Ways to bring down a flyer

[Havoq]

Besides killing them at range, what are your go-to methods to bring down a flyer that is using winged or magical flight?

Secondarily, what happens if you blind a flyer and it misses the DC10 acrobatics check to move faster than half speed?

[kestral287]

Simplest option-- make it bring itself down.

Presumably this flyer is trying to be a threat, and that means some form of ranged attack. Even a simple Obscuring Mist prevents that, and is available from first level. Doesn't help against big enough AoEs, but it stops targeted attacks well. Higher level spells can be more efficient-- a Wall of Force, aligned horizontally over your head, will stop AoEs just fine.

If it is using melee attacks, a simple "I ready my action to attack it/grapple it" will either do some damage or bring it down, depending on how confident you are in your CMB.

Magical flight is dispellable if it's coming off an actual spell. Antimagic Field can stop even Su flight but that has its own problems.

And of course, moving out of the open works fine if that's an option.

[Claxon]

As for what happens if they are blinded and fail the acrobatics check, well they can't move more than half their speed.

What happens at this point? Maybe nothing. Probably nothing. Because it is only a DC 10 fly check to remain flying when moving less than half their speed.

Magical flight tends to not have that restriction, only winged flight. Same for hovering as well.

[Imbicatus]

Dragoncatch Guisarme. Don't leave home without it.

[Havoq]

Claxon wrote:

What happens at this point? Maybe nothing. Probably nothing. Because it is only a DC 10 fly check to remain flying when moving less than half their speed.

The reason I asked is:

Blind creatures must make a DC 10 Acrobatics skill check to move faster than half speed. Creatures that fail this check fall prone.

It's also why I asked about the difference between magical and winged flight. And - I'm waiting for someone to bring up perfect flight.

[Charlie Bell]

Stunning a flyer is fun. Have some nice falling damage.

[Abraham spalding]

Tanglefoot bags, nets, bolas are all options (maybe not the bolas would have to double check).

[Claxon]

Havoq wrote:

Claxon wrote:

What happens at this point? Maybe nothing. Probably nothing. Because it is only a DC 10 fly check to remain flying when moving less than half their speed.

** spoiler omitted **

It's also why I asked about the difference between magical and winged flight. And - I'm waiting for someone to bring up perfect flight.

Well, this is where the rules get funky.

Because you can't be airborne and prone, it doesn't really make sense.

But "falling prone" doesn't say that it would cause them to move either, so they're not going to just fall down to the ground.

As a GM, I would rule they need to make the fly check or else they fall to the ground, most likely taking damage, and ending up prone.

[Kayerloth]

kestral287 wrote:

Simplest option-- make it bring itself down.

Presumably this flyer is trying to be a threat, and that means some form of ranged attack. Even a simple Obscuring Mist prevents that, and is available from first level. Doesn't help against big enough AoEs, but it stops targeted attacks well. Higher level spells can be more efficient-- a Wall of Force, aligned horizontally over your head, will stop AoEs just fine.

If it is using melee attacks, a simple "I ready my action to attack it/grapple it" will either do some damage or bring it down, depending on how confident you are in your CMB.

Magical flight is dispellable if it's coming off an actual spell. Antimagic Field can stop even Su flight but that has its own problems.

And of course, moving out of the open works fine if that's an option.

Personally rather than placing a Wall of Force over myself for cover and provided the flyer comes within range place the invisible Wall directly in the creatures flight path. Ouch that's going to leave a mark!

[kestral287]

That works too. Don't actually have to use a Wall of Force for that-- readied action Wall of Stone works fine, invisible or not.

Realistically though, in such situations unless you can immediately get to the creature (meaning you either set up the wall after it passes or you can move around the wall very quickly), it can just take off again and you're back to square one, minus a fifth-level spell slot. Establishing a Wall of Force for aerial cover is a more lasting solution (though rounds/lvl isn't great, it provides more options as cover than a one-and-done use).

Both tactics are viable, depending on the situation at hand.

[Imbicatus]

kestral287 wrote:

That works too. Don't actually have to use a Wall of Force for that-- readied action Wall of Stone works fine, invisible or not.

Assuming you have stone walls to anchor it to, yes. You can't just create a wall of stone hanging in the air.

[Christopher Utley]

kestral287 wrote:

-- a Wall of Force, aligned horizontally over your head, will stop AoEs just fine.

Wall of Force can't be horizontal, though.

PRD wrote:

The caster can form the wall into a flat, vertical plane whose area is up to one 10-foot square per level.

[kestral287]

... Huh. Go figure.

Wall of Stone works there too!

Imbicatus wrote:

kestral287 wrote:

That works too. Don't actually have to use a Wall of Force for that-- readied action Wall of Stone works fine, invisible or not.

Assuming you have stone walls to anchor it to, yes. You can't just create a wall of stone hanging in the air.

Creating a Wall of Force hanging in mid-air where it's even more useless after being used to knock the guy from the sky is not my idea of tactically sound, honestly.

[Segovax]

Tanglefoot Bags

[Lincoln Hills]

While it's only useful at very short range, a harpoon can be hilarious. The oft-overlooked solid fog is fun too.

[KestrelZ]

Various enchantment spells like charm monster or sugestion may allow you to nicely ask an intelligent flier to land.

[Kalindlara]

There's an app for that. ^_^

[kestral287]

KestrelZ wrote:

Various enchantment spells like charm monster or sugestion may allow you to nicely ask an intelligent flier to land.

Unnatural Lust could also be used to tempt the creature to reacquaint itself with the ground. Vigorously.

[Kalindlara]

kestral287 wrote:

KestrelZ wrote:

Various enchantment spells like charm monster or sugestion may allow you to nicely ask an intelligent flier to land.

Unnatural Lust could also be used to tempt the creature to reacquaint itself with the ground. Vigorously.

Whoever it's landing on might not be in a position to appreciate your tactical superiority. ^_^

[Froth Maw]

Having someone cast fly on you, hiding where it can't hit you from the air so it has to land if it wants to kill you or shooting it are the least silly of your options. One of my party members once jumped on the back of a Roc, stabbed it to death in mid air and then backflipped to safety as it crashed in the background. I've also absolutely abused the tiefling ability "speak to all birds" that's on the SRD.

[Arachnofiend]

Kalindlara wrote:

There's an app for that. ^_^

This spell is hilarious. Imagine an all-powerful Wizard being hit with this spell and receiving the sudden realization that he forgot to file his taxes and plummeting to the ground because of it.

[Just a Guess]

- A barbarian with raging flyer could go grapple the flyer, let's see whether the flyer can carry both.
- There are shaman hexes that increase the encumbrance, but I think they are too weak (only give med encumbrance unless the target already has medium, then it's heavy.
- Beguiling gift might do the trick, depending on the item offered.

[Havoq]

I see there is a dispelling bow, but not arrows.

[Lamontius]

Potion of Fly

[Andrew Harasty]

Arachnofiend wrote:

Kalindlara wrote:

There's an app for that. ^_^

This spell is hilarious. Imagine an all-powerful Wizard being hit with this spell and receiving the sudden realization that he forgot to file his taxes and plummeting to the ground because of it.

That is a fantastic spell. It is only level 2 and is a Will save. So Magical flyers will most likely pass it. But it should work wonders on "natural" flyers.

[saerin]

I wanted a thrown weapon with anchoring for this reason, but settled for a glaive. Got tossed up by party's barbarian and hit the wyvern as it passed, so it stopped but his rider went flying off.