Game Altering (or Game Breaking?) Spells: Rope Trick

[Cevah]

Kayerloth wrote:

Q: How does one finish off Aquatic Trolls in a underwater environment (no air pockets etc.)?

A: Drag them into a Rope Trick (and hope your GM doesn't smoke you out with questions about ventilation or water leaking in etc.).

I wouldn't consider it particularly game changing (any more than magic in general is) nor have I experienced any issues (from either side of the screen) with parties using it as an overnight camping sight. Things like it sealing access to all other extradimensional spaces, the lack of any alternate way out and hence becoming trapped tend to put a damper on things.

Curious what do folks believe the DC is to spot the window/portal?
20 + spell level
40 + spell level
other

srd

Perception wrote:

Perception Modifiers .. DC Modifier

Distance to the source, object, or creature .. +1/10 feet
Unfavorable conditions .. +2
Terrible conditions .. +5
Creature or object is invisible .. +20

Rope trick applies to a rope 5' to 30', and it goes strait up. Nothing states it must start at the ground level, and it could easily start at +5'. If you bring up the rope as much as you can, while leaving it still outside, that means you have a small object at +30' away. I think a small object gets a 2 modifier to spot relative to a medium object.

Looking up is unusual, so I give that the unfavorable condition modifier.
Spot rope: +3 (30') +2 (small) +2 (unfavorable[up]) = DC 7
Spot window: +3 (30') +2 (unfavorable[up]) +20 (invisible) = DC 25
Taking efforts to camouflage the rope would go to terrible conditions.
Spot rope: +3 (30') +2 (small) +5 (terrible[up, camouflage]) = DC 11
While the Invisibility spell is only 1 minute per level, you can hit the rope with it when you hear a monster about, changing the spot.
Spot rope: +3 (30') +2 (small) +2 (unfavorable[up]) +20 (invisible) = DC 27

With camouflaged rope, gathered up under the space, you have DC 11, which is enough to avoid being seen by anything with a perception skill of 0. I.e. most commoners.

/cevah

[hiiamtom]

Avoron wrote:

Scrying wrote:

You can observe a creature at any distance. If the subject succeeds on a Will save, the spell fails. The difficulty of the save depends on how well your knowledge of the subject and what sort of physical connection (if any) you have to that creature. Furthermore, if the subject is on another plane, it gets a +5 bonus on its Will save.

Extra-dimensional spaces are not planes, and rope trick specific rules counter scrying.

[Avoron]

Rope Trick wrote:

Creatures in the extradimensional space are hidden, beyond the reach of spells (including divinations), unless those spells work across planes.

Scrying wrote:

You can observe a creature at any distance. If the subject succeeds on a Will save, the spell fails. The difficulty of the save depends on how well your knowledge of the subject and what sort of physical connection (if any) you have to that creature. Furthermore, if the subject is on another plane, it gets a +5 bonus on its Will save.

Rope trick does not protect against spells that work across planes. Scrying works across planes. Therefore, rope trick does not protect against scrying.

[hiiamtom]

I didn't pick up the Rope Trick clause, my fault for using memory.

[Insain Dragoon]

So say I use move earth to create a five foot hole in a cave, then get a wizard to create an illusary wall over the hole, then I cast rope trick inside the hole, would that be against the rules?

Is the line about a hidden rope all inclusive or just "you can't make the rope itself a target"?

[Scythia]

CBDunkerson wrote:

Scythia wrote:

Wait, there's a spell that makes sneak attack for Rogue archers actually a thing?

Actually, there are several. Basically, anything which allows the Rogue to see targets while preventing the targets from seeing the Rogue. Tiny Hut, Greater Invisibility, Darkness plus See in Darkness, Fog Cloud plus Mist Sight, et cetera.

Right, I knew about invisibility, and concealment spells. They each have their own problems though. The concealment spells especially, since concealment negates precision damage. It's bizarre to think that casting Darkness on oneself, while 30' away from the target, and drawing great attention to where one is makes sniping effective.

[Atarlost]

Insain Dragoon wrote:

So say I use move earth to create a five foot hole in a cave, then get a wizard to create an illusary wall over the hole, then I cast rope trick inside the hole, would that be against the rules?

It cannot be hidden by any means. Any means. Any. Distance? Nope. Rope trick ropes are visible at infinite distance. Obstructions? Nope. Rope trick ropes are visible through an infinitely thick lead wall. Nothing stops the visibility of the rope trick rope.

Now go forth and invent a rope trick semaphore language.