So I'm designing a Holy Tactician, and I wanted to take a 1 level Dip in Sohei, primarily for the "always act in the surprise round" ability, so that I can take advantage of the Lookout Teamwork Feat.
Aside from that great ability, it also gets me 1 bonus feat, a slight increase to my Reflex Save(I think?) & Improved Unarmed Strike (which COULD be useful ... Feat prerequisite maybe?), 2 extra skill points, and a few extra class skills
The downsides are -1 BAB, less HP (d8 instead of d10 & no favored class) and late entry/progression for all my paladin abilities from that level onwards (thinking level 6 for the dip?).
On paper it seems like it's worth it, but that -1 BAB also effects Weal’s Champion (If I don't hit, my team-mates don't get the bonus), and since I haven't played a Holy Tactician before I don't know how much late entry/progression is likely to hurt the class.
The idea of this is that it's for PFS (so anything they won't let me use is of course out), but at this point it's kind of theory-crafting, so it could be used elsewhere.
Thanks for checking out my post =)
*Edit: Just realised that taking the dip at Level 6 would mean I miss my 2nd Iterative Attack, probably rethinking when I take the dip.
How starved for feats are you? You could take Variant Multiclass Wizard with the Divination (Foresight) school. You won't have to lose any paladin levels, but you'll lose a lot of feats in exchange for wizard class abilities. But fortunately they're amazing, aside from the cantrip at level 11.
I'm not familiar with varient multiclassing, but that sounds too good to be true. One thing though, As a Holy Tactician, my whole deal is granting team-work feats to allies, so I have to at least have those ...? I'll look it up.
Thanks =)
Holy tacticians gain a bonus teamwork feat at level 3 for free.
Here are the Variant multiclassing rules.
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Aside from that great ability, it also gets me 1 bonus feat, a slight increase to my Reflex Save(I think?) & Improved Unarmed Strike (which COULD be useful ... Feat prerequisite maybe?), 2 extra skill points, and a few extra class skills
It increases ALL of your saves by +2, the bonus feat is useful, and if you wear light armor, you can psuedo-keep your BAB by using flurry with a monk weapon.
It's a very good dip.
It's not.I don't think variant multiclassing is legal for PFS.
Check the additional resources entry for unchained.
That's a pity, I'm not even quite sure it's better than a Sohei dip, but it's thematically SOO much better.
I think a 7th level Sohei dip is probably the way I'll go.
Compared to the Variant Wizard I'm gaining 5 feats (4+Unarmed Strike), some Class Skills & Skill Points, +1 Reflex save(?) & Increased Unarmed damage.
Compared to the Variant Wizard I'm losing a Familiar, a Cantrip, +1/2 Level Initiative bonus, Diviner's Fortune Buff, +1 BAB, and all Paladin abilities are delayed 1 level from level 7 onward.
I'm honestly not sure which is better, I really like the variant multiclass thematically, but 4 feats does a lot to offset my sadness at missing out on that.
Thanks everyone for chipping in, and especially thanks to Castilonium for teaching me the ways of multiclassing.
Aside from that great ability, it also gets me 1 bonus feat, a slight increase to my Reflex Save(I think?) & Improved Unarmed Strike (which COULD be useful ... Feat prerequisite maybe?), 2 extra skill points, and a few extra class skills
It increases ALL of your saves by +2, the bonus feat is useful, and if you wear light armor, you can psuedo-keep your BAB by using flurry with a monk weapon.
It's a very good dip.
I didn't think the +2 to saves at level 1 of a class stacked when you multiclassed? If it does, then it becomes MUCH better.
Also I thought Sohei lost flurry, but now I can't find why I thought that =P (He loses increased Unarmed damage & Stunning fist, maybe I just mentally added flurry to that list)
To be clear, a level 1 monk has a -1/-1 flurry, would that be just adding an extra attack at a -1 penalty to all my attacks that round? (so for a Paladin 6/Monk 1 that'd be +6/+1 for normal attacks, or +5/+5/+0 for a flurry)
Is that how that works?
If Flurry is that good (or nearly that good) this becomes an AMAZING dip!
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It increases your BAB before it substracts 2.
Think of it like full BAB -2, and then and extra attack.
A flurrying Sohei 1/Paladin 6 has a normal BAB of +6, but when flurrying it becomes +7.
When he flurries, he also takes -2 to hit, but that hasn't got anything to do with his BAB.
Flurry BAB is 7, attack routine before modifiers is +5/+5/+0.
Aside from that great ability, it also gets me 1 bonus feat, a slight increase to my Reflex Save(I think?) & Improved Unarmed Strike (which COULD be useful ... Feat prerequisite maybe?), 2 extra skill points, and a few extra class skills
It increases ALL of your saves by +2, the bonus feat is useful, and if you wear light armor, you can psuedo-keep your BAB by using flurry with a monk weapon.
It's a very good dip.
Hey again, I just wanted to double check the ability to Flurry in Light Armour.
The PFSRD pretty much just says: "Consult your GM" and my searches have mostly found out-dated (and completely undecided) forum discussions.
Is there an official ruling that I'm missing?
Edit: While I'm here, I should check. Would a Mithril Breastplate count as Light Armour for the purpose of a Flurry since it's a Light-Encumbrance Armour? I'm assuming "No" for this one, but it never hurts to check.
Official FAQ is official, regardless of the original author's intent. The FAQ became the new RAW and RAI.
Official FAQ is official, regardless of the original author's intent. The FAQ became the new RAW and RAI.
That stance always annoys me. They're bloody wrong half the time.
Not 'clarifications', what they're making is rules changes.
Thanks everyone, I have everything I need (and I'm pretty proud of this character). I couldn't have done it without you.
And to The Dragon, the difference between a "clarification" and a "rule change" is pretty much all in the fluff text, mechanically they're identical ;)
It's annoying is what it is. I play with a bunch of different people, who are at different levels of rules mastery and with widely different ways to access the rules.
Some use the books, some use the d20pfsrd, some take care to read erratas, some do that and faqs, and then there's GM houserules on top of that - At this point, four people can have four seperate, and individually sort of legitimate claims that they believe the rule they have is the right one, and sorting out who is really right is a giant of a task that can - and indeed, has - taken a full hour. People turn up with characters they've made using the first edition ACG, for crying out loud.
All this mucking about with the rules is making the game a lot less playable, and I wish they'd stop. People can basically make up whatever crap they want, and then go find that version of the rules argued for somewhere.
If they wanted to have the rules work like they think is balanced, they shouldn't be putting out half-arsed products like the ACG in the first place.