Society Unchained

Monday, April 27, 2015

Ever since its announcement nearly a year ago, players and GMs alike have been speculating about what would appear in Pathfinder Unchained. It was only a short step from there to start wondering what would appear in Pathfinder Society Organized Play. We started exploring this same question early in the book's production, and even then it was clear that some sections would not be a good fit for the campaign, others would absolutely play a role, and many others would require closer study. With the generous assistance of the Pathfinder Design Team and numerous volunteers, we were able to weigh the pros and cons and finalize what our Pathfinders might see in the field.

We'll start by discussing some of the sub-systems that likely come as no surprise to anyone, largely because they would require massive character rebuilds, severely impact how the game works for someone who just has the Core Rulebook, or require us to scrap the current XP system. Much of Chapter 3 (Gameplay) falls into this category; removing alignment, ditching iterative attacks, altering poison, heavy revising action economy, and introducing wound thresholds would invalidate considerable chunks of existing scenarios and possibly wreck how many of our existing characters function. Other features reference gameplay elements that simply don't appear in the organized play campaign, so dynamic item creation, alternate profession rules, fractional base bonuses, and staggered advancement are not a good fit. As intriguing as the many new skill options look, imposing consolidated skills, grouped skills, or background skills would just be too disruptive for a campaign in its seventh year. The same is true for many of the magic systems, including simplified spellcasting, spell alterations, automatic bonus progressions, and innate item bonuses.


Illustration by Tomasz Chistowski

Several other systems were not so cut and dry. We discussed the stamina pool system for quite a while before deciding not to include it; it is an extensive section that we may revisit in the future, but at this time it is not available in the campaign. We came to a similar conclusion for variant multiclassing. We are adding the Signature Skill feat for exclusive use by the unchained rogue—which I suppose spoils a later surprise. John is very excited to include esoteric components and scaling items on a few Chronicle sheets, but these items are not available for purchase otherwise.

Still, we imagine Chapter 1 (Classes) is the topic everyone is waiting for, and we have seen many of you making fairly accurate predictions. All four Pathfinder Unchained classes—barbarian, monk, rogue, and summoner—will be legal for use in Pathfinder Society Organized Play. The unchained barbarian, monk, and rogue are available in addition to the versions that appear in the Core Rulebook; as noted on page 8 of Pathfinder Unchained, "These classes can be used alongside their original counterparts (although individual characters must use one version or the other exclusively)."

In fact, we're so excited about these classes that we're announcing a one-time limited rebuild to anyone with one or more levels in these classes, allowing those characters to switch any levels in the four classes to their unchained version at no cost. This includes the automatic retraining of any rage powers or rogue talents, as well as the free retraining and selling at full cost of any feats, items, and other character options that no long function properly due to the unchained classes features. For example, a rogue automatically gains the ability to add her Dexterity bonus to damage, so she could sell back her +1 agile rapier at full price. Likewise, a barbarian with the Raging Vitality feat would no longer benefit from its increased Constitution bonus, so she could retrain that feat for free. Much like when we have offered free faction changes in the past, you'll need to take advantage of this opportunity before you play the character after April 29, 2015.

You may notice that we did not say the unchained summoner would be available alongside its Advanced Player's Guide counterpart. Effective immediately, the Advanced Player's Guide summoner is no longer available in the organized play campaign, and the unchained summoner is its legal replacement. However, we recognize that someone who already has a summoner (and the book to play it) should not be punished for this change. Therefore, if you have a character with levels in the summoner class, and you have played the character at least once at level 2 or higher, you get to keep your summoner as is; you may also continue to gain levels in the summoner class. Any character gaining a level in summoner for the first time must use the unchained summoner, and anyone character still within the 1st-level window of free rebuilding must also use the unchained summoner.

As a final note, we want to advise folks about archetype and other features' compatibility for the unchained classes for the organized play campaign.

  • The unchained barbarian qualifies for any archetype that does not modify how the rage class feature operates (such as the urban barbarian archetype), and she is limited to any barbarian rage power that appears in Chapter 1 (including the rage powers on page 13)
  • The unchained monk does not qualify for any archetypes, save those in future publications that specifically cite their compatibility with the unchained monk class.
  • The unchained rogue qualifies for all existing rogue archetypes, but she is limited to any rogue talents listed in Chapter 1 (including the sidebar on page 24).
  • The unchained summoner qualifies for all existing summoner archetypes, save those that modify the eidolon's type or base form.

The Pathfinder Society Team

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Tags: Amiri Barbarians Iconics Monks Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Pathfinder Society Rogues Summoners Tomasz Chistowski
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Liberty's Edge 4/5

I don't know if this is a general rules question but will summoner archtypes work with the unchained summoner?

1/5

andreww wrote:
Xallis and Navia wrote:
For real though. As a Summoner player, I'm downright giddy at the shot for a rebuild in a new, more flavorful version of the class.
I what way is the new summoner more flavourful? Effectively you now have a more straight jacketed Eidolon with pre chosen evolutions and a fairly small pool of optional choices. You could already do pretty much the same thing with the original version by picking similar evolutions. Nothing required you to choose a multi attacking pouncing quadraped it was just the most obvious mechanically effective melee combatant.

I believe the flavourfulness is exactly that. Instead of evolving an eidolon into an "aberration" with any and all of the possible cookie-cutter bits resulting in an almost incomprehensible creature, you start to evolve the eidolon from a flavourful creature that is recognizable as something specific.

Liberty's Edge 5/5

thaX wrote:

Just looked at the sessions reported on my first worlder... acording to the web site, I never played the guy except for the mod I played. I am missing The Paths We Choose from Gen Con.

I may have to retrain the character and become a regular (unchained) summoner instead of a First Worlder.

Oh, woe is me...

Edit ... And the Thornkeep credit turned from The Accursed Halls to Santum of a Lost Age. Huh.

If you have the chronicles, you are fine.

Silver Crusade 1/5

5 people marked this as a favorite.

Throwing this in now: I suggest the ability to retrain your rogue to unchained rogue once for every player in the future.
Reason: Same as already stated, to help new players ease into the game and not frustrate them by saying "You played your first character, a rogue, to level 2 and thus cannot change it to the 'better' version of the rogue."

1/5

I second Blackbot!

4/5 5/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Tampere

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Blackbot wrote:

Throwing this in now: I suggest the ability to retrain your rogue to unchained rogue once for every player in the future.

Reason: Same as already stated, to help new players ease into the game and not frustrate them by saying "You played your first character, a rogue, to level 2 and thus cannot change it to the 'better' version of the rogue."

Hmm. This now makes me wonder if we're getting Unchained versions of the PFS pregens at any point. Maybe for Season 7?

Grand Lodge

TOZ wrote:
9mm wrote:
Honestly only subscribers who got a full view of just how hard a nerf the unchained was.
Plenty of us expected a lack of grandfathering window after the results of the last one, and that the summoner would be very different from the APG.

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

TOZ wrote:
9mm wrote:

If only those reasons followed a logic pattern that makes sense.

They most certainly do. You just don't know what the starting assumptions are.

lol, you're funny.

Grand Lodge 2/5 *

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Michael Hallet wrote:
Darrell Impey UK wrote:
All of the original classes (other than summoner) are still valid for the campaign, so there will be no need (or option I guess) to switch.
The option to switch is spelled out in the blog.

The question I was answering asked about other classes/archtypes that used features from the original versions of the classes switching to the Unchained versions of the abilities...

1/5

B. A. Robards-Debardot wrote:
[...] what about other classes that can get rogue talents (Slayers, Investigators, Archaeologist Bards, etc), do they continue using Core Rogue Talents exclusively or can they choose a new Unchained Rogue Talent?

I would really like an answer to this as well :)

Liberty's Edge 3/5 *

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Darrell Impey UK wrote:
Michael Hallet wrote:
Darrell Impey UK wrote:
All of the original classes (other than summoner) are still valid for the campaign, so there will be no need (or option I guess) to switch.
The option to switch is spelled out in the blog.
The question I was answering asked about other classes/archtypes that used features from the original versions of the classes switching to the Unchained versions of the abilities...

Fair enough. Would have been clearer if you had quoted the original question.

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 *** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Indianapolis

9mm wrote:

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

If he was a first time PFSer, why couldn't he have just then changed it to the Unchained summoner (or rogue, or whatever his character was?)

Grand Lodge

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
9mm wrote:
Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

Every change ever made to a game is going to produce Someone who decides to pout, pick up his marbles and go home. The changes to the Summoner were needed, judging by the reactions of players and judges across a wide span of the network community. There were folks who rage quit when the Summoner version of 3.5 Druidzilla was banned. For the most part if a person is going to cheese off because the most broken class in the game got the nerf bat it needed, the campaign is most likely better off without.

1/5 Venture-Captain, Germany–Hannover

Blackbot wrote:

Throwing this in now: I suggest the ability to retrain your rogue to unchained rogue once for every player in the future.

Reason: Same as already stated, to help new players ease into the game and not frustrate them by saying "You played your first character, a rogue, to level 2 and thus cannot change it to the 'better' version of the rogue."

Most likely Unchained or at least parts of it will go into the free PRD, where everyone can take a look at it.

Characters can always be rebuild for free until played on level 2.
A PDF costs 10$.

Since not all rogue talents are accessible for the unchained rogue, it´s not the better rogue in every case.
There´s also still the ninja.

Grand Lodge 3/5

Wow- all 4 classes will be PFS legal...

Why would anyone play the original core version of the classes from here on out?

3/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Witch Doctor wrote:


All we have left now is:

Evolutionist
Naturalist
Story Summoner...and Shaitan Binder.

Yet you need a chronicle sheet to play an Oread for a Binder.

Fixed for you.

Shaitan Binder modifies the base form and would therefore not be allowed.

-TimD

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
nogoodscallywag wrote:

Wow- all 4 classes will be PFS legal...

Why would anyone play the original core version of the classes from here on out?

How about because they want to? That should be the most important reason of all.

And if you're playing Core Campaign, at the moment, you don't have a choice.

Silver Crusade 5/5 5/55/5 **** Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

nogoodscallywag wrote:

Wow- all 4 classes will be PFS legal...

Why would anyone play the original core version of the classes from here on out?

Quite a number of archetypes are not compatible with the new classes, some concepts like drunken master are not mechanically supported.

Grand Lodge 3/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Mark Stratton wrote:
9mm wrote:

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

If he was a first time PFSer, why couldn't he have just then changed it to the Unchained summoner (or rogue, or whatever his character was?)

I would have told the guy the changes but let him play anyway and fudge the report about him. I'd never turn away a first time player. Ever.

Lantern Lodge 5/5 * RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16

Yeah, my drunken qinggong sensei oaut will stay non-Unchained Monk. Same with my urban barbarian/martial artist monk. The archetypes are keeping them locked!

Dark Archive

Are "unchained" eidolons just like the Occult Adventures Spiritsminus the ectoplasm?

Grand Lodge 2/5

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Mark Stratton wrote:
9mm wrote:

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

If he was a first time PFSer, why couldn't he have just then changed it to the Unchained summoner (or rogue, or whatever his character was?)

Probably because the book hasn't been released yet so he had no way of having it (I'm assuming since he was brand new he wasn't a subscriber) and the Additional Resources haven't been updated to make this legal.

5/5 RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

David Harrison wrote:

I'm not so sure it is that definite. The blog post says that it allows "the free retraining and selling at full cost of any feats, items, and other character options that no long function properly due to the unchained classes features." And "a barbarian with the Raging Vitality feat would no longer benefit from its increased Constitution bonus, so she could retrain that feat for free. "

The rage change alters how rage and two handed weapons interact as it is no longer a strength increase.

The functionality of a two handed weapon doesn't change. The change is to the modifier granted by the class ability. So just being a two handed weapon doesn't meet the conditions to trade back equipment at full value under the blog rules.

Now the only weapon ability that I can think of that interacts with rage is Furious. The basic power of boosting the enhancement mod of the weapon by +2 still works with unchained rage, but I don't know if the secondary powers to add modifiers to rage skills(climb, jump, etc) still functions. Because I don't have the text for unchained rage to compare. If the secondary power is broken or redundant with unchained rage, the furious weapon could be traded back for full value. If the secondary power functions with unchained rage. Then again the Furious weapon does not meet the conditions in the blog to be eligible to be traded in at full value.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Blackbot wrote:

So, I haven't read the Unchained book yet. But this means that the Unchained rogue is just plain better than the old rogue and a new player who uses the core rules effectively plays a worse version?

Sorry if I'm sounding cynical, but it just feels weird telling the players I am trying to get hooked with PFS "You don't want to play a rogue before picking up Unchained."
Keeping new players away from awesome classes for the sake of their own sanity (because they tend to be a bit more complicated than core classes) is one thing, but this sounds more like "This class can do what yours can, but better."

"You don't want to play a rogue before picking up Unchained" sounds a lot better to me than "you don't want to play a rogue."

Silver Crusade 5/5 5/55/5 **** Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

9mm wrote:

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

At the very least I would have let him play his character as he brought it, at level 1 the differences between the two summoners is miniscule at best, then just hand him a printed version of the class from the unchained PDF and tell him to get the book when it is convenient for him.

And I would try to explain that the APG is a good book anyway (and the source for something like evolution surge). The timing was quite unfortunate, but I would not have been surprised to learn that the same happened when the synthesist and the vivisectionist were removed.

Grand Lodge 4/5 Global Organized Play Coordinator

5 people marked this as a favorite.
nogoodscallywag wrote:
Mark Stratton wrote:
9mm wrote:

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

If he was a first time PFSer, why couldn't he have just then changed it to the Unchained summoner (or rogue, or whatever his character was?)
I would have told the guy the changes but let him play anyway and fudge the report about him. I'd never turn away a first time player. Ever.

Be careful when speaking in absolutes. If a first time player shows up with a drow ranger or kobold fighter or some other race or class that isn't legal, please don't let him play with that character. Offer them a pregen if needed. But, you don't allow someone to play against the rules or spirit of OP just because they are a first time player. Also, please don't fudge reports.

Grand Lodge 4/5

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Brian Lefebvre wrote:

The functionality of a two handed weapon doesn't change. The change is to the modifier granted by the class ability. So just being a two handed weapon doesn't meet the conditions to trade back equipment at full value under the blog rules.

Now the only weapon ability that I can think of that interacts with rage is Furious. The basic power of boosting the enhancement mod of the weapon by +2 still works with unchained rage, but I don't know if the secondary powers to add modifiers to rage skills(climb, jump, etc) still functions. Because I don't have the text for unchained rage to compare. If the secondary power is broken or redundant with unchained rage, the furious weapon could be traded back for full value. If the secondary power functions with unchained rage. Then again the Furious weapon does not meet the conditions in the blog to be eligible to be traded in at full value.

Two-handed weapons benefit from 1.5x STR bonus to damage. If the STR attribute is no longer getting modified, the two-handed weapon is also being impacted by the barbarian class changes. Thus, it seems to fall under the wings of the blog post conditions.

Silver Crusade 2/5 RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

I looked at all my PFS characters last night and was surprised to learn that this doesn't actually directly affect a single one of them. All of my characters with Barbarian, Rogue, or Monk levels are 1st level, and I don't have a Summoner. LOL

Dark Archive 5/5 **

Thank you kindly!

I have gained a feat (now that Finesse is built in), can spam my Minor Magic, and gained Extra uses of my Major Magic.

Scarab Sages

I'm really not sure if I am going to rebuild my martial artist into a unchained monk or not. I really like exploit weakness, and I dislike the poor will save of the Unchained monk. I'd also loose weapon specialization. On the other hand, I could use elbow strike to enable a hurtful attack. Decisions, decisions...

Shadow Lodge 4/5

9mm wrote:
TOZ wrote:
9mm wrote:
Mulgar wrote:
So I wonder who else saw this coming? And recently made a summoner? Like I did.....
Honestly only subscribers who got a full view of just how hard a nerf the unchained was.
Plenty of us expected a lack of grandfathering window after the results of the last one, and that the summoner would be very different from the APG.
Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

A first time PFSer by definition cannot have seen this coming, since they weren't around when the last instance of grandfathering occurred.

So I fail to see the relevance of your statement.

Silver Crusade 2/5 RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

1 person marked this as a favorite.

A corner case that I've run into with a 1st-level Barbarian (which keeps me from wanting to turn him Unchained)... Unchained Barbarians do NOT get extra damage during rage with a composite longbow (because damage bonuses from rage are specifically for melee weapons and thrown weapons). This means that if you have a Primal Hunter Barbarian, you're NOT going to want to make him/her Unchained. Just throwing that out there.

Liberty's Edge 3/5 *

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I am getting so impatient for tomorrow! I don't have access to the details of any of the changes and I want to know! I suspect that I will change my level 1 rogue (with 1 GM credit) and will probably want to change my 2/2 staff-fighting barbarian/druid over as well.

4/5

It's been a long time since I've been this excited for a new book. I was fortunate enough to have foreseen this and gotten my 2nd-level summoner made ahead of time, but to be honest, I'm not all that enchanted with the original summoner class. I might be changing him to the new one, if the new class is better written.

I will say I'm very sad the Unchained monk can't use the original monk archetypes. My Monk/Barbarian might very well have done a switch if that weren't the case, but he needs his drunken ki!

Scarab Sages

9mm wrote:
TOZ wrote:
9mm wrote:
Honestly only subscribers who got a full view of just how hard a nerf the unchained was.
Plenty of us expected a lack of grandfathering window after the results of the last one, and that the summoner would be very different from the APG.

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

As a first time pfser, they would have 0 XP on any character. They could have played a pregen, or any other character, and would have had the same problem if they showed up with any other illegal character such as a vivisectionist alchemist or wild rager barbarian.

While I am sorry they decided not to play, they had options to play, and then rebuild into a legal character.

And frankly, I would bet that there are errors on any first time PFS player sitting down with a summoner making the character illegal even if the APG summoner was legal.


Imbicatus wrote:
9mm wrote:
TOZ wrote:
9mm wrote:
Honestly only subscribers who got a full view of just how hard a nerf the unchained was.
Plenty of us expected a lack of grandfathering window after the results of the last one, and that the summoner would be very different from the APG.

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

As a first time pfser, they would have 0 XP on any character. They could have played a pregen, or any other character, and would have had the same problem if they showed up with any other illegal character such as a vivisectionist alchemist or wild rager barbarian.

While I am sorry they decided not to play, they had options to play, and then rebuild into a legal character.

And frankly, I would bet that there are errors on any first time PFS player sitting down with a summoner making the character illegal even if the APG summoner was legal.

First time PFS =! first time pathfinder.

Sovereign Court 2/5

9mm wrote:
TOZ wrote:
9mm wrote:
Honestly only subscribers who got a full view of just how hard a nerf the unchained was.
Plenty of us expected a lack of grandfathering window after the results of the last one, and that the summoner would be very different from the APG.

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

That's unfortunate. Did you try to soften the blow by telling this player about the differences between the new summoner and the APG summoner? The new summoner offers some cool new features and the newer eidolons are more closely tied to traditional outsider types thematically. It might have been interesting enough for the player that they'll check it out when the content becomes available on the PRD.

Scarab Sages

BigDTBone wrote:


First time PFS =! first time pathfinder.

True, but PFS has some rather large changes from pathfinder, and it wouldn't surprise me if there were errors in traits, feats, evolutions, eidolon skills, eidolon HP, eidolon attack bonus, and so on.

Several people aren't aware of 4.5 hp per hit die rule, for example.

Sczarni 2/5 RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

1 person marked this as a favorite.

This is exactly what I was hoping to see out of this announcement. Thanks to Mike and John for making this pretty much perfect.

Except now my seeker Rogue 10/Urban Barbarian 2 has some serious choices to make. Thanks for the anxiety opportunity!


Acedio wrote:
9mm wrote:
TOZ wrote:
9mm wrote:
Honestly only subscribers who got a full view of just how hard a nerf the unchained was.
Plenty of us expected a lack of grandfathering window after the results of the last one, and that the summoner would be very different from the APG.

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

That's unfortunate. Did you try to soften the blow by telling this player about the differences between the new summoner and the APG summoner? The new summoner offers some cool new features and the newer eidolons are more closely tied to traditional outsider types thematically. It might have been interesting enough for the player that they'll check it out when the content becomes available on the PRD.

I'm gonna say no. In that no one had the Unchained book on hand as none may have been subscribers.

Really awkward 3 days (27-29th). As its like expecting another person to bring People of the Sands just so one person could play a Living Monolith.

As to me it honestly feels like the metaphorical "rug" had gotten "pulled from underneath us".

Nobody in your playgroup decided to spring for a subscription for an RPG book this month at your local playgroup? Yet you are also being demanded by Paizo themselves to also make any changes on any non 2.1+ Summoner. Yet there is not even a PDF to remedy the situation as people do play on Mondays and Tuesdays.

Which is also part of their effort to stamp-out any and all "grandfathering" in which within a months time a person would normally have gotten 3-4 Summoners to level 2.1 as you must have had a 2.1 Summoner before the announcement went live.

Which can be just as paradoxical as the religious person who is ordered to obey the dogma within the book but the religious person does not have the book so they are in a way, disobeying, for they don't know what the dogma is to begin with and only a select few religious people got the book.

Sovereign Court 2/5

Witch Doctor wrote:
A good point

Yeah, I only ask because upthread 9mm had complained about the summoners being nerfed which suggests they had access to the book at some point. Perhaps a bad assumption.

Most people are for sure kind of SOL on what to say until Wednesday.

Grand Lodge 4/5

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
Witch Doctor wrote:
Which is also part of their effort to stamp-out any and all "grandfathering" in which within a months time a person would normally have gotten 3-4 Summoners to level 2.1 as you must have had a 2.1 Summoner before the announcement went live.

Saying that the leadership is attempting to 'stamp out' all grandfathering sounds odd to my ears, considering 2nd+ level Summoners are being grandfathered.

If they were intending to stamp them all out, everyone would be required to update to the Unchained Summoner.

5/5 *****

Acedio wrote:
Witch Doctor wrote:
A good point

Yeah, I only ask because upthread 9mm had complained about the summoners being nerfed which suggests they had access to the book at some point. Perhaps a bad assumption.

Most people are for sure kind of SOL on what to say until Wednesday.

There are an enormous number of spoilers out already, especially if you read through the product thread. the unchained summoner is significantly weaker and less versatile than the APG one. It's no core Rogue but it has taken a serious hit.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Imbicatus wrote:
BigDTBone wrote:


First time PFS =! first time pathfinder.

True, but PFS has some rather large changes from pathfinder, and it wouldn't surprise me if there were errors in traits, feats, evolutions, eidolon skills, eidolon HP, eidolon attack bonus, and so on.

Several people aren't aware of 4.5 hp per hit die rule, for example.

Isn't it 5.5 hp per hit die for eidolons?


Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
Witch Doctor wrote:
Which is also part of their effort to stamp-out any and all "grandfathering" in which within a months time a person would normally have gotten 3-4 Summoners to level 2.1 as you must have had a 2.1 Summoner before the announcement went live.

Saying that the leadership is attempting to 'stamp out' all grandfathering sounds odd to my ears, considering 2nd+ level Summoners are being grandfathered.

If they were intending to stamp them all out, everyone would be required to update to the Unchained Summoner.

I was referring to non 2.1 leveled Summoners before the announcement went live. I apologize my post was not as clean and comprehensible.

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
BigDTBone wrote:

First time PFS =! first time pathfinder.

I find it somewhat suspicious that a person who's claimed never to have played Pathfinder before, would ask for the Summoner for his first character.

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