Optimizing a Razmiran Priest


Advice


What bloodlines would you recommend?
Also, would a dip into Pathfinder Savant/Arcane Savant be worth it?

I was looking at doing Sage bloodline so I can utilize skills fairly well. Not sure about Savant though. More bonuses to UMD, ability to take a 10 on UMD, and your caster level on scrolls seem helpful though. Are there other ways to get caster level on scrolls faster?


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The Sage bloodline is an excellent choice, Int-based casting tends to be very useful.

With that in mind, you could just use Pragmatic Activator to make Use Magic Device based on Intelligence, but I'm a fan of the Skill Focus/Esoteric Linguistics route. You can use Linguistics in place of Use Magic Device to activate scrolls, allowing you to take 10 on your checks and providing access to several other bonuses - there are several traits for +1 to linguistics and gaining it as a class skill, a cracked gold nodule ioun stone gives a very cheap +1 competence bonus, and you can swap out your level 1 bloodline power to get a parrot bloodline familiar that grants you another +3. You can even take Orator for instant prowess at several social skills.

The loss of a level of spellcasting from Pathfinder Savant is annoying. Consider dipping into Cyphermage - you don't lose out on any spellcasting, and every level you can pick from a list of scroll-related abilities. One of these allows you to cast a scroll using your own caster level, and another gives you a huge bonus on caster checks if spell resistance is your issue. Each is only usable a very limited number of times per day, but remember that as a Razmiran Priest you get the ability to cast spells from divine scrolls without expending them, which means that you can just make a one-time investment in some high caster level scrolls and then cast from them over and over at no extra price.


Avoron wrote:


With that in mind, you could just use Pragmatic Activator to make Use Magic Device based on Intelligence, but I'm a fan of the Skill Focus/Esoteric Linguistics route. You can use Linguistics in place of Use Magic Device to activate scrolls, allowing you to take 10 on your checks and providing access to several other bonuses - there are several traits for +1 to linguistics and gaining it as a class skill, a cracked gold nodule ioun stone gives a very cheap +1 competence bonus, and you can swap out your level 1 bloodline power to get a parrot bloodline familiar that grants you another +3. You can even take Orator for instant prowess at several social skills.

When a character or creature is not in immediate danger or distracted, it may choose to take 10 on some rolls (specifically, skill checks). Distractions or threats (such as combat) make it impossible to take 10.

Not great for use with casting from scrolls.......


An int-based caster can get Linguistics up to a level where he can't fail a DC 20 check reasonably easily.


Prerequisite(s): Skill Focus (Linguistics).

Benefit: You can attempt a Linguistics check in place of a Use Magic Device check to activate a scroll, or in place of a Spellcraft check to identify a scroll. You must still have (or emulate) the ability score required to cast a spell of the desired level, and you cannot use Linguistics on the check to emulate the required ability score.

I dont see the point - you need to invest a feat just to qualify, you cant use 'take 10' usefully a lot of the time for scroll casting and you cant use linguistics to emulate the ability score (ie WIS).

Why not just stay CHA based for UMD..... for a sorceror its their casting stat!!

Prestige classes for a Razmiran are dodgy (and rightly so!).... you lose out on your FCB (so likely no extra spells known) and you dont progress in your class abilities... no Bloodline Feats, Powers or Spells!.... Ouch!

When a ...... gains a level, he gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in an arcane spellcasting class he belonged to before he added the prestige class. He does not, however, gain any other benefits a character of that class would have gained.

SUMMARY - If you want to optimise a Razmiran... stay a Razmiran !!!

Liberty's Edge

When playing a Razmiran I normally go arcane healer archetype for Bards with the False Focus Feat for their holy symbols of Razmiran. They get channel energy and the ability to bolster their allies. If you choose the right performance skill you can keep the group thinking it's a Combat Buff spell instead of Inspire Courage (With GM approval I used Storytelling and talked about past heroes filling the group with courage with these tales of Daring do)


Silver Surfer wrote:

Prerequisite(s): Skill Focus (Linguistics).

Benefit: You can attempt a Linguistics check in place of a Use Magic Device check to activate a scroll, or in place of a Spellcraft check to identify a scroll. You must still have (or emulate) the ability score required to cast a spell of the desired level, and you cannot use Linguistics on the check to emulate the required ability score.

I dont see the point - you need to invest a feat just to qualify, you cant use 'take 10' usefully a lot of the time for scroll casting and you cant use linguistics to emulate the ability score (ie WIS).

Why not just stay CHA based for UMD..... for a sorceror its their casting stat!!

Prestige classes for a Razmiran are dodgy (and rightly so!).... you lose out on your FCB (so likely no extra spells known) and you dont progress in your class abilities... no Bloodline Feats, Powers or Spells!.... Ouch!

When a ...... gains a level, he gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in an arcane spellcasting class he belonged to before he added the prestige class. He does not, however, gain any other benefits a character of that class would have gained.

SUMMARY - If you want to optimise a Razmiran... stay a Razmiran !!!

INT gives you a ton more skill points making you a very effective skill monkey. The benefits of a Sage Sorcerer taking Esoteric Linquistics are many:

1. Your UMD for scrolls is now based on your highest Stat.
2. You can take ten to guarantee you can succeed on out of combat buffs/condition removal/etc.
3. You no longer automatically fail on a 1.

It's really pretty impressive.

I do agree that if you have the FCB that lets you add to your spells known you should stay in the Sorcerer Class. If you want to do a 1-2 level dip in Cypher Mage that might be ok, but I certainly would not take any levels until after you get False Channel at 9th. Even the most useful ability for a Razmiran Priest enhance scroll is on a very limited use per day and can be replicated by simply buying a higher CL scroll.


I should note that the most optimal choice for a Sage sorcerer is pragmatic activator. You can view this as taking a trait to get access to triple a CHA sorcerer's skill points. It also saves you two feats and works with false piety's bonus. Unless you really need your magic trait for some reason pragmatic activator is by far the superior option.


In fairness, what a Sage sorceror gives up in terms of arcana and bloodline powers is pretty rough. A familiar or a bonded item are way better than a 3+Int/day 1d4+(1/2 per level) ranged touch attack, and boosting the DC on metamagic'd spells is better than a +2 to some skills.


Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:
A familiar or a bonded item are way better than a 3+Int/day 1d4+(1/2 per level) ranged touch attack

If you want a bonded item you're out of luck, but it looks like you can still take a bloodline familiar in place of arcane bolt.

Grand Lodge

Anzyr wrote:
Silver Surfer wrote:

Prerequisite(s): Skill Focus (Linguistics).

Benefit: You can attempt a Linguistics check in place of a Use Magic Device check to activate a scroll, or in place of a Spellcraft check to identify a scroll. You must still have (or emulate) the ability score required to cast a spell of the desired level, and you cannot use Linguistics on the check to emulate the required ability score.

I dont see the point - you need to invest a feat just to qualify, you cant use 'take 10' usefully a lot of the time for scroll casting and you cant use linguistics to emulate the ability score (ie WIS).

Why not just stay CHA based for UMD..... for a sorceror its their casting stat!!

Prestige classes for a Razmiran are dodgy (and rightly so!).... you lose out on your FCB (so likely no extra spells known) and you dont progress in your class abilities... no Bloodline Feats, Powers or Spells!.... Ouch!

When a ...... gains a level, he gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in an arcane spellcasting class he belonged to before he added the prestige class. He does not, however, gain any other benefits a character of that class would have gained.

SUMMARY - If you want to optimise a Razmiran... stay a Razmiran !!!

INT gives you a ton more skill points making you a very effective skill monkey. The benefits of a Sage Sorcerer taking Esoteric Linquistics are many:

1. Your UMD for scrolls is now based on your highest Stat.
2. You can take ten to guarantee you can succeed on out of combat buffs/condition removal/etc.
3. You no longer automatically fail on a 1.

It's really pretty impressive.

I do agree that if you have the FCB that lets you add to your spells known you should stay in the Sorcerer Class. If you want to do a 1-2 level dip in Cypher Mage that might be ok, but I certainly would not take any levels until after you get False Channel at 9th. Even the most useful ability for a Razmiran Priest enhance scroll is on a very limited use...

Let's see.

1: It takes one of your traits to allow you to do what you naturally did before taking the archetype, since Sorcerers use Charisma as their casting stat, and UMD is a Charisma-based skill...
2: Where do you get that? If you are emulating UMD, don't the restrictions on UMD still apply?
3: Skill checks do not suffer automatic failure on 1s. UMD includes a rider if you don't succeed on a 1, but I would think, if you are emulating the skill, that, again, the restrictions would still apply.
After all, if something gave you the ability to emulate a climbing check with, say, Knowledge (Dungeoneering), wouldn't you still fall if you failed the check by 5 or more?


Well first of all Esoteric Linguistics eats two feats (though you can skate on one if you are half-elf), not a trait. It is not the best choice, but it does have some benefits. The best choice is Pragmatic Activator, which yes costs a trait, but lets a Sage Sorcerer have triple or more Skill Points and lets you be just as good at UMD as the CHA Sorcerer especially since you have more skill points to spend, which is easily worth a trait.

As to your questions:

You are not making a Use Magic Device Check though. You are making a Linguistics check. You cannot take 10 on Use Magic Device, fortunately you are not using Use Magic Device. If you roll a 1 on a Use Magic Device you cannot activate that item for a day. Again though, you are making Linguistics check, not Use Magic Device. Use Magic Device's language is specific to it. As to your example, you would fail the check, because that is the result. Similarly, if you rolled Linguistics but failed rolled the DC to activate a scroll, it fails because that is the consequence of not meeting the DC. The special language for UMD however, is not a result of any check or DC and is purely regulated to itself.


Avoron wrote:

The Sage bloodline is an excellent choice, Int-based casting tends to be very useful.

With that in mind, you could just use Pragmatic Activator to make Use Magic Device based on Intelligence, but I'm a fan of the Skill Focus/Esoteric Linguistics route. You can use Linguistics in place of Use Magic Device to activate scrolls, allowing you to take 10 on your checks and providing access to several other bonuses - there are several traits for +1 to linguistics and gaining it as a class skill, a cracked gold nodule ioun stone gives a very cheap +1 competence bonus, and you can swap out your level 1 bloodline power to get a parrot bloodline familiar that grants you another +3. You can even take Orator for instant prowess at several social skills.

The loss of a level of spellcasting from Pathfinder Savant is annoying. Consider dipping into Cyphermage - you don't lose out on any spellcasting, and every level you can pick from a list of scroll-related abilities. One of these allows you to cast a scroll using your own caster level, and another gives you a huge bonus on caster checks if spell resistance is your issue. Each is only usable a very limited number of times per day, but remember that as a Razmiran Priest you get the ability to cast spells from divine scrolls without expending them, which means that you can just make a one-time investment in some high caster level scrolls and then cast from them over and over at no extra price.

I don't like how limited it is per day for Cyphermage though.

What non-sage bloodlines would those off you against it recommend?


Avoron wrote:
Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:
A familiar or a bonded item are way better than a 3+Int/day 1d4+(1/2 per level) ranged touch attack
If you want a bonded item you're out of luck, but it looks like you can still take a bloodline familiar in place of arcane bolt.

Rules as Written, since Sage Sorcerer is written as an archetype(*) and replaces your 1st level Bloodline Power, and Bloodline Familiar replaces your 1st level Bloodline Power, Sage Sorderer with a Bloodline Familiar is an illegal combination.

(*)And it is 1 of 2 Wildblooded Bloodlines that actually has a good reason for being an archetype rather than a Sub-Bloodline, since it changes your casting stat.

So it might be best to be a normal Sorcerer (and leave UMD on Charisma), but also invest some in Intelligence to get more skill points and boost Intelligence-based skills including Lignuistics.

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