Please help me like life oracle (and healing again)


Advice


I am bored to tears with my character because all of my damage output is terrible. All I can do is heal and even then, my rolls are often crap-tastic. I've been reading other threads and the Oracle guide on how to beef up the character and the Summon Monster III was definitely a perk. One of the players in the group who knows oracles very well suggests I go Searing Ray instead of SM 3. I just don't know. The google doc also mentioned the combo of Life Link and Energy Body as being great, but I am still unsure what this means. Does all of the damage one person take get transferred to the oracle? If so, I would be afraid I'd get one shotted! Lol.

My statblock is:

Male the mysterious ones oracle 7 (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Player's Guide 42)
CN Medium humanoid (human)
Init +2; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +9
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Defense
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AC 21, touch 12, flat-footed 19 (+7 armor, +2 Dex, +1 natural, +1 shield)
hp 50 (7d8+17)
Fort +5, Ref +5, Will +8
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Offense
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Speed 30 ft. (20 ft. in armor), swim 30 ft.
Melee +1 morningstar +8 (1d8+3)
Ranged light crossbow +7 (1d8/19-20)
Special Attacks channel positive energy 6/day (DC 18, 4d6+1)
Oracle Spells Known (CL 7th; concentration +12)
. . 3rd (5/day)—cure serious wounds, neutralize poison, prayer, summon monster III
. . 2nd (7/day)—cure moderate wounds, grace[APG], hold person (DC 17), instrument of agony[UC], lesser restoration
. . 1st (8/day)—bane (DC 16), bless, cure light wounds, detect undead, murderous command[UM] (DC 16), shield of faith
. . 0 (at will)—create water, detect magic, detect poison, guidance, mending, purify food and drink (DC 15), read magic
. . Mystery Life
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Statistics
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Str 14, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 14, Cha 20
Base Atk +5; CMB +7; CMD 19
Feats Extra Channel, Extra Revelation[APG], Reach Spell[APG], Selective Channeling
Traits blessed touch, friend in every town, touched by the sea
Skills Acrobatics +2 (-2 to jump), Climb +3, Craft (ships) +7, Diplomacy +16, Heal +7, Knowledge (geography) +5, Knowledge (history) +6, Knowledge (local) +8, Knowledge (religion) +11, Linguistics +2, Perception +9, Profession (sailor) +7, Sense Motive +6, Spellcraft +7, Swim +13
Languages Aquan, Chelaxian, Common, Dwarven
SQ interaction bonus, mark of slavery, oracle's curse (legalistic), revelations (energy body, life link, channel, safe curing), vow to self
Combat Gear potion of water breathing, wand of cure light wounds (21 charges); Other Gear +1 chain shirt, buccaneer's breastplate, mwk buckler, +1 morningstar, light crossbow, amulet of natural armor +1, besmara's tricorne, cloak of resistance +1, headband of alluring charisma +2, helm of underwater action, ring of the iron skull, bedroll, belt pouch, candle (10), flint and steel, hemp rope (50 ft.), masterwork backpack, mess kit, pot, soap, torch (10), trail rations (5), waterskin, 2,128 gp
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Special Abilities
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Blessed Touch Heal +1 damage when using lay on hands, channeling energy, or casting a cure spell.
Buccaneer's breastplate Continuous water walk and float to surface if donned underwater.
Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white vision only).
Energy Body (1d6+7, 7 rounds/day) (Su) Elemental subtype and deal 1d6+7 to undead who touch you or heal 1d6+7 to allies who enter your square.
Helm of underwater action Sees 5x farther underwater, and breathable air.
Interaction Bonus +3 bonus to one-on-one Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Sense Motive checks.
Legalistic The shackles of Hell impose savage consequences should you violate a covenant, but also imbue you with remarkable guile. Whenever you break your word (either purposefully or unintentionally), you become sickened for 24 hours or until you meet your ob
Life Link (7 max bonds, 100 feet) (Su) As a standard action, establish bond that drains your HP to heal other below -5 hp.
Mark of Slavery -2 to skills and attacks after failing a skill check, unless you're retrying the skill check,
Oracle/Oracle Channel Positive Energy 4d6+1 (6/day, DC 18) (Su) Positive energy heals the living and harms the undead; negative has the reverse effect.
Reach Spell You can cast a spell with a range of touch, close, or medium as one range category higher.
Safe Curing (Su) Casting healing spells does not provoke AoO
Selective Channeling Exclude targets from the area of your Channel Energy.
Swimming (30 feet) You have a Swim speed.
Touched by the Sea Underwater attack penalties are lessened by 1.
Vow to Self (1/day) +4 morale bonus to one role to keep a promise.

We just leveled to 7 so I put all of my skill points to where I think they belong. But, I am open to any suggestions. Pleaaaaase. I'm almost to the point of just wanting my character to die off to start something different, but I am the only healer in the group.

Grand Lodge

Is it in PFS or a Home Game?

Is Retraining an Option?


Fruian Thistlefoot wrote:

Is it in PFS or a Home Game?

Is Retraining an Option?

Thanks for the fast reply! It's Skulls and Shackles. What does retraining mean? I know we can train up our HP...


I can understand your frustration, playing a life oracle myself, altough i m not disapointed with my dmg at all. A life oracle is in my opinion a highly unsuited character for skulls and shakles. You re sailors, you should be drinking, plundering and brawling.I m not sure why you are expecting dmg from this character. You don t have one feat for dmg and yes life oracle is extremely limited to support spells.
There are some ways to make a life oracle do dmg, but they all need to be chosen at character creation and are again unsuited for skulls and shakles because you rely on dmg that doesn t work under water.
The blackened curses, would give you some fire spells. Myself I went with the spirit guide, I often choose the fire spirit from the shaman class, which gives me access to fire ball and burning hands, which I intensify.

There are 3 solutions for your problem in my view. Either your DM lets you rebuild the character from scratch, you change your expectations to beeing an awesome support class or just simply make a new character. Your DM could use the Life oracle as a great NPC buffbot, which is what your character is atm.


I'm perfectly fine with being a "buffbot" or "healbot" It's just that I would like to figure out what kind of direction I should go. How to make my character better.

Would SM 3 be good? I know the Lantern archon's can use aid as well as the light ray. Or do I grab a different level 3 spell?

edit: I'm currently using the Google Doc for spells and feats and such. How do I go from this character to an "exceptional" buff and healing character? What would I change? Feats? Spells? Etc?


If you want to keep your character, I would recommend to ask your dm if you can swap out some feats. go the augment summoning route, which requieres spell focus conjuration. Quick channeling is also very nice to have


A level 7 human should have 5 feats (unless you swapped it for something else), you only have 4 listed. Maybe take Tyophelis' advice and try swapping reach spell or extra channel for the Spell focus and then use that feat you're missing for Augment Summoning.

Summoning is very fun and can be very useful to add action economy and an extra "expendable target".

Grand Lodge

Kuriin wrote:

I'm perfectly fine with being a "buffbot" or "healbot" It's just that I would like to figure out what kind of direction I should go. How to make my character better.

Would SM 3 be good? I know the Lantern archon's can use aid as well as the light ray. Or do I grab a different level 3 spell?

edit: I'm currently using the Google Doc for spells and feats and such. How do I go from this character to an "exceptional" buff and healing character? What would I change? Feats? Spells? Etc?

You Could try to summon in a bit of damage via SM 3.

You can ask your DM if he will allow spiritual weapon to work for CHA since it's your casting stat and the spell was made BEFORE the Oracle class. Its a perfectly reasonable request. Spiritual weapon is very nice.

You could ask for a Retraining or Rework of the character.

If allowed to retrain and you want Physical damage you can always Take 4 levels of Life Oracle and 3+ Levels of Paladin and be a Oradin. Use a Glaive or Reach weapon and pair it with Combat reflexes + Power attack + Smite Evil for some good offense. I'm working on a build that incorporates Bard Variant Multi-classing Rules. Getting Bardic Performance basically takes care of the buffs you will need. Using Life Link + Shield Other you can take damage for people and heal yourself with Lay on Hands as a SWIFT action. That means your standard can be more spells, channel energy, or Attack with smite evil. Your saves will be freaking awesome for sure. You end up with more HP due to the D10 from the paladin. Full-plate is also pretty nice feature to pick up.


My character's race is an "unknown", meaning, that I don't even know my traits nor how many feats I get until I level up. I thought this would be cool because I'm trying to make the storyline interesting, HOWEVER, I have gimped myself because I think the DM keeps forgetting about my storyline. Meaning, I don't even know what my abilities are. The only thing I know is that I have darkvision. That's it. Everyone in the party gets all of these racial perks but I am at a loss.

One of the players who knows oracles well suggested reach spell but I have only used it like ONCE. It takes a full round to even cast it plus it expends two of the spells which makes it not good unless I get the Quicken Spell as well.

I just feel like I am not meeting everyone in my group's expectations of the character. I've always picked healing classes in all of my games and even RPGs because I actually enjoy it. This is the first time I've ever played an oracle (I typically play cleric) and didn't research enough to find out that I can't choose different spells every day.

Thanks guys for the advice.


Even if your character doesn't know their background, you still do. And if your character is indeed human, they should have all the human abilities, known or unknown. Having the human feat isn't game breaking, and is one of the few things that makes a human a viable choice for race.

I like the "unknown" backgrounds, but don't hurt your build for sake of story. Who knows, maybe your character was unnaturally gifted at conjuration magic, but since you "forgot" (or whatever), you never knew until you summoned that first beastie.


Fey foundling (feat): It may be taken only at first level (you may convince your GM to retrain your first feat (on the side note, shouldn't humans have 5 feats by level 7? I can count only 4)), but it improves the healing on you. Since you can move the damage from the party to you, you can save some resources.

Dual cursed oracle: Get a second curse which doesn't not improve with time, but you get more revelations and you can get the fantastic misfortune revelation (as an immediate action you can force a reroll on anyone in 30 ft. It works once per creature/PC, with a refresh of 24 hours).

Spells in general: You have a nice charisma, which while is not stellar, gives you some chance to be a battlefield controller. Choose spells that target many opponents; perhaps once in a while you'll get the job done. You also get some good buff spells (next level pick Blessing of Fervor. It's just fantastic). Summoning is also fine. Don't take the blasting route; it's terrible. You are better at summoning stuff that blast than just blasting.


Here is some general advice on the life oracle. They do not shine, in combat, your grp might be dependable on you, but you ll never be in the main light exept if there are no undead. And that s ok, because you make yourself shine in other aspects of the game. You re the fortuneteller, doctor and diplomat in the group, make use of the supersticions of sailors.
Now if I would make an Oracle in Sculls and shakles I would probably have made an Air or Waves Oracle. You can still heal and buff, but you can also play the direct link to god and should be worshipped by the hole crew for your abilities.
No matter what, you ll have to sit down with your DM and explain how you feel, work on that background of yours and ask him to allow you to rebuild your character, so you enjoy the game more. If he allows it, try to go for an archetype like dual cursed or spirit guide, which will give you so many more options. Oracles are very limited with their spell selection so anything that adds spells or abilities is great.

Augment summoning will not make your character suddenly great, but it will certainly add some oomph to your summons and atm that s one of the best ways for your life oracle to influence the battlefield.


Thank you everyone for your help. It's greatly appreciated! I definitely went into this pretty blind because at the time, I was studying for classes and then boards. My mistake. :(

Sovereign Court

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Kuriin wrote:
Thank you everyone for your help. It's greatly appreciated! I definitely went into this pretty blind because at the time, I was studying for classes and then boards. My mistake. :(

Gosh! How dare you focus on your schooling instead of what's really important!! >.<


No mistakes were made, obviously you and your party are alive at level 7. As a healer, that is a success! Your build looks like a very solid healer build (especially one that was built for the shackles) and not one to be ashamed of.

My advice was only in response to your feeling of being "lack luster". If you want more for your character, you have lots of options as an Oracle (3/4 BAB with full caster is flexible). The only issue is that you heavily invested in being a healer, so breaking away towards a new point will have some grief.

Personally, I like summon monster, but you should have some strong save DCs with a CHA of 20, so go ahead and grab something that goes "Boom" if it appeals to you.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 16

'Retraining' means the same thing as 'rebuilding', except it's usually done one level at a time.

I think proper spell selection might actually turn things around. Your worry is that you don't have anything to contribute in rounds that you are not actually healing.

Pages of Spell Knowledge would probably be one thing you can do. Second, are you using your FC bonus to learn additional spells? that always helps. Especially a broad array of healing/removal spells, since they seem to depend on you for them. I notice you don't even have Silence learned...as a combination stealth/anti-caster spell, it is extremely useful!

I'm not an expert on spells for you, but retraining some lower level spells to buff with could be VERY useful. For instance, Divine Favor would surely help out your combat skills. I don't see Dispel magic on your list, either. Greater Magic Weapon/Vestments could up the AC of yourself or your party members. Resist Element/Prot/Elements are SOLID defensive spells and come in VERY handy at times. And you really should have Prot/Evil and/or its 10' variant, for breaking charms if nothing else.

An active tactic you might look at is counterspelling. You've got tons of slots, so if you can find a feat or magic item to up your dispel check, being able to shut down an enemy caster is a HUGE boost to the party. It's not the BEST use of combat time, but it allows you to support without feeling useless. The combination of spiritual hammers, summoned monsters, AND a counterspeller can really mess up an enemy caster...and then dropping a silence on him for kicks, too! Just imagine dropping a silence spell on one of your hammers that is sticking close to an enemy caster, or on top of an archon that communicates telepathically and is just instructed to move with the enemy and keep them silenced...

As noted, a few Spiritual Hammers harrying a caster is a Good Thing. Make use of the low level slots you have! Get rid of the spells you aren't going to use to wield some that will be useful at all levels.

Oh, and you MUST get Prestidigitation on your cantrip list. Hehe! I would probably get rid of Bane, Grace, Instrument of Agony, and Murderous Command, myself. Swap in Divine Favor for a combat buff, Prot/Evil(Law) to break charms, Silence, and Spiritual Hammer. Get Pages of Spell Knowledge for Resist Energy and Cure Light Wounds (because, why not?), and learn Dispel magic for a 3rd as soon as possible. You'll want Greater magic Weapon, Greater Vestment as soon as you can get them. Get the party to spring for Pages of Cure Disease, Cure Blind/Deafness and Remove Curse/Paralysis. Freedom of Movement when dealing with an aquatic environment is going to be nigh priceless, too. And you don't have Water Breathing and Water Walking as emergency spells?

At higher levels, you're going to want to summon elementals, have a Planar Ally following you around (suggest a lillend or other azata), control the weather, have at least one wall type spell, and some form of transformational/movement type spells. Word of Chaos is an awesome offensive spell at the time you get it.

USe human FC bonuses for extra spells known, and ask your party members if there are any spells they really wish you had, and then pool funds for Pages of Spell Knowledge to pick them up. Let them help you buff them. If you can't afford Pages, then make do with a few scrolls, especially for condition removal.

=========
You are a primary, 9 level caster. Increase your defenses and long term buffs, leverage your spells.

Something as basic as casting Greater Magic Weapon on your morningstar to make it +2, so you can then add Keen or Lightning or Bane (undead? Humans?) to it is a classic way of leveraging your power. Likewise, being able to buff your armor and shield up helps your defense without costing you money. If you aren't worried about punching DR, make your weapon a +1 Keen Lightning Bane Chaotic Blah blah weapon with Greater magic weapon on top of it, you'll have the best weapon in the party. You can do the same with your armor and shield.

Get a Lesser Rod of Extend to make your personal buffs last twice as long. If the other members of the party want the same, have them buy you another one.

You have a lot of stuff you can do. expand and change your spell selection. YOur combat ability potential just gets higher and higher with levels and money.

==Aelryinth


I removed dispel magic but can put it back in no problem since we haven't started the game after leveling. Every single time I tried dispelling something, I could never out roll the DC. Instrument of Agony was suggested on the google doc. Bane and Grace I have not used in quite some time...and Murderous Command, I am not even sure why I got that, rofl.

Thanks guys for the help.


Kuriin wrote:

I removed dispel magic but can put it back in no problem since we haven't started the game after leveling. Every single time I tried dispelling something, I could never out roll the DC. Instrument of Agony was suggested on the google doc. Bane and Grace I have not used in quite some time...and Murderous Command, I am not even sure why I got that, rofl.

Thanks guys for the help.

My current reach cleric has utterly fallen in love with Grace. Being able to just say "no" to any attempt an enemy uses to corner me, or put me in a bad position, I just say "no" and move away into a much better position. Most recently I was surrounded by 3 giant black widows, so I used Grace, then cast Air Walk and just walked away from them into the air.

If you aren't a reach cleric though, where positioning is absolutely critical, then Grace could definitely be less useful.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 16

Switching to a reach weapon is a viable tactic, too, and Grace could be important. But it's only really an issue if you're going to go into combat frequently, or need to get out of it.

He can up his AC by +3 just by using Shield of Faith and 2 greater vestments on shield and armor. That's also money he doesn't need to spend on a ring and armor, so he can upgrade his amulet of Nat AC, maybe buy a jingasa with the money saved.

And if he wants Grace, he can spend 4k on Pages for it. Beauty of being a spon caster...once you have the Pages, it is ALWAYS available.

==Aelryinth


Going the 'counterspell' route is a terrible idea. It is a terrible mechanic and you're almost always going to get more bang for your buck by doing literally anything else. To even be remotely viable as a counterspeller you need to invest two feats and it still is a waste of an action.

Kuriin, if counterspelling sounds fun to you then take Searing Ray and ready it against an enemy's spellcasting instead. You'll likely interrupt their spell (due to a failed concentration check) while doing damage to them, and you didn't waste two feats to get there.

Aelryinth all of your other advice was good so I'm sorry to have been so blunt. Even framed the way you did (as used in tandem with other spells/tactics to thwart enemy casters) is still a subpar choice of action in most circumstances.

----

edit - I came off as harsh but I didn't mean to. I just feel strongly about the subject I suppose. Counterspell falls prey to clunkiness, reliance on variables, and is fairly easily thwarted by a cunning enemy.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 16

Oh, I know it's reactive. Searing Ray, however, has to put up with energy resistance, spell resistance, and a TH roll, and the person could get lucky on the Concentration roll.

For the Dispel, it's just a straight CL check. used to be in 3E you could get like an additional +8 to that roll for almost auto success, too!

But yes, very reactive...and it doesn't waste resources if you don't use it. I never said it was OPTIMAL, and you can counterspell in numerous ways.

Note that you only need Improved Counterspelling if you want to be able to counterspell IN ADDITION to something else. I'm basically throwing it out there as an action he can take without lots of investment, when he doesn't know what else to do.

Other then that, if he has the right spells, he can be throwing out buffs, providing a flanking partner. Once he has Summons going, there's always something to do.

==Aelryinth


Just got back home. These are all such fantastic suggestions. I didn't even realize that there were items out there to help a healer so much.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

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Don't get rid of murderous command!!!! It's super fun! You make one enemy attack another enemy! How cool is that???

I'm not sure it's the most optimized spell, but it's so cool!

Where is your favored class bonus going?

And try to get your racial abilities squared up. Are you an aasimar, maybe? They have a really good favored class bonus.

Also, are you allowed to use 3pp feats? Mystic Healer is really good.

Fey Foundling is nice to have, too, especially if you go the oradin route.


Searing Light really depends wether or not undead are a big factor in your game. In Carrion Crown, a 10d6/10d8 ranged touch attack is nothing to sneeze at and can be increased with metamagic rods
Searing Light: 10d8 ⇒ (1, 7, 5, 5, 6, 4, 3, 5, 8, 4) = 48

So a base 48 hp carved off right there. For 9k, a Lesser Empower adds 50% damage.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 16

Murderous command is basically a low effect damage spell. The subject makes a saving throw. If he fails, he takes a swing at a friend, requiring a TH roll. If that fails, you've spent a spell slot and accomplished nothing...so you've two chances of failure, and it does VERY little damage.

Plus the save is low, and that means the spell gets less and less effective.

It's nice at 4th level and below. After that, you've got better things to do.

Contrast with Hold Person. It's a save or suck. If they fail the save, they are out of it for one round and subject to an insta-kill coup de grace. They have one chance to resist, not two. And you get to pick the target, as opposed to the target picking ANOTHER target to damage.

So, yeah, time for Murderous Command to stand aside for spells that are actually still useful at higher levels. Prot/Evil, for instance.

==Aelryinth

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I like how murderous command, under the right circumstances can take out 2 weak opponents for 1 round--possibly 1 of them permanently.

You're right you need to be lucky for it to work right, but when it does, it's super fun. I've also played in campaigns where the GM then has the mooks fight amongst themselves after it works, but usually just to streamline a fight where other interesting things are going on.

I think murderous command might be fun to combine with Extend Spell and Magical Lineage, and maybe even Heighten Spell.

Admittedly, I emotionally like murderous command and realize a more rational and intellectual analysis of it can expose a lot of its weaknesses.

I've also been playing 5th Edition a lot lately, so I'm used to its version (Crown of Madness), which is 2nd level and lasts up to 1 minute, which is a little different.


Kuriin wrote:
I'm perfectly fine with being a "buffbot" or "healbot" It's just that I would like to figure out what kind of direction I should go. How to make my character better.

You have a couple of Options. The first switch classes having the GM make a healer NPC, Hank the healer. The second is reorganize the character.

I have played the Oracle since first reading it our group wanting a healer in our party. They in my mind are better healers then a cleric for a variety of reasons. I have in the past multiclassed for a level or two in fighter. Two levels of fighters gives me more weapon options and two combat feats to use them. I often go bow with Point Blank then Precise Shot. I pick Shield of Faith as a personal spell to buff my AC. Also remember all Cure spells go on your spell list before you pick anything else. And mystery spells for a Life Oracle provide even more healing type spells. Blessing of Fervor is a must.
While you lack ninth level spells I have multiclassed into a Musket Master Gunslinger for three levels. At third with rapid reload you reload a musket for free. Touch AC to hit range of forty feet.
Both options give you some combat versatility when you are not buffing and healing. At higher levels with a smart party buffing and healing becomes less and less important in combat.
To be more offensive as a straight Oracle switch to Assimer race. +2 to Wis and Chr. They also get channeling feats not offered anywhere else. Then take versatile channel allowing you to heal and harm. There is a prestige class that at second level makes it so you channel at the same level for both. Extra and improved channel help.
I have never thought of myself as a heal bot finding the term insulting since most of my characters who have been clerics or Oracles have never been just healers. Another idea is the Pathfinder Society has an archtype that gives you the abilities of a Rogue at Disarming magical traps for the loss of one mystery. It's improves your usefulness to a party.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Derek Dalton wrote:


To be more offensive as a straight Oracle switch to Assimer race. +2 to Wis and Chr. They also get channeling feats not offered anywhere else. Then take versatile channel allowing you to heal and harm. There is a prestige class that at second level makes it so you channel at the same level for both. Extra and improved channel help.

RAW/PFS I don't believe this is allowed as Life Oracles don't qualify for versitle channeling:

"Prerequisites: Channel energy class feature, necromancer or neutrally aligned cleric (see below).
....
This feat only applies to necromancers, neutral clerics who worship neutral deities, or neutral clerics who do not worship a deity -- characters who have the channel energy class ability and have to make a choice to channel positive or negative energy at 1st level. Clerics whose alignment or deity makes this choice for them cannot select this feat."

On divine builds I always like slotting level 2 Burst of Radiance. It's a nice little 10' burst of reflex save or blindness, and has 5d4 no save light damage for any evil creatures hit in the burst.


This then should be a rules question. However an Oracle is essentially a Sorcerer version of a Cleric. Mysteries instead of Domain. Normally an Oracle does not gain Channel energy. In fact only Life Mystery Oracle offer channel energy without restrictions. With that in mind our group has allowed this.

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