I heard somewhere that Paizo was considering changing the races that give bouses like this somewhere but can't remember where. I had thought it was a thread somewhere on these boards but couldn't find it when I searched back through my recent threads. Does anyone know where this might have been? Is there anywhere I could show my support of this potential change?
My perspective, by the way, is that 1/2 was too powerful for many of these abilities but 1/6 is so restrictive that I doubt anyone would take that option over giving up 6 hit points. I wonder if anyone actually disagrees with that view point as I have discussed it with several people IRL and have yet to hear a different opinion expressed. I think the pendulum has swung too far to the other side on this one.
A reasonable compromise seems like it would be 1/4. Or does anyone think that is still too powerful?
The problem is that what used to +1/2 half varied so much in level of power that it it was absurd, especially when it came to Oracle Revelations.
I doubt anyone minded when a Life Oracle increased their Channel Energy or an Oracle increased their Mystery's Armor revelation(if it had one, like bones), but when those Animal Companions started progressing faster, people lost it since that lead to something unbalanced(let's leave out the fact you can buy trained tigers by level 2 at the latest).
+1/6 makes the option fairly terrible though, and I'd never use it unless I was making an 18th level character, and even then it's a maybe. On something like the Halfling's Internal Buffer favored class bonus though it really is worthless.
If you didn't have to wait until you had the class feature your favored class bonus effects it would all be much better.
It's mostly dependent on the class and what the particular bonus is.
For some bonuses, 6hp is a small price to pay compared what can amount to an extra feat at times or something similar.
So if we pick the Oracle Animal Companion or Bonded Mount as a worst case scenario (and I agree, despite the fact that I have a PFS character that uses it) do we still think that 1/6 is balanced?
I, for one, do not. I would not be willing to give up 6 hp to have my mount be 1 level higher. I wonder if anyone would?
If another thread doesn't actually exist on it maybe we could use this one to vote on it. Because we know that rules changes with Pathfinder works with democracy, right? ;)
I would certainly sacrifice 6hp for a mount 1 effective level higher.
I think the hp isn't really that great a use of a Favored Class Bonus, I almost never take it.
Now, skill points is a little dicey and will depend on the class and what I want the character to be able to do.
At the end of the day 1/2 was certainly too powerful for some selections.
I think it would have been wiser to specifically change how those options interacted than changing all options, but it would have taken longer and taken up more space in the rule book (which probably makes it not viable).
If animal companions were really the only major offender the easiest thing might have been to say that the companions level is capped at effective druid level of your character level.
So, Claxon, being that you are the first I have heard to have that opinion I am interested in knowing what you think is balanced for that ability. Do you think it is balanced at 1/6? I know you said you think 1/2 is too powerful and I agree. Do you think think 1/6 is spot on, too powerful still or too harsh?
hiiamtom: 1 extra option for FCB is too much to handle?...
Either way, not really the topic of this thread, I guess.
So, Claxon, being that you are the first I have heard to have that opinion I am interested in knowing what you think is balanced for that ability. Do you think it is balanced at 1/6? I know you said you think 1/2 is too powerful and I agree. Do you think think 1/6 is spot on, too powerful still or too harsh?
I think for a very small number of choice 1/6th is okay, but they're specific instances like having an Oracle choose the one that increases revelations, but only for specific revelations. Most revelations would probably be okay at 1/4, but some could cause problems if they advance more quickly than that.
Because a few abilities could cause problems, I think their only solution was to change it so that even with the worst offending abilities (like the animal companion revelation) could not break things.
The real issue is that those specific instances probably should have been handled in another way instead of adjusting the FCB.
1/6 is so restrictive that I doubt anyone would take that option over giving up 6 hit points. I wonder if anyone actually disagrees with that view point as I have discussed it with several people IRL and have yet to hear a different opinion expressed.
There are 1/4 bonuses to AC (halfling slayer, dwarf summoner, dwarf witch etc.), but they are situational - and always AC bonuses, you can't pick something.
Now 1/6 bonuses are often +1 class ability (rogue talent, alchemist discovery, arcanist exploit etc.). That's more flexible, because you can pick from long lists - and the 1/6 is the price for flexibility.
So the existance of 1/6 bonuses looks ok to me, for now. I'd take them, at least for builds where I want a lot of class abilities early on.
hiiamtom: What you had said was...
This is why I just let players choose +1 skill or +1 hp regardless of class/prestige... FCBs have become a little bit of a cluster...
That seems to be discussing a disdain for the entire alternate FCB system. I was simply pointing out that is beyond the intended scope of this thread.
Stating that I don't know what was 1/6 to begin with is both false and not constructive. I question your motives for your aggressive tone. I am, however pleased that you returned to the primary topic. If you have some personal issue with me (for some reason that I don't understand) can we please take it to private messages?
So I can get behind the whole thing of 1/6 perhaps being reasonable for something where you get the power of a full feat or class ability AND get the flexibility of choosing from a large list. However, I'm not certain that 1/6 for making a single already obtained class ability function as if you were one level higher is reasonable. You aren't paying for the versatility of a large number of choices and you aren't getting something new. Paying 6 hp for making something you already have marginally better does not seem worth it to me. Making it 4 hp would still make it a tough choice and that seems how it was intended to me.
That is just my opinion. I'm still interested in your opinions.
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With the retraining rules, you only need 18 days and some gold, and you can recover those 6 HPs (up to the max you could have rolled). I don't know if that factored into deciding where to set the bonus or not, but it's an easy way around it. It's a little more of an investment in PFS, where you'd have to spend prestige as well. Personally, I think 1/4 would have been better. But the loss of hitpoints isn't as be of a factor if your game allows enough of a break to retrain.