[PFS] Displacement or Heroism?


Advice

Scarab Sages

I've just hit 8th level and get to pick a new Mystery Spell. I'm an Ancient Lorekeeper Oracle so I am picking a 4th level spell, which must come from the 3rd level Wiz/Sorc spell list.

My original plan was to take Displacement, to support my melee in Many Forms. (Dark Tapestry Mystery).

I have now mostly lost my favoured class bonus benefit to the recent ARG nerf. I do not expect I shall be doing any dragon shapes, or large magical beasts or the like. I may get to tigers and small magical beasts at level 10. I've found in the last few games I have played more of a support caster role.

So, I am considering choosing Heroism instead of Displacement. Heroism is a long lasting buff that I can cast on myself or others. This would definitely help with my action economy; I have several other combat buff spells. I think that Heroism is probably worth a 4th level spell slot.

But I will then be more vulnerable when I do melee. I can get a decent armour class, but I still think miss chance is important.

Are there any other ways to get Displacement or Heroism, through items for example?

Potions are a bit expensive for repeated use and I don't have the UMD for wands. If there is an item route available to get one or the other then my problem is solved. I know there's a Cloak of Displacement but I want the saving throw bonuses from Cloak of Resistance.

Which spell would you choose and why?

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I prefer Herosim for my bards, preferably with a rod of extend. Potions of blur are a somewhat substitute for displacement. 20% vs 50%

Grand Lodge

Heroism as a 4th level spell seems painful when Bards get it as a 2nd. If you're going to wade into melee, I'd probably take Displacement.


Well I say it depends on what your AC is like and what your to-hit is like. If you have a hard time hitting then heroism is awesome. If you hit easy but ac is low then displacement.

Scarab Sages

I'd agree that Heroism is a no-brainer for bards. In fact it was playing alongside a bard using Heroism with a lesser rod of extend that made me realise it was an option for me - except that I'd need a regular rod of extend because Heroism would be a 4th level spell.

Bards also get displacement as a level 3 spell of course.

Another argument in favour of displacement is that it has Components V, M. I have Silent Spell for free (Deaf Curse) and Eschew Materials so I could cast it as a purely mental action in any form I happen to be in.

I was thinking of retraining Eschew Materials because I took it to fit my concept of a shapeshifting spell caster able to cast in any form, and only later realised that Oracles already cast all their Cleric-list spells without needing a divine focus. The divine focus substitutes for material components for most cleric spells, and although there are exceptions it means that at the moment I only use Eschew Materials when casting False Life (my level 3 mystery spell).

Scarab Sages

Here are some numbers for comparison of benefits.

My AC is typically 25. I can gain +2 deflection from Protection from Evil, and a further boost if I Many Forms into an animal (+1 or +2 natural, possibly a DEX boost and a size boost if a small animal). I have an animated buckler +1.

I find that my AC is generally comparable or a little better than my adventuring companions.

My to hit has improved a lot from level 7 when I took weapon finesse. I use a rapier when humanoid, or more typically natural attacks. My normal attack bonus with either is +12. I often have divine favour running in combat for +3 to hit and damage (fates favoured trait).

At 8th level I have 61hp plus False Life for 1d10+8 temporary hp.

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

Why not haste?

Grand Lodge

Because he has Blessing of Fervor as a 4th level spell already, I assumed.

Scarab Sages

Markov Spiked Chain wrote:
Because he has Blessing of Fervor as a 4th level spell already, I assumed.

You assume correctly :)


If your AC is already pretty good, and you're not already going to get heroism from an ally for sure, I'd go heroism.

Liberty's Edge

Well, you'll probably get a lot more mileage out of heroism. At 10 mins/level you can often have it up for every combat in a scenario. And it doesn't get foiled at higher level when enemies start having true seeing, or when they use AoE spells that catch you anyways. And it helps outside of combat with the +2 to skill checks.

However there's few things as good as fighting a melee BBEG and having displacement up your sleeve.

Scarab Sages

I went with displacement in the end. It's been a good choice. I find that I use it more to buff the party front-liners than I cast it on myself, and it has stopped a lot of damage. I've fought a huge dragon and giants since I levelled.

I do still want heroism, but I'll have to look for that from other party members.

Grand Lodge

Quenly wrote:

I went with displacement in the end. It's been a good choice. I find that I use it more to buff the party front-liners than I cast it on myself, and it has stopped a lot of damage. I've fought a huge dragon and giants since I levelled.

I do still want heroism, but I'll have to look for that from other party members.

Good Choice.

For heroism you have:
Potions
Scrolls
Wand
Knight's Pennon

Dark Archive

I've gone with the heroism in particular the save bonus is nice, and with the duration it becomes an almost automatic +2 on everything especially when I combine it in potion form with alchemical allocation and amplify elixir. I even had a scenario where our party composition was such a poor match for a skill encounter I chugged the heroism just for the skill bonus.

Scarab Sages

A question about the knight's pennon Fruian: does it have to be displayed only when activated, or does it need to be displayed throughout the duration of the heroism effect? Could I activate the item then furl it away in my pack?

Grand Lodge

Quenly wrote:
A question about the knight's pennon Fruian: does it have to be displayed only when activated, or does it need to be displayed throughout the duration of the heroism effect? Could I activate the item then furl it away in my pack?
Quote:
This narrow cloth flag is made to attach to the end a knight's lance, though it can be flown from a spear, polearm, or even a staff. It has no effect if not mounted appropriately.

I tend to use a Long spear a lot...it is a very solid weapon. And 4,500gp for a 60 minute Heroism every day is very worth it to me.

If the Pennon is not an option there are other methods...I was just listing all the viable choices a player has to choose from.

Scarab Sages

I tend to want to fight in animal shape. It's too late to switch to reach tactics (I'm 9th level). But I agree the pennon is very good value and I'll consider purchasing one. I just don't want to be in the position of losing the heroism if I drop the spear or put the pennon away in my pack after having activated it, or when I change shape.

Grand Lodge

Quenly wrote:
I tend to want to fight in animal shape. It's too late to switch to reach tactics (I'm 9th level). But I agree the pennon is very good value and I'll consider purchasing one. I just don't want to be in the position of losing the heroism if I drop the spear or put the pennon away in my pack after having activated it, or when I change shape.

Ya know it says it must be mounted properly...but it doesn't nessicarily say you can't 'mount it" on a quarter staff and use it then Shape Shift (blending it into your body) or Just stick it in the ground like a flag while you fight.

Not sure how PFS will rule on that kind of use...but as a DM I'd allow it to be mounted correctly then shapeshifted into you. It was mounted properly after all. LOL

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Maps Subscriber

If you are in a home game talk to your GM about getting an Amulet of Spirits. You would have to homebrew one up but since you are an oracle it would not be a big deal to say it gives you the +2 level for your mystery abilities for 10k. This way you can push your many forms a bit higher especially after the ARG nerf.

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