Monk threatening while armed


Rules Questions


In a game I'm running, one of my players is a level 1 gunslinger bolt ace and a levering 1 monk. He claims that while he is wielding his crossbows he still threatens adjacent squares as unarmed. This doesn't sound right to me. I see under monk where it says you can still prepend unarmed strikes while holding items. I guess what it comes down to is wielding and holding the same thing? Can you be both armed and unarmed at the same time?

Thanks

Scarab Sages

Your player is correct. An unarmed strike can be made with a kick or a headbutt and does not require a hand free.

You are of course free to disallow it if you choose under rule 0, but that would be a house rule.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

It's absolutely right.

A Monk can threaten, and make attacks, with his hands and feet tied.


the player is correct


Agreed. It's one of the perks of being a monk, along with excellent saves, lawful alignment, and everyone calling you 'mad' for some reason. And there's many other ways to get a similar effect -- musket plus cestus, for one.

Grand Lodge

Qaianna wrote:
Agreed. It's one of the perks of being a monk, along with excellent saves, lawful alignment, and everyone calling you 'mad' for some reason. And there's many other ways to get a similar effect -- musket plus cestus, for one.

That probably won't work, without using a free action to let go of your musket.

Musket, bow, or two-handed weapon plus armor spikes, boot blades, barbazu (sp?) beard would all work, though.

Same reason why my two-handed weapon PCs tend to take IUS or have something that doesn't need hands to attack with available.


I'll echo everyone's statements here; the player can make Unarmed Strikes, even when they're using a Crossbow.

Here's why:

Improved Unarmed Strike (Monk) wrote:

A monk's attacks may be with fist, elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may make unarmed strikes with his hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed. A monk may thus apply his full Strength bonus on damage rolls for all his unarmed strikes.

Usually a monk's unarmed strikes deal lethal damage, but he can choose to deal nonlethal damage instead with no penalty on his attack roll. He has the same choice to deal lethal or nonlethal damage while grappling.

Thematically speaking, a Monk using one kick, or a kneejab, with a single leg, can certainly be done when their hands are occupied with a Crossbow. There is also no clause that states that they can use only their Unarmed Strike in a given attack sequence.

That being said, I would caution said player about using a Crossbow in Melee Combat, as that does provoke an Attack of Opportunity. (Not to mention reloading it also provokes.)


kinevon wrote:
Qaianna wrote:
Agreed. It's one of the perks of being a monk, along with excellent saves, lawful alignment, and everyone calling you 'mad' for some reason. And there's many other ways to get a similar effect -- musket plus cestus, for one.

That probably won't work, without using a free action to let go of your musket.

Musket, bow, or two-handed weapon plus armor spikes, boot blades, barbazu (sp?) beard would all work, though.

Same reason why my two-handed weapon PCs tend to take IUS or have something that doesn't need hands to attack with available.

FTFY. You can't combine those anymore.

Relevant FAQ here


A musket with a bayonet mounted on top would do the trick, I think?

But yes, despite the clunky terminology, a monk is always 'armed' with his 'unarmed strikes' even if he is 'armed' with another weapon (like a ranged weapon) in his arms . Heck he is 'armed' even if you chop off his arms.

Monks are quite... 'handy'... that way. ;)

Grand Lodge

Darksol the Painbringer wrote:
kinevon wrote:
Qaianna wrote:
Agreed. It's one of the perks of being a monk, along with excellent saves, lawful alignment, and everyone calling you 'mad' for some reason. And there's many other ways to get a similar effect -- musket plus cestus, for one.

That probably won't work, without using a free action to let go of your musket.

Musket, bow, or two-handed weapon plus armor spikes, boot blades, barbazu (sp?) beard would all work, though.

Same reason why my two-handed weapon PCs tend to take IUS or have something that doesn't need hands to attack with available.

FTFY. You can't combine those anymore.

Relevant FAQ here

FTFY, although armor spikes should not need a hand, since I cannot conceive of any way doing, say, a hip bump, would need hands.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber
Darksol the Painbringer wrote:
kinevon wrote:
Qaianna wrote:
Agreed. It's one of the perks of being a monk, along with excellent saves, lawful alignment, and everyone calling you 'mad' for some reason. And there's many other ways to get a similar effect -- musket plus cestus, for one.

That probably won't work, without using a free action to let go of your musket.

Musket, bow, or two-handed weapon plus armor spikes, boot blades, barbazu (sp?) beard would all work, though.

Same reason why my two-handed weapon PCs tend to take IUS or have something that doesn't need hands to attack with available.

FTFY. You can't combine those anymore.

Relevant FAQ here

Yes. You totally can. Just not with Two-weapon fighting.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Do not confuse two weapon fighting rules with wielding, threatening, or attacks of opportunity.

Not related.

Two weapon fighting is it's own full attack action, with it's own rules.

Those rule explicit to it, do not apply anywhere else, at all.

NOWHERE.

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