New Brass Knuckles description. Are you considered armed?


Rules Questions


If my sorcerer is wearing brass knuckles on both hands, and is also holding a wand in each hand, does she threaten attacks of opportunity?


What is the "new" description you're referring to?


How does your sorcerer ever cast a spell?

I own brass knuckles. I've used them (only on wooden targets). I could not imagine being effective with them while holding anything, even a wand.

However, the RAW says you cannot wield the weapon you hold, but it doesn't say that holding things makes it difficult to wield the brass knuckles, so yes, you should be able to wear brass knuckles and count as armed for AoOs, even while also holding wands.

As a GM, I wouldn't really care, even though I don't think it would work. I should impose at least a penalty, perhaps the basic non-proficiency penalty is enough (to use them proficiently, you close your fist around the "handle" part of brass knuckles which fits nicely in the palm of your hand; holding a wand means you cannot do this). But really, letting a sorcerer punch someone for a d2 damage once per round doesn't really seem like I should care, so I would rule with the RAW. However, if I ruled that way and then some player found a way to exploit that generosity to the point that I regretted it, I would revoke that ruling and impose the penalty.


Sanjiv wrote:
If my sorcerer is wearing brass knuckles on both hands, and is also holding a wand in each hand, does she threaten attacks of opportunity?

"You may hold, but not wield". AFAICT, you can't use your brass knuckle hand to activate a wand. But you would count as armed even while holding the wand.


@ Casual Viking regarding "new" description: Changed from their original form, apparently to remove references to 'unarmed attacks.'

@ DM_Blake, @ "how does your sorcerer ever cast a spell?: Do you mean to say that spells with somatic components can't be used if the sorcerer has two hands full with wands? Therefore it would be the wands, not the brass knuckles, that prevent him from casting?

@ Casual Viking: "You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object"
I suppose the question is what "wielding an other object" means. I take it to mean an improvised weapon. I'll discuss wands and wayfinders to demonstrate my interpretation:

On the subject of "wielding" wands, "Wands use the spell trigger activation method, so casting a spell from a wand is usually a standard action that doesn't provoke attacks of opportunity. ... To activate a wand, a character must hold it in hand... and point it in the general direction of the target or area. A wand may be used while grappling or while swallowed whole." That action (holding and pointing) is not described as being an attack, nor is it described as anything that a brass knuckle would prevent.

On the subject of "wielding" some other non-weapon object, like, say, a Wayfinder's compass, I imagine it'd be a free action to loosen your grip enough to use the compass, and a free action to switch back into action mode, and therefore it seems that one could still use the wayfinder while having a brass knuckle equipped, although you couldn't "wield" the wayfinder as an improvised weapon.

I imagine this would be the design intent of the brass-knuckle.

But are we sure that the brass-knuckle threatens? Is it essentially a Bludgeoning alternative to the spiked gauntlet, and thus superior to the normal gauntlet, in that it has no relation to 'unarmed strikes?' That's really the rules question I'm not sure about.


Sanjiv wrote:
@ DM_Blake, @ "how does your sorcerer ever cast a spell?: Do you mean to say that spells with somatic components can't be used if the sorcerer has two hands full with wands? Therefore it would be the wands, not the brass knuckles, that prevent him from casting?

Exactly.

Your hands are pretty full having both a weapon and a wand in each hand - I would never count that as "having a free hand" for somatic components of spellcasting.

Heck, I'd probably not rule against using a wand while wearing brass knuckles. I'm pretty sure I can hold a Harry Potter sized wand in my hand (grasping it with my fingertips) while wearing my brass knuckles, and still wave it about and point accurately with it. It's very small and light and would not be a problem.

But trying to do that with a sword and brass knuckles is out of the question, of course - wielding a sword with my fingertips would be extremely ineffective. And it doesn't work by RAW.

As I said in my previous post, I believe RAW lets you punch with the brass knuckles even while holding a wand, but I personally disagree with that rule and would house rule otherwise.


@sanjiv see if your sorc could get ahold of a cestus instead (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/cest us). Same concept but as a glove.

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