Summon Natures Ally (Celestial / Fiendish Templates)

[Driver 325 yards]

Are summoned nature ally creatures summoned with your choice of celestial or fiendish templates?

[Matthew Downie]

Nope.

[Matthew Downie]

Summon Monster:
"Creatures on Table: Summon Monster marked with an "*" are summoned with the celestial template, if you are good, and the fiendish template, if you are evil"

Summon Nature's Ally:
Does not say the above, and none of the creatures are marked with a "*".

[Driver 325 yards]

Got it. I was wondering why the charts had celestial and fiendish. Its for summon monster. So summon monster is strictly better than summon natures ally?

Is there any advantage that Summon Nature's Ally would have over Summon Monster?

[Set]

Driver 325 yards wrote:

Got it. I was wondering why the charts had celestial and fiendish. Its for summon monster. So summon monster is strictly better than summon natures ally?

Is there any advantage that Summon Nature's Ally would have over Summon Monster?

The druid's summon nature's ally list appears to be weaker by design, as it's attached to a class that's already pretty buff with the wild shape and animal companion features.

Some giants and a few fey are on the list later (replacing the outsiders on the summon monster list), although the outsiders on the cleric/wizard through summon monster offer a lot more versatility. I thought that elementals arrived a bit sooner, and that there might be a few genies on the list, but I'm probably having 3.X flashbacks, as that does not appear to be the case :)

[Whyzard]

Generally summon monster has the edge on summon nature's ally. However class features, feats and magic items can interact with them radically. Especially in books like Advance Class Guide, The Harrowed Handbook and the Monster Summoner's Handbook.
Just in the Core Rulebook the Druid's spontaneous casting ability means even though his spells are memorized, that he's always got some versatility that the Wizard and Cleric have to work for to match.
And there are ways to apply celestial & fiendish templates to summon nature's ally. And then some! Such as skeletal, chthonic, fiery and resolute being just a few...

[Casual Viking]

Driver 325 yards wrote:

Got it. I was wondering why the charts had celestial and fiendish. Its for summon monster. So summon monster is strictly better than summon natures ally?

Is there any advantage that Summon Nature's Ally would have over Summon Monster?

Summon Monster is almost, but not quite, strictly better. SNA has a few gems not on the SM list: The Satur at SNA IV and the Cyclops at SNA V. Also, SM critters almost always have an alignment, and are thus vulnerable to Protection From [Alignment] spells, whereas SNA critters are usually Neutral.

Other than that, Summon Monster tends to have much better creatures, especially once you get into the real outsiders at spell level 5+, or if you take Summon Good Monster.

[Ascalaphus]

One gem on the SNA I list is the stirge. With SNA III you get 1d4+1 stirges, that's quite a bit of blood drain per round.

[Driver 325 yards]

Whyzard wrote:

Generally summon monster has the edge on summon nature's ally. However class features, feats and magic items can interact with them radically. Especially in books like Advance Class Guide, The Harrowed Handbook and the Monster Summoner's Handbook.

Just in the Core Rulebook the Druid's spontaneous casting ability means even though his spells are memorized, that he's always got some versatility that the Wizard and Cleric have to work for to match.
And there are ways to apply celestial & fiendish templates to summon nature's ally. And then some! Such as skeletal, chthonic, fiery and resolute being just a few...

Thanks for the answers. How can you get celestial and fiendish on SNA?