The Unmage - kill casters and take their stuff


Homebrew and House Rules


Hey gang.
So I cobbled this class together a few months ago. The idea was basically to create a mage/witch-hunter type class that gains access to just enough magical tricks to mess with spellcasters on their own terms. In that sense, it's not a "mage killer" class in the oft-popular sense I've seen in other homebrew where you create this completely non-magical (usually d10 HD/full BAB) class that's just really good at killing casters. These guys were more envisioned as anti-magic agents, tracking and hunting down casters and dispelling their spells, et cetera. Kind of a high-magic concept from a flavor standpoint, I suppose.

Anyway, here's a link to the Google Drive Folder containing the class:

Unmage Files

There's only two documents in there, one for the main class, and then one containing a list of its "selectable talents" class features, which I've dubbed "abarcanas".

So, I hope people enjoy. The class hasn't gone through playtesting yet, so I'm sure there are potentially plenty of kinks both big and small that need ironing out. Any and all comments welcome!

Cheers,
- Gears


Love it.

This really feels like it should be a Rogue archetype, getting rid of sneak attack and uncanny dodge and changing out the tricks. Either that or I think you can just grant Evasion and Magical Trapfinder for free.

For Fumbling Feint, I would swap the penalty to CL and DCs. -5 or 6 to CL can be brutal. And with RAW, this can make it so they can't cast any spells at all. A wizzard needs to be at least CL 5 to cast his 3rd level spells.

Teleportation Stalker, I think better flavor would be something like this:
If a creature teleports away within line of sight of the Unmage, and if the Unmage enters the square that the creature left within 1 round per intelligence modifier, she can spend 5 feet of movement and one daily use of her unspell ability to teleport to the same target square the creature teleported to.
You might also be able to combine Trace Teleport into that Abarcana

Turn Magery: I would recommend that you change this to Summoned creatures and Spellcasting Outsiders. If you want, also add in a free demoralize check against all other spellcasters.

Unmage's Dodge: This is really broken. I would have it just be the deflection bonus against spells. Also, you mean Shield, not Mage Armor.

Edit: Will continue editing this post as I read more.

Edit Edit: Done editing :)

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I'm not sure what the point of these classes are. Any solo caster is meat to a party of appropriate level. Are you trying to create a class that does this solo?

Dark Archive

story wise they sound like the assassins from diablo 2 an order of mages that, realizing the dangers of channeling magic and seeing mages driven to make deals with demons to gain more power, don't use magic themselves but through traps. yours however seems to be "screw magic I'ma punch you for even learning the stuff" and then as the gm all I have to do is make encounters that have no magic at all yet still give you "warm hinny fuzzies".


@LazarX: Hi, LazarX! I hope you have a wonderful day! :)

@Scud: That's a good catch. Fumbling Feint is wonkily balanced. I don't think I need to swap the penalties though, just reduce the CL one. Not sure how that ability passed through my second or third rewrite unscathed. A bit embarrassing. Apologies. As for your other point, I'm actually considering doling out a few abarcanas for free, or possibly just increasing the number you get to one every even-numbered class level. We'll see. Both are options, as the class is hardly on the overpowered side of the equation.

@Carishia: I should probably mention that I have zero familiarity with the Diablo franchise, but other than that I'm not really sure what your point is? While unable to parse most of your post, if you're concerned that the class is rather helpless against foes possessing no magic, this is indeed the case. As of right now though (after some similar critique over on the OOTS boards), I'm primarily focused on giving the unmage more options against magical but non-caster foes. As for wholly unmagical foes, we'll see if some flavor-appropriate means of giving the unmage a small boost against those can be figured out.

Thanks for the comments.

Cheers,
- Gears

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ethereal Gears wrote:

@LazarX: Hi, LazarX! I hope you have a wonderful day! :)

@Scud: That's a good catch. Fumbling Feint is wonkily balanced. I don't think I need to swap the penalties though, just reduce the CL one. Not sure how that ability passed through my second or third rewrite unscathed. A bit embarrassing. Apologies.

@Carishia: I should probably mention that I have zero familiarity with the Diablo franchise, but other than that I'm not really sure what your point is? While unable to parse most of your post, if you're concerned that the class is rather helpless against foes possessing no magic, this is indeed the case. As of right now though (after some similar critique over on the OOTS boards), I'm primarily focused on giving the unmage more options against magical but non-caster foes. As for wholly unmagical foes, we'll see if some flavor-appropriate means of giving the unmage a small boost against those can be figured out.

Thanks for the comments.

Cheers,
- Gears

I'm serious what is the goal of designing an "anti-caster" class given that many classes including other casters have anti-caster features built into them... or features that work wonderfully well on casters such as readied actions and vital strikes, or counterspell feats?


I've finished reading over the entire thing and have edited my first post with all my suggestions so far.


I suppose it comes from a persistent fantasy trope of there existing things such as witch hunters and mage slayers, et cetera. I agree it's a quite narrow character concept, and I see how many people would say, "that's not broad enough for a base class, it's archetype material at best." I, however, happen to like base classes with rather narrow focuses, but that's a question of taste, I dare say.

The idea here is basically to have someone who does two things and does them well: kill and track casters and other magick-y things, and mess with their magic. Of course plenty of other classes have anti-caster mechanics, but these guys are wholly focused on them. This isn't about "casters being OP and here's a class that can wreak revenge on behalf of wronged martials everywhere". I think the martial-caster disparity is an overrated concept, albeit an existent one. But what I basically wanted to create was "a fighter/spell-less ranger with dispel magic on tap and some other cool anti-magic abilities". Are there options aplenty for dealing with casters? Of course. But this class, at least that's the design goal, is supposed to do it with greater finesse and focus than existing options.

Hope that clears some of it up.

EDIT: @Scud: Your suggestions have been taken aboard. As noted, Fumbling Feint is getting change and somehow we are going to give these guys access to more abarcanas, either by increasing the number or by doling a few of them out as static class features. Thanks for the notes! :)

Cheers,
- Gears


If this were a Full BAB class, one idea I gleaned from the legion of martial threads is a simple "counterspell equal to BAB" schtick...


@Oceanshieldwolf: I'm sure that's an idea that has merit. I think you will find, though, if you look through the class, that counterspelling is one area wherein the unmage has absolutely no problems. :)

EDIT: Also, as stated, and just to clarify, this class wasn't written in the spirit of being some sort of bitter, vindictive "martials vs. casters" thing. It is unabashedly itself a magical class, but it's magic is extremely focused on disrupting that traditional spellcasters.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

What can they contribute when not stalking mages?

I like the class, btw. Just wonder how bored a player would be if not running into casters all the time.


@Kryzbyn: Well, for starters, there are a number of abarcanas which broaden the class' capabilities, allowing them to deal with things other than spellcasters, as well as gaining other interesting abilities. No doubt these can and should be expanded upon, and this expansion should probably be aided by doling out a larger number of abarcanas across the unmage's career, which I'm leaning more and more towards being a solution to quite a few of the class' current shortcomings. In short, the easiest way of answering your own question I daresay would be to review the full list of abarcanas, to see whether they meet your requirements for versatility or if you feel they need adding to.

I'm glad you like the class at any rate. :)

Cheers,
- Gears


Hey Gears. I like the class, despite the name. I can stomach Unmage, but Abarcana? Those talents need a way better name.

Some things I noticed:
Unmage Dodge: Dodge bonus already apply against touch attacks. The only advantage of deflection bonus is that it works against incorporeal. Changing the type for spells does nothing. Just make it a straight deflection bonus. It also saves the class a ring slot.

Trace teleport: Could this also include a free perception check if someone teleports into that 60ft area? Sensing a mage teleporting in for a Scry and Fry could be more useful than finding where he goes when he runs away.

Null healing: No problem I just wanted to say how much I love that the Unmage can counter Channel Energy.

Instantaneous Dispelling: This would allow the Unamage to Dispell two spells right? One with a readied action and one with an immediate action?

I agree with Scud22 on Fumbling Feint, Teleportation Stalker and Turn Magery

Ideas for new Abarcanas: It needs something to handle incorporeal and the miss chance from Blink, basically getting Ghost Touch. Some anti-undead/antinecromancy would also help the class, since undead are common minions of casters and many undead are also casters.
Maybe an abarcana that hurts someone that tries to dominate/charm or one that fools scrying into seeying something you wish them to see, like Fool Spell but for divination.
Also you need something against illusions, like a bonus to disbelieve and perhaps diminishing the reality of a illusion by 10 percent, kinda the opposite of what a shadewright.
The class could use some way to mess with Familiars, Animal Companions, Eidolons, Phantons and other caster sidekicks. Maybe an Abarcana that makes them count as summoned for Dominate Minions, Turn magery and other Abarcanas like that.

Finally to extend the class use against things that aren't casters you could add Abarcanas, or mabe archetypes, dealing with creature types that are normally but not always spellcasters, like if you have Eldritch Slayer against Dragons you can spend a use of Unspell to gain flight, energy resistance and natural armor, if you have it against constructs you gain DR and the ability to ignore DR and hardiness and if you choose magic beasts you can gain scent and darkvision and something else.

Dark Archive

I don't see the purpose of gaining complete spell immunity at level 20, if you gain 15+Class Level at 19 level (which is already a good ammount).


Thanks for the feedback, guys.

@mercenario: Well, I mean, I think abarcanas is a fun name for an ability suite, so, like, I don't know what to tell you on that score. What would you change it to?

Good catch on unmage's dodge. I'll fix it.

I could probably add that to trace teleport. It's not an overpowered ability or anything, so expanding its use seems totally fair.

Yeah, instantaneous dispelling would allow that. It's not unprecedented, though. Arcanists can do the exact same thing via the counterspell exploit. Not that you were saying it's OP or anything. I just wanted to add that for clarification.

I like all your abarcana ideas and your suggestion for expanding eldritch slayer. I'm adding them all to my list of things I'll try to implement one way or another. I'm kinda working on a lot of homebrew stuff simultaneously right now, so this class is a bit on the backburner, but since it's gotten so much attention I'm definitely looking to revise it based on all these helpful critiques I've gotten at least before the year is out; hopefully sooner.

@Kord: Well, immunity to magic is this really iconic golem ability and I just thought it seemed a badass thing to grant to a PC. I also don't think it's overpowered at 20th level, where any optimized caster laughs out loud at SR anyway (not in terms of the amount, but in terms of having plenty of options for destroying you that never even get within smelling distance of needing to overcome SR). So that's basically my reasoning. Sure, it might seem a little bit gratuitous, since the unmage kinda already gets a capstone via the spellbane ability, but for now I think it seems fine and fitting. I might change it if more people think it doesn't belong.

Cheers,
- Gears

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Homebrew and House Rules / The Unmage - kill casters and take their stuff All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Homebrew and House Rules