without getting into any specifics, is this even possible, i know it would be super tough, but could it be done?
bump
Tough for who? Cause that NPC has absolutely no chance unless the party is awful.
I'm inclined to agree with Anzyr on this one. The sheer action economy of the party is likely to cause the Mythic NPC to get curb stomped by the 2nd or (if they're lucky) 3rd round. If you built it as a Mythic Archmage who acts as more of an opposing force than just a straight up encounter, you might have something, but typically single combatant vs. group = group wins unless there's a major power discrepancy between the two and the group isn't 18-20th level.
really, because unless im mistaken, total cr = cr + .5 mythic level, wouldnt that make this a cr 25 encounter, (apl +5). please note i have never run or even seen level 20 pcs, so i have no idea how powerful they really are.
also note, that only the npc has mythic ranks
I say play it out, the odds favor the PCs as a group can buff, debuff, and damage a target in the same round while the single opponent can only do one of those three things in the round.
If the opponent is built very strong. Mythic levels are force multipliers in practice, not half a level - unless the mythic abilities chosen are random fluff abilities such as not needing to sleep rather than stacking abilities that synergize together, the opponent might cause a TPK. It really depends on how the group and opponent is built.
It also depends on how creative the group and GM is. All else being equal, the higher number of actions for a group would favor the larger numbers in a PC party.
One thing to keep in mind, at 20th level combat usually doesn't last longer than one or two rounds (even if it takes a long time to play out a single round).
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There was a mythic wizard in the wrath of the righteous campaign that i DMed that would wipe the floor with any normal level 20 party. He focused on fireball and dazing spell and his saves were simply too high for anyone, with the exception of some of the bosses in the campaign to make. I think that you are underestimating the power spike that mythic gives.
Also a lot of mythic spells just don't give saves to anyone that is not mythic.
Level 20 PCs are extremely powerful and can be expected to have or easily acquire a solution to virtually any problem. Five Level 20 PCs even more so. Generally speaking, a single encounter even many CR above is not going to survive against a numerically superior force. Even more so in this situation since the only difference between a Level 20 PC and the NPC is 10 mythic ranks. 10 Mythic Ranks, but not nearly as much as four other level 20 PCs.
thank you all, i will probably drop a few mythic ranks off the main guy and give him some meatsheilds, not sure exactly what yet.
this was mostly just theory crafting, as my pcs are still very low level and will not be lvl 20 for some time, but if we get there it should be an epic battle :)
1st round: maximizes time stop, apply all buffs, quickened dominate person.
2nd round: maximized time stop, apply area debuffs, quickened Mass Save-or-die of choice.
3rd round: quickened disjunction, maximized time stop, dimensional anchor, cloudkill, wall of force.
Swap around as required or appropriate. It's a bit heavy on the various metamagic rods. But the "all debuffs" part should leave the PCs with most of the possible negative conditions, except for the ones they are completely immune to.
1st round: maximizes time stop, apply all buffs, quickened dominate person.
2nd round: maximized time stop, apply area debuffs, quickened Mass Save-or-die of choice.
3rd round: quickened disjunction, maximized time stop, dimensional anchor, cloudkill, wall of force.Swap around as required or appropriate. It's a bit heavy on the various metamagic rods. But the "all debuffs" part should leave the PCs with most of the possible negative conditions, except for the ones they are completely immune to.
Making an awful lot of assumptions here. But proof of the martial-caster disparity is that you didn't even consider a non-caster Level 20 Mythic Rank 10 NPC.
1st round: maximizes time stop, apply all buffs, quickened dominate person.
2nd round: maximized time stop, apply area debuffs, quickened Mass Save-or-die of choice.
3rd round: quickened disjunction, maximized time stop, dimensional anchor, cloudkill, wall of force.Swap around as required or appropriate. It's a bit heavy on the various metamagic rods. But the "all debuffs" part should leave the PCs with most of the possible negative conditions, except for the ones they are completely immune to.
Except Time Stop precludes you from using spells that directly affect others.
So, of all of those, only the buffs, the Wall of Force, and the Cloudkill (which is a s*%*ty spell to use on 20th level PCs. A piddling amount of Con damage they can probably shrug off or are immune to even if they manage to fail the save?) actually work.
CR = levels -1
Mythic adds 0.5 per tier
20-1+5=24
The party would be APL 20. If there were six, the rule book says to increase that by 1, for this I'd go ahead and give that to them, so it's APL 21.
Solo encounters (one monster/npc/etc) do tend to be easier. If solo, I'd lower his CR by another 1. That makes it 21 vs 23, or APL +2, which is a "hard" encounter.
Remember, in Pathfinder, a "hard" encounter isn't defined by it's likelihood of killing the party, but rather how many resources they have to spend to beat the encounter. If the PC's enter the fight with all available resources, victory is almost guaranteed (baring some strange accidents) it's just a question of how many limited use abilities they have remaining at the end of the fight.
An "epic" fight does start to bring some risk of death, but even then when at full resources, victory is mostly assured. Some party members might get knocked out, or even killed, but they will still win.
Of course, all this varies highly on how exactly the encounter matches up against PC weaknesses and strengths.
Oh yeah, you can't kill this guy unless you have an artifact. Don't give your party artifacts, and have the guy pull a terminator on them! That way, your 20th level mythic martial can outlast your party by making a kill, dying, then coming back and either costing them a small fortune every time, or actually permanently getting rid of party members (like the party cleric).
im not actually trying to kill them with no chance, just a very, very, very small one
All they need to do is knock him unconscious and cast Imprisonment on him.
1st round: maximizes time stop, apply all buffs, quickened dominate person.
2nd round: maximized time stop, apply area debuffs, quickened Mass Save-or-die of choice.
3rd round: quickened disjunction, maximized time stop, dimensional anchor, cloudkill, wall of force.Swap around as required or appropriate. It's a bit heavy on the various metamagic rods. But the "all debuffs" part should leave the PCs with most of the possible negative conditions, except for the ones they are completely immune to.
Except Time Stop precludes you from using spells that directly affect others.
So, of all of those, only the buffs, the Wall of Force, and the Cloudkill (which is a s~&+ty spell to use on 20th level PCs. A piddling amount of Con damage they can probably shrug off or are immune to even if they manage to fail the save?) actually work.
Plenty of debuffs have their effects indirectly. Crushing Pit is an easy one. Raging rubble, summon swarm, and any effect with area and duration are all useful. As well, an augmented time stop forces a duel.
And you don't have to be a spellcaster if you have 20 ranks in UMD and the right equipment.
A mythic unchained rogue/trickster/guardian 20/10 could do it, without relying or UMD or Divine Source for spellcasting.
Always a Chance, Precision Critical, Vanishing Move, Undetectable, Supreme Trickster.
Opponent has -8 AC / -8 to-hit after the first attack hits.
Legendary Kukri +36/+36/+31/+26 (1d3+34+10d6/15-20/x3) - ignores armor and concealment.
Kukri +36/+31/+26 (1d3+34+10d6/15-20/x3) - spellstealer
Surprise, the guy in robes was just dismembered: roll initiative
You don't see what killed him.
1st instinct is to go with PCs.
It is hard to answer though because there are a lot of variables to consider like party make up, builds, is WBL being followed, does the NPC get PC WBL etc. etc.
This really comes down to the class of the NPC, but I'd disagree with Anzyr. A group of level 20 PCs would have basically no chance against a properly built tier 10 wizard.
Mythic improved initiative means the wizard goes first.
Said wizard can then do the following:
Swift action: Arcane surge a channel power augmented mythic meteor swarm. Mythic spell focus (evocation) means that the party rolls their saves twice and take the lower. This will average about 165 damage a person even if they make their saves and are missed by the meteors. This damage bypasses all fire resistance and immunity.
Move action: draw a maximize metamagic rod.
Standard action: cast a maximized, channel power, augmented mythic meteor swarm. The PCs roll twice and take the lower again, and even if they make all of the saves and are missed by the meteors again they will still take a minimum of 300 damage that bypasses just about everything.
There's a small chance that someone with evasion could survive the above. Assuming that they did they would have to figure out a way to deal with the wizard's mirror dodge.
That's the give your party a chance version.
The mean one involves a mythic witch with mythic hexes, split hex, coupled arcana, and a rod of abrupt hexes. The party wouldn't even get saves in that case.