simple, 'When does Karzoug start scrying on the PC's' is an incredibly spoilerish (and in my opinion inconsiderate) thing to make your title line, especially when its going to appear not just in the RotRL forum or the AP forum, but on the main forum page for all to see.

My players won't set foot in this forum, but when something is in the title line, it shows up all over these boards.

Dark Archive

So wait, your players have founded out names of all Runelords in character or out of character? .-. If its former, then you give them way too much information early on considering most of knowledge about Thassilonia is lost, if its latter then they already spoilered themselves xD


Hold on a moment, the pc's have legitimate prompts to learn the names of two Runelords in Book 1 since they encounter a statue of one and a talking image of another before it's finished. That's just running it as written.

Wiggz is right - people are way too sloppy with thread titles. And revealing info about Karzoug is just one poor example - there are too many threads about key npc's in Book 2 that reveal way too much as an example. Thread titles do not have to be explicit to be searchable. And not everyone reads widely on the boards or wiki's or the AP's themselves and it seems presumptuous to assume they do and therefore "should already know" key bits of info about the AP. GM's should be using the GM Reference sticky threads for dialogues like this.

Of course, the Book titles themselves are spoilers and every time we reply to a thread like this we make it worse. Arrggghhhh! What have I done?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

I have a player who looks up information on each foe he faces. Thus he knew who and what Mokmurian was before they encountered him. In return, I have started altering the names of opponents or giving them nicknames so that that player can't look up that information.

Now maybe it's just me, but given how easy it is for people to look up stuff on the Internet and the natural curiosity of roleplayers, shouldn't we as a rule be altering the names of our major NPCs and the like? It is a relatively minor change that can be tracked on notecards and a backup text file and can also help personalize an adventure.

Also note this is a matter of cat, open bag, and a length of time having passed. Insisting all future threads do not include his name in the title and include Spoiler tags and all that won't change the fact that Karzoug's name shows up third in the description of links for a Google Search of "Who is the big bad of Runelords."

Oh, and while a thread search might find every instance of the name Karzoug, a thread title does need to be explicit for me to know that X thread talks about, oh, let's say when Karzoug starts scrying on the players, Y thread talks about methods by which he does so, Z thread complains about how the Herolabs writeup on the Sihedron Amulet includes explicit information that Karzoug will use these to scry on the players, meaning that the Character Sheet PDF from HeroLabs informed one player about what the amulet will allow (she is a good enough roleplayer that when I asked her to ignore that information, she didn't tell the others - and is still wearing the amulet), and Thread A just talks about Karzoug in relation to the other six Runelords.

So Thread Z might warn a GM not to include the Sihedron Amulet on a character's sheet and let them know to write it in on their own sheets. And Thread A might be something that a GM realizes "this is tangential to information I'm looking for so I'll ignore it."

I am NOT about to read every single thread on the Runelords forum just on the off chance one will include stuff I need. That is what forum post titles are for.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

While I agree a total information lock down in the internet age is... unrealistic. It still doesn't hurt to use a little discretion (and wit) in thread titles.


Tangent101 wrote:

I have a player who looks up information on each foe he faces. Thus he knew who and what Mokmurian was before they encountered him. In return, I have started altering the names of opponents or giving them nicknames so that that player can't look up that information.

Now maybe it's just me, but given how easy it is for people to look up stuff on the Internet and the natural curiosity of roleplayers, shouldn't we as a rule be altering the names of our major NPCs and the like? It is a relatively minor change that can be tracked on notecards and a backup text file and can also help personalize an adventure.

I don't put my players on information lockdown. They want to be surprised. They want to figure things out as part of the story. They want those 'ah-ha' moments and those 'wtf' moments. Sure, you can find out spoilers for every movie the minute it comes out, if not before, and indeed some people choose to do that... but I wouldn't appreciate those who make that choice for themselves putting that information out where those who would rather enjoy the movie spoiler-free could easily come across it. In my opinion,making a thread easy to search for is secondary to respecting the integrity of the experience of others. Distantly. Hell, something as simple as 'Question about Karzoug' or 'Runelord question' would have been more than adequate, especially given that this sort of topic is usually answered pretty quickly and resolves of its own volition.


CorvusMask wrote:
So wait, your players have founded out names of all Runelords in character or out of character? .-. If its former, then you give them way too much information early on considering most of knowledge about Thassilonia is lost, if its latter then they already spoilered themselves xD

In character. But not all the Ruinelord names and not necessarily which was which in every case.

Because I am expanding the campaign to include the influence of multiple Runelords I gave them a bit of exposition via Brodert Quink... however, I also gave them a fair bit of disinformation and speculation on his part, made it clear that common folk think he's crazy and then had him engage in a heated debate with another NPC and fellow scholar who also had some accurate and some inaccurate information. Sifting through the history, the theories and making them match the facts they discover has been part of the fun.


As long as we're spoiling everything, I'd like to confess that I killed Aroden.


Uh, yeah. He did it!


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber
Quote:
I don't put my players on information lockdown. They want to be surprised. They want to figure things out as part of the story. (snip)

So. Did this player tell the rest of the group? Or did he keep his newfound knowledge to himself and only tell you it had been spoilered for him?


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In my campaign, I thought it was a bit of a waste for Karzoug to wait until the last books of the campaign before reaching out to the PCs. I've modified the Sihedron Medallion in a number of ways from how they're presented in the AE, without changing the mechanics.

- Anyone wearing a Sihedron Medallion can "see" the death of a creature marked with the Sihedron Rune: When slain, a burst of violet energy emerges from the chest of a marked creature and arcs skyward, heading vaguely northeast (to Kaer Maga).

[This serves to make the PCs more hesitant about killing every intelligent enemy they come across; In my campaign, they finally realized after Stones over Sandpoint that sending more souls to the mysterious BBEG is probably not in their best interest. Now they're starting to ask how to remove the Rune from incapacitated foes.]

- When the wearer of a Sihedron Medallion is slain, their spirit is imprinted onto the medallion. Anyone who wears the medallion from that point onward suffers vivid dreams where the original owner appears and attempts to subtly persuade them to continue to act in Karzoug's interests, usually by appealing to whichever Sin drives them.

[In my campaign, the Lustful character has been wearing Nualia's medallion since the first book, and he's been having some pretty awkward dreams. On the eve of Stones over Sandpoint, Nualia revealed to him that two of his fellow PCs (who just starting wearing medallions of their own) are marked with their own sins (Wrath and Greed, respectively).]


SoylentG wrote:
- Anyone wearing a Sihedron Medallion can "see" the death of a creature marked with the Sihedron Rune

Nice! My players haven't seen that yet- I'm totally stealing this!


mousmous wrote:
SoylentG wrote:
- Anyone wearing a Sihedron Medallion can "see" the death of a creature marked with the Sihedron Rune
Nice! My players haven't seen that yet- I'm totally stealing this!

Agreed. This is an awesome idea. Where were you when my group was in Book 2? It's a bit late now that they are in Book 5.

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