Convocations of dragons?


Lost Omens Campaign Setting General Discussion


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Has anyone any idea how to make use of a convocation of dragons in Golarion?
They are mentioned in Dragon Revisited but other than that there there's no mention that I know of them. Apparently a Gold Dragon calls a convocation and most other dragons answer, even chromatics although black dragons are usually anti social enough not to come.
Once gathered the dragons discuss of grave matters (things like the death of Aroden and the Starfall).
So, can you think of interesting ways to use the Convocation in Golarion? And besides that what do you think the dragons' society looks like? Do they also live among humans? Do they manipulate the setting (or part of it from the shadows? Any idea on how to make an interesting dragon based campaign?


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I have an idea of how to incorporate one, and here it is.

After saving the life of a powerful metallic dragon, a party of adventurers is invited by that dragon to a convocation. But some chromatics think that humanoids should not be present at such a meeting, and the adventurers better do some clever diplomacy or risk having dragons hunt them down afterwards. (I'm assuming there is a magically enforced temporary peace treaty or else the dragons would kill each other.)

As for an entirely dragon-based campaign, I think that's a great idea and I will start brainstorming.

P.S. Great question; I love dragons and I was curious about the Convocations already.

Paizo Employee Developer

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Although it was before my time, I understand a campaign design decision fairly early on involved distancing us from the "dragons live among us all in disguise" phenomenon.

As for using a convocation of dragons, I think one of the most powerful ways would be as a thermometer of how dangerous a situation has become. The PCs might find clues that bad news is on the way, but when they hear that dragons of every type have gathered in order to discuss dragonkind's response, that's a major jaw-dropping moment. If the PCs are the ones who found the information and are called forward as witnesses during the convocation, all the better.


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John Compton wrote:

Although it was before my time, I understand a campaign design decision fairly early on involved distancing us from the "dragons live among us all in disguise" phenomenon.

As for using a convocation of dragons, I think one of the most powerful ways would be as a thermometer of how dangerous a situation has become. The PCs might find clues that bad news is on the way, but when they hear that dragons of every type have gathered in order to discuss dragonkind's response, that's a major jaw-dropping moment. If the PCs are the ones who found the information and are called forward as witnesses during the convocation, all the better.

This is an excellent idea. I guess I'm searching for a way to impress upon the PCs what happens when a lot of powerful dragons decide to work togheter for a common goal. If 1 ancient wyrm is enough to give an experienced party something to be scared, what about 20+ of them in the same place at the same time?

Besides that conveing the different point of view dragons have should be very interesting: even metallic dragons may think of Golarion as a place they divide in draconic zones of influence, sure, they don't like chromatics and they urge to destroy and manipulate "lesser races" but they still may thing of the planet as something divided not by national borders but rather by draconic territories, sometimes overlapping with the lines on the map sometimes entrirely different areas.
Also observing the dragons point of view on things like veiled masters, runelords or the whispering tyrant could be extremely interesting and revelatory for PCs.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Rogar Valertis wrote:

Has anyone any idea how to make use of a convocation of dragons in Golarion?

They are mentioned in Dragon Revisited but other than that there there's no mention that I know of them. Apparently a Gold Dragon calls a convocation and most other dragons answer, even chromatics although black dragons are usually anti social enough not to come.
Once gathered the dragons discuss of grave matters (things like the death of Aroden and the Starfall).
So, can you think of interesting ways to use the Convocation in Golarion? And besides that what do you think the dragons' society looks like? Do they also live among humans? Do they manipulate the setting (or part of it from the shadows? Any idea on how to make an interesting dragon based campaign?

I really doubt that Dragons would give two bits about a death of a human deity.

Now if word got around that the Orbs of Dragonkind were surfacing all over the place, THAT would be a motivating factor for dragons both metallic and chromatic, to meet together.


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LazarX wrote:
Rogar Valertis wrote:

Has anyone any idea how to make use of a convocation of dragons in Golarion?

They are mentioned in Dragon Revisited but other than that there there's no mention that I know of them. Apparently a Gold Dragon calls a convocation and most other dragons answer, even chromatics although black dragons are usually anti social enough not to come.
Once gathered the dragons discuss of grave matters (things like the death of Aroden and the Starfall).
So, can you think of interesting ways to use the Convocation in Golarion? And besides that what do you think the dragons' society looks like? Do they also live among humans? Do they manipulate the setting (or part of it from the shadows? Any idea on how to make an interesting dragon based campaign?

I really doubt that Dragons would give two bits about a death of a human deity.

Now if word got around that the Orbs of Dragonkind were surfacing all over the place, THAT would be a motivating factor for dragons both metallic and chromatic, to meet together.

Well, it's mentioned in the description of what a Convocation of dragons is. Apparently the last one was called because of the death of Aroden. And since that had some pretty major raifications (like the creation of the eye of abdengo, the worldwound being created in Sakoris, the ascension of a LG deity in his place (Aroden was LN) and general unrest among human kingdoms as result of his death. Besides whatever was responsible for killing Aroden could very well threaten even dragons... Or maybe his death was the result of a dragon lead conspiracy? ;P


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Rogar Valertis wrote:


...Or maybe his death was the result of a dragon lead conspiracy? ;P

And for some reason reading that line keeps conjuring images of a bunch of ancient wyrms wearing black trenchcoats gunning down Aroden with dragon-sized submachine guns... a 'lead' conspiracy.


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XD

Poor Aroden... he never had a chance!

Btw, besides the trenchcoats the ancient wyrms should all display their signature draconic fedoras!


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Adventure seeds

Adventurers find an orb of dragonkind that can control any dragon. A convocation is called and it is decided that the adventurers should be hunted down and destroyed by chromatics and metallic alike. And the adventurers don't even know what the orb does.

Adventure seeds are fun to write. :)


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Great. Now I want the Dragons to be organized like the mafia....
Now playing theaters, The Wyrmfather

"You come to my lair, to ask of me a boon, but you do not ask it with respect..." ;)

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Rogar Valertis wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Rogar Valertis wrote:

Has anyone any idea how to make use of a convocation of dragons in Golarion?

They are mentioned in Dragon Revisited but other than that there there's no mention that I know of them. Apparently a Gold Dragon calls a convocation and most other dragons answer, even chromatics although black dragons are usually anti social enough not to come.
Once gathered the dragons discuss of grave matters (things like the death of Aroden and the Starfall).
So, can you think of interesting ways to use the Convocation in Golarion? And besides that what do you think the dragons' society looks like? Do they also live among humans? Do they manipulate the setting (or part of it from the shadows? Any idea on how to make an interesting dragon based campaign?

I really doubt that Dragons would give two bits about a death of a human deity.

Now if word got around that the Orbs of Dragonkind were surfacing all over the place, THAT would be a motivating factor for dragons both metallic and chromatic, to meet together.

Well, it's mentioned in the description of what a Convocation of dragons is. Apparently the last one was called because of the death of Aroden. And since that had some pretty major raifications (like the creation of the eye of abdengo, the worldwound being created in Sakoris, the ascension of a LG deity in his place (Aroden was LN) and general unrest among human kingdoms as result of his death. Besides whatever was responsible for killing Aroden could very well threaten even dragons... Or maybe his death was the result of a dragon lead conspiracy? ;P

We know practically nothing about Aroden, and why his death was simultaneous with the appearance of things like the Eye. For all we know, the reveal in Pathfinder 100 may very well show that his death was not the central item but an outgrowth of something greater that connects all of these events.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
LazarX wrote:


We know practically nothing about Aroden, and why his death was simultaneous with the appearance of things like the Eye. For all we know, the reveal in Pathfinder 100 may very well show that his death was not the central item but an outgrowth of something greater that connects all of these events.

One Possible Theory:
My brain started wrapping around this at GenCon during one of the Specials. Part of the problem with Aroden's 'death' is that no one has been able to verify it other than 'yes, it happened'.

And then my brain goes all wibbley-wobbley timey-wimey with the recently rebuilt artifact and the strictures on it and things that could be done with it that could cause no end of mischief... then add in the Aspis Special and a certain character's goals within the mission and the tool provided to do it...

Yeah, the spaghetti strings were worse than a conspiracy theorist's summer loft...


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Wei Ji the Learner wrote:
LazarX wrote:


We know practically nothing about Aroden, and why his death was simultaneous with the appearance of things like the Eye. For all we know, the reveal in Pathfinder 100 may very well show that his death was not the central item but an outgrowth of something greater that connects all of these events.
** spoiler omitted **

Spoiler:
Well, supposedly people considered him dead because: (1) He failed to show up in Cheliax when he was supposed to, (2)Natural disasters rocked the planet, (3)His priests' prayers suddenly found no answer, (4) Iomedae, one of his servants, started empowering the former clerics of Aroden.

Yet none of these show definitive proof he was dead, it could just be he decided to test his followers and disappeared for a while.

Paizo Employee Developer

Wei Ji the Learner wrote:
LazarX wrote:


We know practically nothing about Aroden, and why his death was simultaneous with the appearance of things like the Eye. For all we know, the reveal in Pathfinder 100 may very well show that his death was not the central item but an outgrowth of something greater that connects all of these events.
** spoiler omitted **

I'm glad I could help with your theory-crafting!


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Ridge wrote:

Great. Now I want the Dragons to be organized like the mafia....

Now playing theaters, The Wyrmfather

"You come to my lair, to ask of me a boon, but you do not ask it with respect..." ;)

"Tonight the Last Azlanti sleeps with the aboleths."

Grand Lodge

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There is a side bar in the Fortress of the Stone Giants adventure (Has an article that talks about Dragons in it) that talks about grey dragons. In it, it says that there were originally 6 families of metallic dragons, and that the last and the most powerful Platinum Dragons were almost all hunted to extinction by Dahak. The last was a pregnant female who was able to escape after being horribly wounded and due to the wounds Dahak gave her, her clutch was mutated and corrupted which became grey dragons. The grey are hated by all other dragon types because due to their experiments on themselves to reclaim there glory they created all of the other dragon like beings such as dragon turtles. I am not sure how canon this story is but there is nothing that refutes yet, and it still makes sense in the pathfinder world.

But as for a reason for the convocation of dragons would be if the party were to stumble across a platinum dragon egg.


Rogar Valertis wrote:
Wei Ji the Learner wrote:
LazarX wrote:


We know practically nothing about Aroden, and why his death was simultaneous with the appearance of things like the Eye. For all we know, the reveal in Pathfinder 100 may very well show that his death was not the central item but an outgrowth of something greater that connects all of these events.
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **

Actually, there is a bit more evidence: Pharasma judged his soul upon his death (he was rushed to the front of the que in front of witnesses) and she now just happens to have a spectral servant - who appeared riiiiiiiiight around the time of Aroden's death - called "Echo of Lost Divinity" who, as it just so happens (*AHEM*) looks exactly like Aroden. He claims not to be Aroden, but that's pretty daggum suspicious.

Also, Iomedae holds a grudge against Pharasma for not warning anyone, Iomedae herself actually inherited a greater part of Aroden's divinity, and Cheliax fell into ruin and devil-worship with no clear "successor" state to step up, while the world wound was allowed to open in Sakors. Allowing any of those things doesn't really "synch" with anything we know of Aroden, with the potential exception of Cheliax.

That said, we know that Prophecy has "failed" before: at Earthfall.

Also, gods have died before: at Earthfall, opposing Rovagug, and at the hands of swarms of demon lords (which is how Lamashtu ascended).

What we haven't ever seen before, that I know, was what Aroden was attempting, the Advent of a god as Ruler of a Terestrial Country (Cheliax)... with one exception: Ydersius of the Serpentfolk. And Ydersius was only a demigod.


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Regarding the dragons, Xin-Haruka was razed by an assembly of metallic dragons, so they work together within their type at least. (AP1 pg 75, AP 66 pg 72)

Also, Ydersius is a full deity. He grants five domains: Chaos, Evil, Nobility, Scalykind, and War. That is why no mortal could fully kill him - even mythic Azlanti, who could've finished off a demigod just fine.

Serpent's Skull AP:
The Continuing the Campaign for Serpent's Skull has you drag him to Pharasma in the Boneyard and beat him again there - its the goddess of death that actually ends him.


JaC381 wrote:

Also, Ydersius is a full deity. He grants five domains: Chaos, Evil, Nobility, Scalykind, and War. That is why no mortal could fully kill him - even mythic Azlanti, who could've finished off a demigod just fine.

** spoiler omitted **

Aaaaaacutally, James puts him at demigod status.

Don't know if that's still canon or not. The wiki doesn't make the distinction, so that might have been changed, or might never have seen print.

(And yeah, I have the SS AP - that's where I got most of my information! :D)
EDIT:

Hm... more research seemed to cooberate that, but dag-gummit, Paizo, plus a retraction. Looks like he was a full god after all.

(I've seen the demigod thing in multiple places per James, but I've not seen the "actually, nope, he's a god" thing, before. Oops. My apologies. :D)

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