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Hello, I was wondering if I could get some suggestions from people on some rooms in the test of the Starstone. I am writing a campaign at the moment and I think that suggestions from many people will help give tests some depth to them. Please keep in mind that these tests are taking place at 10th level and should test strength of character and perserverence. this should allow for a test that any level of character could pass if he is focused beyond possible. Please keep in mind that these characters will also not be able to actually touch the starstone and won't ascend. the goal is that they will only get a portion of the power at that moment and as such only get mythic. Thanks in advance!
I'd imagine testing them on their strengths would make sense/be fun. After all, were they to ascend, their strengths would likely become their portfolios.
A chess game with a devil. All the chess pieces look like someone they know who died. Black is criminals and monsters. White is their friends and relatives. the goal is not to win the game. The goal is to be able to sacrifice pieces and keep playing as they watch loved ones die all over again.
The lore says that passing the test is supposed to make you a god.
I don't know if the lore says what happens if you fail.
Personally, I see it as a series of tests. Failing early might just kick you out of the test. No harm, no foul - you didn't belong here so you're booted out. Failing in the middle is permanently scarring. You might have belonged here but probably not, so you're booted out and will forever bear some sign of your failure, with some accompanying disability (maybe like being permanently blinded or fatigued, or maybe just permanently shaken if you're lucky - yes, that means it's probably time to retire this character). Failing at the end should be fatal - you probably belonged here but you couldn't hack it with the big boys, so you pay the ultimate price.
A test for godhood should NOT be something a 10th level can pass. Not even with blind luck. But maybe a 10th level could get past the first test and fail on the second, before permanent scarring and with some Mythic adventure hook.
Let's face it, if the character has to do anything that requires the player rolling dice, then a 10th level character should, and probably MUST, be too weak to roll high enough to pass. This should be a test that only GODS can pass, or at least, only someone capable of being a god can pass. At 10th level, it should be auto-fail. So combat, skill checks, ability score checks, saving or resisting effects, etc. - anything that rolls dice should be at the godlike level, not the 10th level, which means auto-fail.
As such, this first test is designed to weed people out. Not a simple trial by combat because that should come later (and not likely a 10th level could win a trial that only a godlike person should win). So this test should be something that tests a character's resolve. A roleplay test, not something based on skills or any other dice.
So come up with something roleplay that is specific to each character. Hopefully your MYTHIC game has some roleplaying in it. Backstories, character personalities, character development. Mythic should be about more than just having bigger numbers on a character sheet. So use something specific to each character, something personal, something they won't want to have to deal with. Failure, loss, sorrow, whatever seems antithetical to the CHARACTER. But make it clear that passing the test means facing and defeating these challenges. Players will put their characters through all kinds of terrible things (e.g. adventuring) so the player should pass easily.
The second test should test their class abilities and they should fail because they are puny. After failing, they realize they have a long way to go before they can ascend, and they also have some new mythic connection to explore and develop.
I always pictured the test as essentially Tomb of Horrors. Extremely unfair and pretty much impossible to do without already having mythic power or a deity helping you. That was pretty much the case with all NPCs who passed.
If I wanted to make a campaign where the party took the test, I'd have a deity grant them temporary mythic power. Then the party can use it to get far enough through the test to permanently gain mythic power.
I think it should be like Face Off. Only one can win, but there is less onus the farther you get. The tests should all be about tasks a deity should be able to do.
One test could be designing a spell(the best becomes an actual spell in that game).
Another could be building a creature. The best would be added to the world.
As one is running weather patterns, strange weather is a side effect that the tests are being run.
The starstone test should be highly customized. If it wasn't, more people would have passed the tests as notes would have been compared and making it easier for those that follow.
Some guidelines - many don't pass. This doesn't mean the person failing goes away empty handed. Sometimes a person dies, sometimes they walk out with a consolation prize (mythic tiers might be appropriate, depending on the test).
One thing I keep in mind for those taking the test, they have to have a strong desire to be the deity of something first. The few times I have run groups that tried the test, many failed simply because they had no concept of what kind of deity they wanted to become. No one is the "god of becoming a god", so they failed before beginning.
Another fun idea - each scenario is unique, yet other players may feel left out if you just run it solo. Have the other players run NPCs or threats to keep them entertained and active wile one player takes the test. It also makes the gauntlet more challenging since the opponents have more heads to think of tactics than if the GM ran it alone.
To play devil's advocate to LazarX's statement, death is a likely result of failure, yet by no means the only result.
There are no hard and fast rules to point to because how the starstone works is supposed to be the domain of GMs, not the game developers. It would make sense that people have tried, failed, and lived without attaining deific power though. It would explain a lot of how Razmiran has gained even a little clout with his claim - perhaps he did try, failed, bluffed people into believing he succeeded, and somehow the gods remained silent about his failure (or Norbinger is actively keeping that secret). Granted, that is a wild theory, yet does outline the fun possibilities of someone gaining something other than "death" for failing the test.
Mainly the reasons for not killing PCs for failing are as follows -
1 - gives them more incentive to try if death isn't a certainty.
2 - is more fun for players if they don't like dying because they failed at a riddle
3 - if they succeed, they will likely have to retire the character, so this gives more wiggle room to keep a PC in play.
Still, death should be a real possibility. If it isn't, there would be long lines of people trying. Even a one-third, to half of the potential people trying end up dead would be good reason why not everyone tries. Even those that fail and still live, their consolation prize might only be in the form of some Twilight Zone ironic lesson, nothing tangible or mechanical to reward them (maybe just the XP for the experience).
I agree that the test should be customized, but the overall theme could be consistent. Think one test for each element (fire, water, earth, and air) with a final test of spirit. Maybe the final test is that the character must be able to explain what he will be the God of, why it is important, why he/she is the best choice. If the character is convincing enough (admittedly GM fiat) then a test against an equal CR creature that best expresses the opposite of what the character wants to become God over.
If doing this with a group, make the first four tests communal, but make the fifth test individualized.
There are rules in OA. That deal with psychic combat. Maybe use them to create a unique and individualized test.
Instead of elements, you could also do 6 preliminary tests based on each of the stats.
The first test should be a battle royal, where alignment appears on their foreheads and they fight opposite alignments to gain access to the trials. It doesn't have to be a fight to the death, but it often is. This tests commitment, and reduces the field. Neutrals battling neutrals is less often lethal, but it does happen.
First, this is for my own games only. XD Not expected or required for anyone else.
Second, no, they don't need faith to CONTINUE existing as gods... but in some form, even if it's just from believing in themselves, they need faith to become one.
The main games I run feature deities trying to return to their place in the heavens after losing a lot of their power, so the mechanics of godhood are actually very important to me. XD The Starstone is one of the ways of returning to full divinity once they've regained enough power.
How about the core rules don't have enough gods.
People are reaching back to previous editions to find gods of the moon, orcs, ect.
I always saw the Test to, yes, be the ultimate pass/fail ("They tried and failed?" "They tried and died."), but even if you passed you did not automatically become a god. You might emerge broken, battered, powerful, wielding Stormbringer the Stealer of Souls, but to become a god is something that requires an extreme amount of ... well, je ne sais quoi, almost literally: simply put, you have something the Gods recognize (or discover) themselves as missing.
As for what it is? I'd split it into several tests, of skill (martial, social, knowledge, craft/creation), of morals (compassion, desire, justice, peace), of ... hell, I dunno. What I personally think of the four who have Ascended are that the Gods Are Recruiting in their ultimate-armageddon-to-come war against Rovagug. Consider those who've passed:
- Aroden: Last of the High Azlanti, god of human culture and innovation: an inventor and developer.
- Cayden Cailean: adventurer and sell-sword, yet highly principled and a liberator: freedom fighter against dominion and evil.
- Iomedae: paladin; what more need be said? Front-line arse-kicker in the battle against evil and destruction.
- Norgorber: who knows? But going by his portfolio, he's the God's hit-man, and liable to be the one who makes it possible for Rovagug to be finalized.
Which means ... what do your characters have that the Gods need in the Final Battle?