How often does one Houserule?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


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More of a curious question then anything else, but how many of you utilize or are in games with Houserules?

If so, what are these houserules? Do you see a common houserule mutliple times?

Comment below, let your houserules be known. As an example for myself, characters that have multiple attacks can use their swift action to make that second attack.

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Icy Turbo wrote:

More of a curious question then anything else, but how many of you utilize or are in games with Houserules?

If so, what are these houserules? Do you see a common houserule mutliple times?

Comment below, let your houserules be known. As an example for myself, characters that have multiple attacks can use their swift action to make that second attack.

It depends on what you mean by house rules. In terms of structural stuff that's always in place, I have a handful designed to either promote the low magic, high PC survivability type of games I tend to run (reroll hit die results under 1/2 the die's maximum, level-based defense and save bonuses) or get the setting in line with what I see as making more sense (prepared casters select a pool of spells and cast spontaneously from that instead of firing and forgetting).

I also house rule like mad in a session, usually as a result of me forgetting a rule. My general policy is that if I can't find a rule after 60 seconds of flipping through the book, I make something up and look up the actual rule later. Sometimes those made up rules stick around, while other times they disappear and get replaced by the actual rule in later sessions.


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I used to make house rules for anny game I ran. However, over the years I realized that the differences in gameplay were only important to me, and that the best house come about through group discussion and consensus, not by one person creating them all and imposing them on the group.

Grand Lodge

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Icy Turbo wrote:

More of a curious question then anything else, but how many of you utilize or are in games with Houserules?

Having played various incarnations since 1980, I would say that there is no such thing as a game that doesn't use house rules. Even Paizo does for it's Network Campaign, it's houserules can fill a small book.

House ruling is neccessary because the game needs to be fitted to each group and campaign, and to make things work, DMs tweak the system to varying degrees.

It's neccessary.... and a virtue.

Anyone who says they don't use houserules is either unaware, lying, or a GM who hasn't learned his art.


Tailoring your game to what your players need is the difference between everyone having fun and not IMO.

But I would have no idea how to tailor a game to a group that I didn't know. It's taken me 14 months to learn what my close friends like. In that respect I kinda miss AD&D back in the 80s.

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I think one would be hard-pressed to find a game that's NOT using houserules. Even organized play has its own set of houserules (such as banning crafting and therefore giving wizards a replacement bonus feat in lieu of Scribe Scroll).

For myself, I mostly run PbP these days. As such, I have a "houserule" of sorts in being kind of loose with movement and positioning so that I don't have to use a map. (Playing 5E instead of Pathfinder helps with this too.)

Another thing I've started doing is offering players the option to pick whatever ability scores they want in order to enable their concept (rolling was an option too). Interestingly, I've had next to no one actually take the pick-your-stats method so far. Go figure.


One house rule I use across all systems is to allow players three sessions to rework their characters, because some ideas seem great on paper but turn out to be not not fun. I also like to borrow stuff from more narrative systems such as Dungeon World.

Silver Crusade

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I house rule essentially every session. Players (at least my players) have a habit of coming up with ideas that aren't exactly covered in the standard rules. As for examples, hard to recall, really, tends to be very situational stuff that happens on the fly.


LazarX wrote:
Anyone who says they don't use houserules is either unaware, lying, or a GM who hasn't learned his art.

I will amend my previous statement to say that our group undoubtedly has some rules we interpret differently from others or simply do not choose to implement.

For example, poison in the S&S AP has been kicking our butts in a bad, bad way and our GM recently realised that while he has been increasing the DC when someone is poisoned more than once, he hadn't been increasing the duration. We have had so many deaths in the AP so far that I think he decided not increase the duration moving forward. Doing so would not lead to any benefit whatsoever. So there is that. Also encumbrance. No one really goes crazy with what they carry, but we don't actually count the pounds carried.

I supppose what I meant is that we don't have any house rules like "fighters and clerics get 2 extra skill points per level" or "wizards don't get two free spells per level because magic is rare".


I often allow monsters as playable races, and templates/feats from the Bestiary as well.


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Yes.

My house rules are:

1. No Summoners:
I dislike them, they are a pain in the butt, and are very power gamey.

2. No Gunslingers:
They don't fit in fantasy and require a ton of extra work for the GM.

3. WBL isn't a rule, its a suggestion.
I tend to be around WBL but I don't reimburse for potions and such. If you buy it, then use it, its gone. Also if you want to spend your GP however you want to, be my guest, that's what it's for.

4. No 3PP stuff.
There isn't anything wrong with 3PP books but I don't have time to learn every 3PP book and learn every interaction in 3PP material.

5. I reserve the right to talk to any player about any problem that pops up. I don't allow powergaming or munchkinning in general unless the group is all about that. If something is upsetting the game I reserve the right to remove/nerf/balance it. I rarely have to do this.

6. Everyone should have fun.
If everyone isn't having fun then what's the point of playing?


@ HWalsh

With the exception of the no gunslingers rule, our table is very similar. We allow summoners but not master summoners.


I have a few house rules to help streamline the game

1.) no gold weight (unless extreme circumstance, like they raid a dragon horde)

2.) They dont need to worry about food unless extreme situation. survival checks are easy to make

3.) No encumbrance in general, except extreme examples.

4.) Fighters get some nice little buffs, juat little ones to keep their.characters kore relevant

5.) my personal favorite, the 3-20 rule. If a player rolls a natural 20, normal natural crit rulea follow BUT they roll again. If they crit again, they roll again and if they crit a third time (1/8000) chance, the player gets to decide what happens next. If the player gets two crits, or one crit and a 19 or something, i just spice it up a bit more ontop of the normal rules. same thing applies fornatural 1s.

So far ive had 3 natural 1s in a row and 1 natural 20 3 times in a row. good times.


HWalsh wrote:


3. WBL isn't a rule, its a suggestion.
I tend to be around WBL but I don't reimburse for potions and such. If you buy it, then use it, its gone. Also if you want to spend your GP however you want to, be my guest, that's what it's for.

4. No 3PP stuff.
There isn't anything wrong with 3PP books but I don't have time to learn every 3PP book and learn every interaction in 3PP material.

Literally not houserules.


Our group uses a lot of house rules (about nine sides of A4 paper). We’ve all been gaming since the early 1980s (or before that in my case), everyone DMs and we don’t have any of the social inadequates or non-team players that seem to plague many other groups.

Our six main changes are:

Characters – PCs are limited to 10th level, but they can get higher level class abilities (except spells), buy ability points, more spells per day, more spells known, extra feats, etc. It’s E10 but we give out hero points instead of experience points and hero points are used to buy levels, better abilities, etc. You also gain 1 feat for every level you take in a class which does not give you spells.

Combat – Armour and Natural Armour give damage reduction. Characters gain armour class bonuses based upon their class and level (e.g. Reflex bonus from classes = Dodge bonus to AC).

Spells – Defensive casting does not exist (take the attacks of opportunity instead). If you take a 5 foot step and then cast a spell you remain liable to attacks of opportunity in the square that you left. A lot of spells have been rendered less powerful (Haste only affects 1 creature) or simply banned (e.g. teleport). Spells which give unnamed bonuses now give enhancement bonuses (this stops a lot of bonus stacking).

Hit points – Everything gets roughly 15 to 20 more hit points at 1st level. All hit dice DX are changed to ½DX + ½X (e.g. D10 becomes D5+5).

Magic items – Characters are restricted in the number of magic items that they can be “attuned” to. If you’re not attuned to an item then you can’t use its magic. This stops characters from looking like magic item Christmas Trees. Also all items which increase ability points are banned.

Game play – We employ several rules to speed up play and to make the DM’s job easier. For example, if you don’t say what spell you are casting during combat (e.g. you just say “I cast a spell”) then the DM will have you cast a spell at random. Also if it is your turn to act in combat you cannot look up a spell in the rulebooks unless you cast it (this saves a lot of game time). If you cast a spell and don’t tell the DM the DC for saving throws against it then the DC is 10 (hey, if you're too lazy to tell the DM what your spell does then you can't be all that interested in it!). And if you dither for too long when it is your turn to act then your initiative score is changed to 1.


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All classes: minimum skill points per level: 4+Int

All characters with a base attack bonus of +1 will be considered to have the feat Power Attack with any weapon that they are proficient in. Characters are considered to qualify for feats with Power Attack as a prerequisite. Characters using Weapon Finesse may use Power Attack, but will not receive a 50% bonus for wielding a weapon two handed.

All characters with a base attack bonus of +1 will be considered to have the feat Combat Expertise and will automatically qualify for any feats that require Combat Expertise as a prerequisite.

All feats with Point Blank Shot listed as a prerequisite no longer have it as a prerequisite. You may still select it if you wish and it grants the benefit of the Deadly Aim feat as well as it's printed benefit.

All characters with a base attack bonus of +1, and at least two skill ranks in Ride, will be considered to have the feat Mounted Combat.

Add the following to Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Focus: At BaB 4(12) you gain(deal) an additional 1 to hit(2 points of damage) with the selected weapon. Weapon Specialization and Greater Weapon Specialization no longer exist as feats.

(Off limits): Leadership, Craft Wonderous Item, Blood Money, Masterwork Transformation, Miracle, Limited Wish & Wish

When used out of combat and applied like an oil, Potions of Cure X Wounds are maximized.

Armor worn weights 1/4 the amount for purposes of encumbrance.


I've had a few house rules going from very early, and I stick with them because they work really well: Roll for hp twice and take the better result. You add your Con modifier as well as your HD when regaining hp from a long rest.

I'm also starting to write up a longer list that I want to use in the next game I run, though I'll make sure that the players read it through and give their opinion as well. After all, they'll probably use them more than I.
Those house rules are mostly aimed to remove annoyances and extra numbers that doesn't really add to the game experience or to make some fun and cool material less sub-par.

Some examples: You can change, once each day, what weapon you focus on whit feats that require you to choose one weapon (like Weapon Focus), this is to add some versatility to martial characters and not force them to stick to a specific kind of weapon through out the entire campaign.
All none-INT based classes gets a minimum of 4+Int skill ranks / level.
Even the Wizard gets a buff, they no longer have to make a concentration check if they don't have their bonded object at hand. Due to action economy, familiars already have a huge advantage and the fact that they can die and not affect the Wizard's ability to cast makes them a much more attractive option than bonded object. But I don't want that option to be closed and that every "good" wizard runs around with a familiar.


If you don't think you have 100+ houserules in play right now, then you either haven't read the rulebook very closely/critically, or your game is a novelty lawyer adventure.

Take the skills chapter, as just a random example. The fly skill alone has almost no consensus on literally like 50% of the text in it, I've never met a single group that follows even 20% of the social skills (diplomacy, bluff, etc.) rules for more than a session or two (if they're new), almost all groups ignore handle animal or pay it a cartoonish nod at best, I don't think I've ever seen a single appraise check made in game, most players and GMs don't know you can take 10 on anything but UMD, or that you can roll "trained only" skills up to 10 untrained, spellcraft started forum wars every week until the recent FAQ ruling on it, people all disagree on whether sense motive, knowledges, and perception should require requesting rolls or should be passively indicated by the GM, or if the GM should roll them, etc. Could go on and on on just that example chapter alone, getting tired of typing. Same goes for most of the rest of the book.


My group has quite a few standing house rules:

E6 - High level play got too crazy for us.

Heroic Bonuses - A level-based point system designed to eliminate big-6 magic items and the "magic mart". Similar to Unchained's Automatic Bonuses, but more flexible.

Strain-Injury - An alternate healing mechanic designed to eliminate the need for "heal sticks".

Unchained Background Skills

Unchained Revised Action Economy - with a number of additions to make the rules fully functional (address Disabled, Nauseated, Staggered, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Flyby Attack, etc.)

Unchained Poison and Disease

Modified Environmental Rules - An attempt to make the environmental effects more relevant while reducing the number of saves to a more manageable level. We're still testing this one.

No coin weight

From time to time, a few rules are modified, usually to make a character concept work. Stuff like smoothing over the whip/scorpion whip rules for the Bard and eliminating the need for Ranged Study so an Investigator with a bow doesn't entirely suck.


Mike J wrote:

Unchained Revised Action Economy - with a number of additions to make the rules fully functional (address Disabled, Nauseated, Staggered, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Flyby Attack, etc.)

Oh hey. Can you elaborate on this a little? I'm about to implement this, and I know not everything is covered in the book.

If I had to guess, Staggered is -1 act, and Nauseated is -2 acts? Also, how did you do Rapid/Many shot? I was going to treat them similar to two weapon fighting rules.


House Rule?

Rules argument? Let's consult the print and/or the SRD together and come up with a ruling on the spot, please forgive me my shortcomings.

Featured & Uncommon Races are go-go-go!

If you are dissatisfied with your character, you can retrain yourself or introduce a new one but your old one gets retired/put on the magical bus. Asset equivalent transferred over by raw value. It's usually a recommendation by the group as a whole, not a Player request that unlocks this option.

Excess loot is worthless: expedite liquidation by opting to sell all magic loot and mundane items at 50% market value once party is consolidated in a phase/act of a campaign. "99 +1 Longswords on the wall, 99 weapons I can't use! Take one down, pass it around, 98 +1 Longswords on the wall!"

Loot upon distribution are bid for by necessity (as in will you use it NAO?!) and consent by group. It is now yours 4evah to do with as you see fit until I see you exploiting the market -like Dude, are you That Guy? Excess just became group asset for future liquidation. No excess hoarding unless you are clever enough to hide your growing collection of magic armor and petty rings no one wants but you bid for every single drop.

Unless campaign/circumstances dictate: Core! There's enough supplements out there by Paizo to satisfy any Munchkin. Why circumstantial? I love Gestalt when I only have 1 or 2 Players to run alongside.

If I make everyone have to roll in sight of each other like in a box or a common surface... the group has a suspected liar. Maybe that dude that with medium saves/attack that succeeded 23 times in a row, and only fails Perception or Knowledge or confirmation...

If Players want to fight, I will not interfere, but referee. If it is viewed to be Bullying, then the DM unlocks the Meta Cabinet. I won't force people to get along, and I'll let them weed each other out of a group, but if I perceive victimization a counter-campaign run by the DM just began and a game within a game ensues ^_^. I do so love enabling justice...

Enemies go on their Wave's initiative. It just simplifies things, sorry.

If I lose track of when you are/aren't in character when we are immersed actively, do not be surprised when the world starts reflecting the wonderful things coming out of your craw.

Feel free to pursue non-obtrusive activities during the session, but don't be surprised if you get skipped/marginalized so I can keep everyone one else paying attention engaged and rewarded for their dedication.

Everyone gets a turn at the Idiot-err-Leader Ball. Unless they are that shy, then we just find a way to give that Player a spotlight they would be comfortable with.

Please do something drastic. I live to see Players do the most wonderful things.

The players get EXP individually, but I may bring a lagging player to parity with the next fellow but without the gear -I expect the group to lend a hand outfitting someone whose hands their lives may depend on someday. Pay it forward.


This has been pretty awesome so far guys.

A couple of house rules I recently started with my group are as follows, mostly because they were a clean slate and I wanted to see if the rules were well done or not.

A character decrease their Armor Check Penalty by their Strength Modifier, which caps at 0.

Diplomacy and Intimidate gain a -2 modifier for every HD a creature has higher then your own. This keeps power from these skills appropriate for the players, and also prevents a CR 20 dragon from being diplomed as early as Level 4.

Gunslinger is fine, but early firearms only, and if you do find guns they will be rare.

If you bring anything to the table that is part of Campaign Settings or Player Companions, you must bring the actual book or PDF with you to show what the rules are and where you got them from.

No Catfolk.


HWalsh wrote:

3. WBL isn't a rule, its a suggestion.

I tend to be around WBL but I don't reimburse for potions and such. If you buy it, then use it, its gone. Also if you want to spend your GP however you want to, be my guest, that's what it's for.

The WBL guidelines explicitly say "... some of this treasure is consumed in the course of an adventure (such as potions and scrolls)..."

Further, characters don't just magically have their WBL - it's a guidelines of the total amount of treasure a character should have obtained via "treasure and loot gained from adventuring".


Avaricious wrote:
Loot upon distribution are bid for by necessity (as in will you use it NAO?!) and consent by group. It is now yours 4evah to do with as you see fit until I see you exploiting the market -like Dude, are you That Guy? Excess just became group asset for future liquidation. No excess hoarding unless you are clever enough to hide your growing collection of magic armor and petty rings no one wants but you bid for every single drop.

In every game I play and run, treasure distribution is purely an in-game, character-driven decision and the GM has exactly zero input in this discussion unless explicitly asked for advice.


Zenogu wrote:
Mike J wrote:

Unchained Revised Action Economy - with a number of additions to make the rules fully functional (address Disabled, Nauseated, Staggered, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Flyby Attack, etc.)

Oh hey. Can you elaborate on this a little? I'm about to implement this, and I know not everything is covered in the book.

If I had to guess, Staggered is -1 act, and Nauseated is -2 acts? Also, how did you do Rapid/Many shot? I was going to treat them similar to two weapon fighting rules.

Sure. Putting it in a spoiler since it isn't on topic

Spoiler:
My RAE adjustments:

Disabled: A disabled character can commit a single action (requiring up to 2 acts to perform) each turn. A disabled character moves at half speed. Taking an action with the Move subtype or no subtype doesn't risk further injury, but performing any Complex or Attack action (or any other action the GM deems strenuous, including some Simple actions such as Cast a Swift Spell) deals 1 point of damage after the completion of the act.

Nauseated: Creatures with the nauseated condition experience stomach distress. Nauseated creatures can commit a single action (requiring up to 2 acts to perform) each turn and are unable to attack, cast spells (including swift spells), concentrate on spells, or do anything else requiring attention (no Complex or Attack actions). The creature can only take an action with the Move subtype or no subtype.

Staggered: A staggered character can commit a single action (requiring up to 2 acts to perform) each turn. A creature with nonlethal damage exactly equal to its current hit points gains the staggered condition.

Some Swift Actions Are Once Per Round Free Actions: A swift action that are supposed to be faster versions of an action that is already a simple action are free actions usable once per round. Swift actions that are part of a 1 round effect (ki point for an additional attack, etc.) are free actions usable once per round.

Flurry of Blows (Unchained Monk): At 1st level, an unchained monk gains an additional act that can only be used to make a Simple Attack action with an unarmed strike or monk weapon. At 11th level, an unchained monk gain another additional act that can only be used to make a Simple Attack action with an unarmed strike or monk weapon. These additional Simple Attack actions do not suffer subsequent attack penalties or count towards subsequent attack penalties for other Simple Attack actions. These additional attacks stack with the bonus attacks from haste and other similar effects.

Flyby Attack: When flying, the creature can take the rest of its actions at any point during a Move Simple action. The creature cannot take additional Move actions during a round when it makes a flyby attack.

Pounce: When a creature with this special attack makes a Charge, it can make all its natural attacks (including rake attacks if the creature also has the rake ability) as a Simple Attack action following the Charge.

Ranged Combat: If you have the Rapid Shot feat, you can make two ranged attack rolls with a –2 penalty on your first ranged Simple Attack action during a turn. If you have the Manyshot feat, you can make two ranged attack rolls on both the first and second ranged Simple Attack actions taken during your furn; both of the attacks made on the first Attack action are made at a –2 penalty, and both of the attacks made on the second Attack action are made at a –7 penalty.

Spring Attack: Using Spring Attack is an Advanced Attack Move action requiring 2 acts.

Make All Natural Attacks: The creature can also take one Step as a free action. The Step can be taken before, between, or after the natural attacks.

I have others adjustments for Mythic, but boil down to Mythic stuff is once per round as a free action with a few restrictions.


MeanMutton wrote:
Avaricious wrote:
Loot upon distribution are bid for by necessity (as in will you use it NAO?!) and consent by group. It is now yours 4evah to do with as you see fit until I see you exploiting the market -like Dude, are you That Guy? Excess just became group asset for future liquidation. No excess hoarding unless you are clever enough to hide your growing collection of magic armor and petty rings no one wants but you bid for every single drop.
In every game I play and run, treasure distribution is purely an in-game, character-driven decision and the GM has exactly zero input in this discussion unless explicitly asked for advice.

As a GM and player, that's how I prefer to handle it as long as loot distribution isn't a problem. However, I've certainly encountered games where loot was being split up pretty unfairly and it lead to unhappy players. Sometimes it's the recovered loot favoring certain classes, sometimes it's a table dynamic where one guy always grabs the best items and nobody else wants to start drama by confronting him, or it might just be that nobody else notices that one player isn't getting any good items.

The bottom line, if some characters aren't getting an equal-ish share of the treasure, it can make the game less fun for the players. Since part of the GM's job description is to look out for things that are disrupting everyone's fun...


Every game, every session.
Most important rule: the Rule of Cool.
If it doesn't break too many game mechanics and it's too awesome to not have happen, it happens.

We Be Goblins
Poog wants to drink that Gourd of Fire Breath and jump down the frog's throat, unleashing firey destruction from the inside.
The frog is an animal companion, and has yet to hit the level bump to get Swallow Whole.
Rule of Cool.
"Ok, so Poog chugs the mysterious gourd juice the chieftan rewarded him with and leaps into the maw of the frog..."

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