What's a good PC mix for this AP?


Giantslayer

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Hello,

I just bought this AP, and was wondering what party build would work for this AP.

So far, I've come up with:
an archer, preferably a Fighter for all the feats necessary
an cavalier, because there's lots of room to maneuver and lance charges

What classes would work? What sort of party balance?

Also, what races would work? I know that Belkzen is nearby so an Orc might be a good idea. Then too, Dwarves get bonuses vs giants.


Classes with good wilderness skills. So, using your examples, I'd go with an archer ranger, instead of a fighter, and a barbarian with the mounted archetype instead of a cavalier. There is plenty room for infiltration and stealth too. So, even if full stealthy classes like rogue and monk aren't a must, it's nice to avoid classes who ironclad themselves into a -7 Armor check penalty, like paladin or cavalier, or fighter archetypes without Armor mastery.

I'm playing a druid 9/ranger 1 with the archetypes of goliath druid and trophy hunter.being able to pass as a giant has beem useful. Favored enemy: giant is a HUGE boon. And Big Game Hunter feat is awesome too.

A way to bypass the giants reach is very important. Reach weapon, missile weapon, enlarge, lunge, or huge acrobatics/sprint attack. I have 20' reach with a polearm while enlarged, and it's great.

Giants have extremely weak will and ref saves. Some bosses have countermeassures vs common mind affecting stuff, but others don't. And non mind affecting will and ref spells wreak them (things like glitterdust, grease, or dazing fireballs)

Lastly: giants hit hard. Don't neglect AC. My druid has 38 vs giant at 10th, and the difference is huge. Extra AC > extra hp when the enemy hit so hard

A dwarven ranger or
Druid/ranger with full favored enemy giantd is probably a great choice.


I like a 4 wizard party myself.


Huh. I think a straight up Fighter(archer) with traits that allow for Stealth and Survival as class skills should do just fine, based on what you told me. Rangers are nice, but they aren't as good at archery as Fighters. That said, Rangers DO get favored enemies...

So, any melee warriors should have Acrobatics... Why Spring Attack, since you're going to have a high AC given the nature of giant fighting in the first place?

Too bad dwarves don't get any bonuses to Strength or Dexterity, both attributes favored by Ranger types. I agree, a Dwarf Druid might be nice.

Lantern Lodge

just get giant bane on your weapon and you will kill everything


Rangers make fir decent archers. They have less feats than fighters, but they get improved precise shot a LOT earlier. They can buff themselves with things like gravity bow, and have some spells which can be useful (we have used Animal Messenger a lot, for example). Also, fighters have 2 skills by default, which makes hard for them to max out Survival, Stealth and Percepción, which is just the bare bones of a scout.

Beyond that, favored enemy will trump Weapon Expertise by a lot in this AP, in my opinion. Get "orc" at low level, then go orc +2 Giant +4. By the end of the AP you'll have like +10 to hit and damage vs giants.
Dwarf doesn't get +2 to str/dex, but they get a bonus to hit orcs (or giants, with alternate race traits), and +4 to dodge is huge. But there's a trsit in the campaign that gives you +1 to hit orcs and +2 to dodge giants, so there are good alternatives to being dwarf. Half Orc has an interesting roleplay in Trunau at low lvl,and humsns are always good


Actually, Big Game Hunter from the Rise of the Runelords guide grants +1 attack +2 damage vs Large or bigger creatures. That's a must have feat in Giantslayer, methinks.

What trait? Never heard of one that grants both +1 attack orcs and +2 dodge giants. Could you find it for me?

I dunno. I think a Fighter would be more useful in Giantslayer than a Ranger (especially since a Fighter could get class skills like Stealth and Survival with traits), but I would have to see both in action to really make a judgement call like that.

Why is Spring Attack so necessary, given that most melee warriors will want to get in close to dish out damage and will have lots of AC, (unlike a Ranger)?


It's a giantslayer trsit, Dwarven Training or something like that. It's in the AP guide

Spring attack isn't necesary if you are unhittable AC bases on DEX, or have other (better) ways to bypass reach. A reach weapon or being large is better, and use less resources, so is tumbling. Merely having huge AC because of a heavy full plate won't work, if your GM does something else than attacking HP. At reach (which all giants have), anyone can try to trip without provoking, and your full plate and shield don't help your CMD. Being prone 10' away of your enemy isn't the ideal spot. If your GM just attack HP every round, high AC is enough, regardless of CMD

Besides favored enemy (which I can't overstate how good it is in this campaign) a ranger does a lot of other things that a fighter do not. Endure elements, speak with animals, animal messenger, etc are every useful in a wikderness Adventures that revolve about scouting, infiltrsting and sabotaging stuff. So is being moubted in an appropiated level mount and move+full attack with a bow, or being able to fly in a flying mount (roc), or having a 5 attack pouncing beast to complement your full round.


What about divine and arcane magic, are those necessary? Are there traps in the AP?


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Piccolo wrote:

Hello,

I just bought this AP, and was wondering what party build would work for this AP.

So far, I've come up with:
an archer, preferably a Fighter for all the feats necessary
an cavalier, because there's lots of room to maneuver and lance charges

What classes would work? What sort of party balance?

Also, what races would work? I know that Belkzen is nearby so an Orc might be a good idea. Then too, Dwarves get bonuses vs giants.

We're running a group of four adoptive Half-Orc brothers - a Skald, two Fighter/Barbarians and a Scarred Witchdoctor.

Pretty devastating so far.


I'm not personally a fan of half-orcs, because they seem far too similar to humans to really be distinct mechanically.

I'm more interested in your class balance. How far have you gotten in the AP?


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Piccolo wrote:

I'm not personally a fan of half-orcs, because they seem far too similar to humans to really be distinct mechanically.

I'm more interested in your class balance. How far have you gotten in the AP?

Third book. To be fair though, the builds are incredibly well-crafted - all the characters take a level of Barbarian and the teamwork feat Amplified Rage and the Skald keeps them running with his performance... there are some other mechanical tricks in there as well. What makes the group so much fun though is their backstory and how its been tied into the campaign.


Piccolo wrote:
What about divine and arcane magic, are those necessary? Are there traps in the AP?

We play without an arcane caster, and we haven't had problems with traps so far. I'd say they are non-existant, but maybe our GM is removing some of them, as traps are pretty useless in general, unless they are deadly, happen in the middle of a combat, or include some plot device (like being teleported)

My group consist in a half orc Goliath Druid 9/Ranger 1, an Aasimar Paladin 10 and a half orc Beastmaster Ranger 10 who focused in bows and huge tumbling to move away from enemy reach. We have also 3 pets, a T-Rex, the paladin mount, and a pouncing Warcat.

We had some problems at the first few levels (and the Paladin player lost his first char there, an Oracle), but now, we are destroying the AP.


Wiggz wrote:
Third book. To be fair though, the builds are incredibly well-crafted - all the characters take a level of Barbarian and the teamwork feat Amplified Rage and the Skald keeps them running with his performance... there are some other mechanical tricks in there as well. What makes the group so much fun though is their backstory and how its been tied into the campaign.

How do you manage healing?


I know the question is not for me, but I feel the answer will be the same: with wands of cure light Wounds, like every other sane group.
My druid has never cast a single healing spell, and will not do until 7th level spells, with Heal.


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Sorry, but that doesn't cut the proverbial mustard. What happens when someone takes ability damage or ability drain?


Piccolo wrote:
Sorry, but that doesn't cut the proverbial mustard. What happens when someone takes ability damage or ability drain?

That depends on how often it comes up. In this AP, it might almost never be seen, unlike others where you will want multiple characters capable of casting restoration because every second monster causes ability damage.


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Piccolo wrote:
Sorry, but that doesn't cut the proverbial mustard. What happens when someone takes ability damage or ability drain?

When it comes to healing we tend to rely most heavily on Witch spells, Bard spells, potions and wands as they are available, having lots and lots of hit points (seriously), the feats Skald's Vigor and Greater Skald's Vigor as well as using sound tactics and in general killing things really, really quickly.

When it comes to things like traps and ability damage or whatever else we might not be perfectly equipped to handle, sure sometimes they are a pain and an obstacle to be overcome, but we don't generally see a great deal of it - our GM doesn't like to punish us for having neat character concepts or theme-based parties by having us face a ton of whatever we are least able to prepare for. If no one in the group likes detecting and disarming traps, he's going to take out most of the traps that aren't germane to the plot. If we have absolutely no way to deal with swarms, we aren't generally going to face swarms very often. That's not to say that he does away with them completely, merely that it doesn't come up enough to leave us wishing we had created a 'more balanced party' at the expense of all the fun we're having playing the characters we want to play.


I just run the AP's as written, so if there's lots of traps for example in a given area, it's just too bad if the party doesn't have someone who can detect and disarm them.

Therefore, it makes more sense to have a balanced party.


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Piccolo wrote:

I just run the AP's as written, so if there's lots of traps for example in a given area, it's just too bad if the party doesn't have someone who can detect and disarm them.

Therefore, it makes more sense to have a balanced party.

Oh no - none of us would ever run anything purely as written. We like the story to be customized to maximize enjoyment for the group. Players should never have to run a character they don't want to run because they'll get screwed if they don't. Plus the framework of AP's and modules usually open the doors to all kinds of expansion which we have a habit of doing. You should hear the ways we modified Battle of Bloodmarch Hill, for instance - its vastly improved now without anywhere near as many plot holes.


Piccolo wrote:
Sorry, but that doesn't cut the proverbial mustard. What happens when someone takes ability damage or ability drain?

I have used Lesser restoration when needed. It's the Cure X Wound what I don't cast. cLW Wands suffice.


Piccolo wrote:

I just run the AP's as written, so if there's lots of traps for example in a given area, it's just too bad if the party doesn't have someone who can detect and disarm them.

Therefore, it makes more sense to have a balanced party.

With a group of 3, you can't have the classic fighter-rogue-Wizard-ckeric combo, no matter of what.

Beyond that, sometimes players want to play something diferent. So maybe you end having a gunslinger-monk-hunter-witch combo, or whatever.

My druid has a huge perception, probably better than most rogues. The ranger has a huge perception as well. Spotted traps can be bypassed most the time, without needing to disarm them (just don't step on it) Other times a simple summon monster 1 can fire the trap, many of them don't recharge instantly. And plenty of traps just do damage. Wands of Cure Light Wound "disable" them perfectly cine.

Besides that, our archer ranger has good DEX, and disable device. He can't disable magicsl traps, but dispel Magic can, and you can bypass many others.


Archeologist bard, oracle or cleric, wizard?

That fills all the roles


I actually ran the Oracle concept by my players. They didn't like it. Not sure why, though. I explained that an Oracle casts spells like a Sorcerer does, and gets additional powers based on their flavor...

I dunno. I have no clue what to recommend for this AP, beyond what the warrior types would need to get close to giants who have reach on them.

Is a Wizard/arcane caster really needed in Giantslayer? One would think a competent archer could take the place of a Wizard/Sorcerer etc, at least in the artillery function of a caster.

Sorry, I don't allow gunslingers because the class is far too overpowered (Touch AC vs everyone, reloads really fast etc).

Wiggz, I have to disagree. As GM, I just run the AP as is, with only minor changes (like replacing magic items with more suitable ones). Therefore, if the basic roles aren't mostly filled, the group will have a hard time playing. My veteran players know this, and so they create a balanced party but with their own personalized characters.


Switch-hitting capable characters all the way around from what I've played so far. Giants have some significant advantages over quite a few monsters of their CR: reach, deep hp pools and they melee like a truck with a dash of long range boulder throwing to keep PCs on their toes regarding AC.

My group has a Life Oracle double-duty'ing as the trapfinder, a barbarian, a cavalier, an archery ranger and a Sorcerer. We'll see how many of the original characters survive all the way to Chapter 6.

So far, the Oracle has been invaluable. I don't expect that to change, especially since the character is expecting to dabble in animate dead. At 6th, the character should be able to control 2 zombie hill giants with just her CL bucket...

We're probably going to regret not having Stealth capability though.


An optimized martial damage dealer is useful but not essential.
An arcane caster is useful but not essential.
A divine caster is useful but not essential.
Skills are useful but not essential.

Same as any other AP. You can compensate for weaknesses in one area through strengths in another.


Turin the Mad wrote:

My group has a Life Oracle double-duty'ing as the trapfinder, a barbarian, a cavalier, an archery ranger and a Sorcerer.

Based on what I know about giants, I don't think a Barbarian is a good idea. They tend to lack in AC, given that they like to wear at most a mithril breastplate, and most Barbarian PC's are into 2 handed weapons which makes said lack of AC worse.

Personally, for this AP, I would recommend a simple Fighter. The armor training reduces armor check penalties, while using a trait up to get Acrobatics means you can get in close, past the giant's reach advantage. More than that, the heavy armor Fighters wear will help tremendously against the high attack ratings (and damage capacity) of giants.

Since I really don't know much more about Oracles than the basics, I can't comment on your choice of healer. However, even the most basic of Clerics can heal better than almost all other classes.

Rangers are nice on archery, but to be honest they don't really compare to a straight up Fighter on feats, so their archery skill is somewhat lacking in comparison. Still, the favored enemy giants ability should make up somewhat for this.


In a time not so long ago, in a galaxy not so far away, an Orc Scarred Witch Doctor would have been good (assuming that you could survive the first part where almost everyone in town hates Orcs and has good reason to). But then Scarred Witch Doctor got changed to nerf Orc Scarred Witch Doctors, while making otherwise conventional Half-Orc Scarred Witch Doctors overpowered (somebody seems to have forgotten that the floating +2 can go anywhere on a Half-Orc).

* * * * * * * *

Here is a party mix that Id like to have on a test drive. As a matter of fact, it defaults to being an all-Halfling party, although a couple of substitutions could be made. Read the link for details, but to summarize:

1. Mouser Tower Shieldadin. Could be substiuted by any Small race that makes a decent Paladin and Fighter, or a Dwarf.
2. Bard (or maybe Skald). Could alternatively be any race that makes a decent archer Bard; Medium race is fine for this position (even helps a hair with damage output), although it breaks the theme of all-Small or all-(Small + Dwarf).
3. Underfoot Adept Monk built for Monkey Shining, but with a 1 level dip in Mouser. Really needs to be a Halfling, although substitution is possible if you really insist.
4. Ninja built for Dirty Tricks and eventually Ranged Sneak Attack, and eventually becoming Halfling Opportunist. Really needs to be a Halfling.
5. Witch specializing in debuffing (focus Hexes mainly on this, but leave room for Healing and eventually Major Healing) including Jinxing (focus feats on this), with secondary focus on AoE damage and battlefield control, eventually including Area Jinx. Really needs to be a Halfling. Caution: This will be the only 9/9 caster in the party.


Piccolo wrote:
Turin the Mad wrote:

My group has a Life Oracle double-duty'ing as the trapfinder, a barbarian, a cavalier, an archery ranger and a Sorcerer.

Based on what I know about giants, I don't think a Barbarian is a good idea. They tend to lack in AC, given that they like to wear at most a mithril breastplate, and most Barbarian PC's are into 2 handed weapons which makes said lack of AC worse.

Personally, for this AP, I would recommend a simple Fighter. The armor training reduces armor check penalties, while using a trait up to get Acrobatics means you can get in close, past the giant's reach advantage. More than that, the heavy armor Fighters wear will help tremendously against the high attack ratings (and damage capacity) of giants.

Since I really don't know much more about Oracles than the basics, I can't comment on your choice of healer. However, even the most basic of Clerics can heal better than almost all other classes.

Rangers are nice on archery, but to be honest they don't really compare to a straight up Fighter on feats, so their archery skill is somewhat lacking in comparison. Still, the favored enemy giants ability should make up somewhat for this.

What made the barbarian's player wake up was that the character has to wear custom-made armor, so the bubba started play wearing leather armor with a +1 Dex bonus. An AC 9 while raging after a charge came close to resulting in kibble at least twice in the first chapter already. However, this is the player's 2nd Pathfinder/D&D character ever, so the idea is for her to enjoy playing him as long as possible. Raging Vitality goes a long way at the lower levels. Entering the last part of Chapter 1 the bubba is sporting a custom-made set of breastplate armor, so the AC is no longer in the toilet.

The player of the Oracle loves spontaneous casting, so much so that prepared casters are practically anathema. The same applies to the sorcerer's player.

The Life Oracle took on the dual-role willingly (I was willing to do so, but she's probably going to become my 2nd PC due to work interference with her gaming availability soon), freeing the rest of us up to play whatever we want.

The archer ranger does indeed have favored enemy (giants) and either has or is planning to select favored terrain (mountains), with (underground) presumably to follow. He's our recon at present.

I went with cavalier simply because I've been the GM so long that the last time I played one was in 1e AD&D. So far, he's only issued one challenge in 3 levels of play. The GM was surprised by this. My initial concept was a dwarf horizon walker maxx'd out for mountain terrain - by 16th he'd be able to beat most 'mountain' things to death naked, using a pet rock and a 10 Strength from a +20 mountain dominance combat bonus. The GM said "please, no, he wins, now make another character". ;)

The backup character is either a Sky Seeker or a mystic theurge of Urgathoa. I'm still torn on this one.


Aren't clerics of Urgathoa automatically Evil aligned, and thus banned from most campaigns, including Pathfinder Society?


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A cleric doesn't have to have the same alignment as their god - they just have to be within one step.


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Chaotic Neutral, same as most of the rest of the party. Granted, the no spontaneous cures could smart a bit, but ...


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Just make sure he/she has some high quality food to eat ecstatically over his/her fallen enemies.

"Oh my goddess guys, you gotta try dipping these in Goblin's blood, it's simply divine.

Ranger: "Is... is it too late to pick someone else to be camp cook"


Turin the Mad wrote:
Chaotic Neutral, same as most of the rest of the party. Granted, the no spontaneous cures could smart a bit, but ...

The Cleric is CN? Technically illegal, I believe. Urgathoa is NE so her Clerics can be Neutral or Chaotic Evil but not Chaotic Neutral.


Matthew Downie wrote:
Turin the Mad wrote:
Chaotic Neutral, same as most of the rest of the party. Granted, the no spontaneous cures could smart a bit, but ...
The Cleric is CN? Technically illegal, I believe. Urgathoa is NE so her Clerics can be Neutral or Chaotic Evil but not Chaotic Neutral.

I assumed she was CE.

*pokes clicky bits*

Neutral, then. ^______^


Ok kids. Here's what I've learned, after having read through the first 3 books of the AP:

Giantslayer
You want ways to get around a giant’s reach, so reach or missile weapons are handy, or Acrobatics for melee warriors. Lunge feat helps with reach.

A divine class with healing would be helpful, like a Druid or Cleric.

Orcs or Dwarves are recommended, as the AP features a lot of them.

There’s a special weapon for those who like greatswords (especially if you follow Gorum); longspears, warhammers, or Clerics of Iomedae.

Stealth is a great option for the PC’s, so you might want to invest in the teamwork feat Stealth Synergy (Ultimate Combat).

Grand Lodge

If I was going to make an optimized party for this AP it would go thusly:

gnome grenadier (alchemist) - giants and dragons have bad touch ac's
dwarven ranger with a reach weapon or archer - yep
dwarven barbarian (titan mauler) - lots of big weapons
halfling mesmerist or enchanter - giants have bad will saves
dwarven warpriest or cleric of torag - there's this hammer...

I have three of those in the party in my game.


I wouldn't ever throw a Barbarian of any kind against giants. The primary defense against a giant's attacks is a high AC. Barbarians lack decent AC, being at least 5 pts worse off than a standard Fighter (-2 pts for standard rage, -3 pts for wearing a breastplate instead of full plate).

I don't know anything about a hammer involving Torag just yet, as I have only read through the first 3 books in the AP. Which book is this item in?


Oh, and the titan mauler's being able to use giant sized weapons without penalty doesn't really help in this AP, since the PC's can use Minderhal's forge to resize weapons and armor.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

A competently built Barbarian has the same survivability as a Fighter, and can kill things faster. In D&D/PF, killing things faster is better than having them kill you longer. Offense > defense, except for some corner cases.


There is also a barbarian totem that provides concealment - which is always nice against heavy hitting melee critters.


Gorbacz wrote:
A competently built Barbarian has the same survivability as a Fighter, and can kill things faster. In D&D/PF, killing things faster is better than having them kill you longer. Offense > defense, except for some corner cases.

One, that's an opinion, not a fact.

Two, I've never seen a Barbarian that wasn't a marshmallow in a fight. Lots of hp, crap for AC, and decent offense. They always end up soaking up all the healing a divine caster can come up with, and I've been running games for upwards of what, 20 years now?

Three, you'd have to show me what you consider a competently built Barbarian that isn't a glass cannon. And don't bother using the Armored Hulk archetype, I already know that one is the only Barb that can wear full plate.

Liberty's Edge

I went looking for my LEgacy of Fire barbarian, Kyrano 'Ghu at 1st level. I couldn't find him. Here he is at 8th level.

He was almost always enlarged (from potion) during any combat. When enlarged, raging and hasted, he routinely did 100+ points of damage a round at 8th level. He could take enough damage that whatever he fought died *long* before it was a real threat to him (or anybody else).

His damage output was *ridiculously* high. At the end of the AP, we was at 248 HP, AC 28 and his damage output was well over 225 points a round. He convinced Azmyth and I that barbarians were just plainly unbalanced.

In Serpent Skull, I tried a dwarven fighter, lucerne hammer wielder, just for kicks. That was not quite as foolish as Kyrano - but he was close.

In both cases (barbarian or polearm fighter), the greatest exploit in the game is the near continuous use of potion of enlarged person in combat. There is no other CL1 magic item that is that DIRT cheap that is that effective at **all** power levels of the game. Anything that good is TOO GOOD. It should be banned, imo.
_______________
K'yrano 'Ghu
Male Gnoll barbarian (invulnerable rager) 8 (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Player's Guide 79)
CN Large humanoid (Gnoll, enlarged)
Init +2; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +12
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 17, touch 9, flat-footed 15 (+7 armor, +2 deflection, +2 Dex, +1 natural, -1 size, -4 untyped penalty)
hp 119 (8d12+56)
Fort +12, Ref +4, Will +5
DR 4/—, 8/lethal; Resist fire 1, extreme endurance
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 50 ft.
Melee dagger +13/+8 (1d6+12/19-20) or
Entropan +14/+9 (3d6+19/×3 plus 2d6 vs. Lawful Outsider) or
Goreshred +15/+10 (3d6+20/×3 plus 2d6 vs. Humans)
Ranged mwk composite longbow +13/+8 (1d8/×3)
Space 10 ft.; Reach 10 ft.
Special Attacks rage (22 rounds/day), rage powers (intimidating glare, raging leaper +8, reckless abandon[APG], terrifying howl [dc 20])
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 23, Dex 14, Con 22, Int 11, Wis 12, Cha 9
Base Atk +8; CMB +15; CMD 25
Feats Cleave, Great Cleave, Intimidating Prowess, Power Attack, Vital Strike
Traits finding haleen, killer
Skills Acrobatics +13 (+21 to jump, +18 to make high or long jumps, +21 to jump), Bluff +1, Climb +11, Diplomacy +1, Disguise +1, Handle Animal +3, Heal +2, Intimidate +15, Knowledge (local) +3, Knowledge (nature) +7, Linguistics +1, Perception +12, Ride +7, Stealth +5, Survival +9, Swim +10
Languages Common, Gnoll
SQ fast movement
Combat Gear potion of cure light wounds, potion of cure light wounds, potion of cure light wounds, potion of cure moderate wounds, potion of cure moderate wounds, potion of cure moderate wounds (3), potion of enlarge person, potion of enlarge person, potion of enlarge person, potion of enlarge person; Other Gear +3 mithral chain shirt, Entropan, Goreshred, arrows (20), dagger, mwk composite longbow, amulet of natural armor +1, boots of striding and springing, ring of jumping, ring of protection +2, adventurer's sash, backpack, belt pouch, 2,314 gp
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Cleave If you hit a foe, attack an adjacent target at the same attack bonus but take -2 AC.
Damage Reduction (4/-) You have Damage Reduction against all attacks.
Damage Reduction (8/lethal) You have Damage Reduction against non-lethal damage
Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white vision only).
Energy Resistance, Fire (1) You have the specified Energy Resistance against Fire attacks.
Extreme Endurance (Fire) (Ex) At 3rd level, the invulnerable rager is inured to either hot or cold climate effects (choose one) as if using endure elements. In addition, the barbarian gains 1 point of fire or cold resistance for every three levels beyond 3rd. This ability
Fast Movement +10 (Ex) +10 feet to speed, unless heavily loaded.
Intimidating Glare (Ex) As a move action while raging, demoralize vs. adj foe with extended duration.
Killer Add weapon's critical modifier to its critical bonus damage.
Power Attack -3/+6 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Rage (22 rounds/day) (Ex) +4 Str, +4 Con, +2 to Will saves, -2 to AC when enraged.
Raging Leaper +8 (Ex) While raging, gain the listed enhancement bonus to Acrobatics to jump.
Reckless Abandon (+/-3) (Ex) Trade AC penalty for to hit bonus while raging.
Ring of jumping This ring continually allows the wearer to leap about, providing a +5 competence bonus on all his Acrobatics checks made to make high or long jumps.

Construction
Requirements: Forge Ring, creator must have 5 ranks in the Acrobatics skill; Cost 1,250 gp
Terrifying Howl (DC 20) (Ex) While raging, howl to panic shaken foes.
Vital Strike Standard action: x2 weapon damage dice.
--------------------


NO bad guys use dispel magic and DC 16 Spellcraft checks anymore? What are they thinking... ;)

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

No Armored Hulk? OH NO! Well, sure, let's do this, here's Pentakill the Barbarian, while raging and using Combat Expertise when he has DR 16/- (6 base, 8 from Improved Stalwart, 2 from Improved DR rage power), AC 33 and pounce to boot. Set hp per level to average for 185 hp in rage at level 12. After activating Superstitous he won't be able to soak healing that easily, but his saves will be Fort +28, Ref +17, Will +19, more than enough for that odd save or screw you spell.

Sure, he won't hit as often as a 2h Fighter built for pure offense (which will have something like +30 on the first attack at this point) but hey, this is a very conservative defensive build. See, you don't need 20 years of experience to build competent
barbarians <3

PENTAKILL
Human barbarian (invulnerable rager) 12 (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Player's Guide 79)
CE Medium humanoid (human)
Init +1; Senses Perception +15
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 33, touch 16, flat-footed 28 (+10 armor, +3 deflection, +1 Dex, +4 dodge, +7 natural, -2 untyped penalty)
hp 185 (12d12+96)
Fort +19, Ref +8, Will +10; +9 morale bonus vs. spells, supernatural abilities, and spell-like abilities but must resist all spells, even allies'
DR 22/lethal, 16/—; Resist cold 3, extreme endurance
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 40 ft. (30 ft. in armor)
Melee +2(+4) furious greatsword +20/+15/+10 (2d6+16/19-20) or
2 claws +11 (1d8+4/×3)
Special Attacks greater rage (30 rounds/day), pounce, rage powers (beast totem[APG], beast totem, greater[APG], beast totem, lesser[APG], increase damage reduction +2, superstition +9)
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Statistics
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Str 26, Dex 12, Con 26, Int 13, Wis 11, Cha 7
Base Atk +12; CMB +16; CMD 36
Feats Combat Expertise, Diehard, Endurance, Improved Stalwart[UC], Power Attack, Raging Vitality[APG], Stalwart[UC]
Skills Acrobatics +13, Handle Animal +13, Intimidate +13, Knowledge (nature) +16, Perception +15, Survival +15
Languages Common, Dwarven
SQ fast movement
Combat Gear potion of cure moderate wounds (3); Other Gear +4 breastplate, +4 furious greatsword, amulet of natural armor +3, belt of physical might +2 (Str, Con), cloak of resistance +3, ring of protection +3, winged boots, 1,400 gp
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Special Abilities
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Beast Totem +4 (Su) +4 to Natural Armor while raging.
Beast Totem, Greater (Su) Pounce ability and 1d8 claw damage while raging
Beast Totem, Lesser (Su) Gain 2 d6 claw attacks while raging
Combat Expertise +/-4 Bonus to AC in exchange for an equal penalty to attack.
Damage Reduction (12/lethal) You have Damage Reduction against non-lethal damage
Damage Reduction (6/-) You have Damage Reduction against all attacks.
Diehard You are stable and can choose how to act when at negative Hp.
Endurance +4 to a variety of fort saves, skill and ability checks. Sleep in L/M armor with no fatigue.
Energy Resistance, Cold (3) You have the specified Energy Resistance against Cold attacks.
Extreme Endurance (Cold) (Ex) At 3rd level, the invulnerable rager is inured to either hot or cold climate effects (choose one) as if using endure elements. In addition, the barbarian gains 1 point of fire or cold resistance for every three levels beyond 3rd. This ability
Fast Movement +10 (Ex) +10 feet to speed, unless heavily loaded.
Improved Stalwart Double DR gained from Stalwart
Increase Damage Reduction +2 (Ex) While raging, your DR increases by 1.
Pounce (Ex) You can make a full attack as part of a charge.
Power Attack -4/+8 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Rage (30 rounds/day) (Ex) +6 Str, +6 Con, +3 to Will saves, -2 to AC when enraged.
Raging Vitality +2 CON while raging, Rage does not end if you become unconscious.
Stalwart Forgo dodge AC bonus for equivalent DR
Superstition +9 (Ex) While raging, gain bonus to save vs. magic, but must resist all spells, even allies'.
Winged boots (3/day) Fly as spell for up to 5 minutes. +4 to fly checks.

Shadow Lodge

Your gms let you buy +5 weapons, winged boots, etc? The hell...I'm lucky if RNG gives me a +3 weapon once in a while. Serpent's Skull was especially ridiculous with its 2,500 gp purchase limit shop. My alchemist used his +1 returning [main bad guy]bane trident for 3/4th's of that campaign.

Well, I guess you could teleport or planeshift.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

The weapon is technically +3. Wings are just gravy, I could as well have potions or take the recent Flight Mastery feat from Weapon Master Handbook.

It's a proof ofconcept build, anyway, and specifically one that uses just core, APG, ACG and UC.


Steel_Wind wrote:

I went looking for my LEgacy of Fire barbarian, Kyrano 'Ghu at 1st level. I couldn't find him. Here he is at 8th level.

How did you get a Gnoll for your race? Don't they have monster hit dice?


Gorbacz wrote:

I thought DR didn't stack from multiple sources.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Piccolo wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:

I thought DR didn't stack from multiple sources.

Stalwart explicitly states that it stacks with Barbarian DR.

Basically, between unbuffed AC of 33 and DR the above build is a better tank than many Fighter builds. You just don't kill things as quickly as a pure damage CAGM Barb does but hey, you wanted a functional character that is not a glass cannon. Also, this plays nicely into giants who are big weapon brutes and so being able to soak them while your team brings the pain.

And if you REALLY want to cheese it, Dragon Totem Resilience, however I am in the camp that says that it is poorly worded and grants extra bonus to energy resistance, not DR.

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