Greetings, fellow Pathfinders. I'm running a game at my FLGS and one of my players would like to build his own race to play at some point. I encourage players to play whatever they like, but when it comes to building a race, I have concerns about the build being overpowered. His solution is to wait until the party is a higher level so that it will balance out the power options.
Race building is an aspect of the game that I have yet to dive into and don't really know where to start. I'm going to post a copy of his current build below and would like suggestions on how to let him play what he wants to but keep it balanced.
Suggestions and comments are welcome. Thank you.
Rp: 30-40
Level adjustment: 2 to 3
Alignment: Any non-evil. Alphas have mastered their control of their beast side at a very young age and despite the idea of a werewolf acting like a wild animal.
Eyes: all alphas have green eyes.
Hair: most alphas have brown hair
Age: alpha age normal till they hit 18 then they start aging very slow slower than elves people who have study this is because they turn so much it slows down their cell decay.
Special: Alphas seem to have a weaker version of all their strengths in their human forms. When they are in their wolf forms they get the full benefits of their werewolf blood.
Defensive Abilities: A natural lycanthrope gains DR 10/silver and in hybrid, animal, but gets DR 5/ silver and human form. An alpha’s has a natural armor +4 in animal/ hybrid form and natural armor 2 in human form
Speed: Same as the base creature or base animal, depending on which form the lycanthrope is using.
Melee: A lycanthrope gains natural attacks in hybrid, animal and human forms according to the base animal..
Special Attacks: A lycanthrope retains all the special attacks, qualities, and abilities of the base creature. In human or animal form it gains the special attacks, qualities, and abilities of the base animal. A lycanthrope also gains dark vision, scent, all natural attacks made in human and animal form count as magic weapons for the sake of DR and they gain the following:
Claws/ Fangs/Eyes
While in human form an alpha can summon some of his natural weapons as a free action. The claws deal 1d4 of damage These claws are treated as natural weapons, allowing you to make two claw attacks as a full attack action using your full base attack bonus.. The fangs deal 1d6 of damage. Both of these attacks have a change of giving the target the curse of the werewolf it is a DC 15 fort save or they have the curse. Also the alphas eyes change from blue and white to sliver blue and black this is a visional marker that he is an alpha werewolf.
Change Shape (Su)
. Equipment does meld between those forms and animal form. A natural lycanthrope can shift to any of its two alternate forms as a swift action. In animal and hybrid form the claws do a 1d6 and the bite is 1d8 these claws are treated as natural weapons, allowing you to make two claw attacks as a full attack action using your full base attack bonus.
Curse of Lycanthropy (Su)
An alpha lycanthrope's bite attack in hybrid infects a humanoid target with lycanthropy (Fortitude DC 20 negates). If the victim's size is not within one size category of the lycanthrope, this ability has no effect. The bite of an alpha is very powerful it is said that a person bitten by an alpha in any form is also cured of all their other sickness, it can even kill the mighty vampire (The cure for the bite to a vampire is to stop drinking human blood for two days straight, but the bite trigger their hunger for blood)
Alpha’s pull
In human/animal form and alpha can sense all werewolves in 200 feet.
Alpha’s teaching
Giving 1d8 weeks an alpha can teach a curse werewolf how to control their werewolf powers (So after the training the cursed werewolf is treated like a natural born werewolf).
Regeneration
An alpha has regeneration in both forms it is 5/ silver and in human 10/silver and in animal/ hybrid form.
True power of an Alpha
The alpha can only be killed by silver and magic. If not being damage by silver or magic they will just stay 1 hit point away from death till they start healing after two hours. Note this doesn’t work if the head or heart are destroyed or remove from the body.
Weaknesses
Alphas have a few weaknesses that come with their amazing power. This is a list of those weaknesses and how they affect the alpha race.
• Silver- this is the easy one to understand because it is the only metal that can hurt or even kill them.
• Magic- This is also understandable that magic can go pass their defenses but magic that because bashing/slashing/piercing still get affect by their DR.
• Unable to cast arcane magic- Alphas cannot be a class that has arcane magic because their bodies are unable to use it.
• Unable to be healed- Similarly to why they cannot cast arcane magic healing magic/energy doesn’t affect them, but unlike their ability to cast arcane magic it is possible to lose this weakness when they hit a certain level if they take a feat that is given to the alpha race.
• Already mystical- Alphas can only have tier one of mystical energy. They can take a feat at a certain level and get it to tier two but it can never go higher than that.
Ability Scores: +2 Wis, +2 STR, +2 Con, +2 Dex, -2 to intelligent -in human forms +4 Wis. +4 STR +4 Con, and +4 Dex, -4 to intelligence and charisma in animal forms. Alpha lycanthropes have enhanced senses and are in mostly in control of their emotions and animalistic urge, but they still suffer from the burst of the animal sides and alpha focus more on their instincts than raw information or knowledge. In the beast form they have even a harder time thinking and connecting with others.
Skill Scores: in human form +5 to perception, +5 to survival, and +5 to stealth +5 to diplomacy
In animal form: +7 to perception, +7 to survival, and +7 to stealth
Nimble Attacks:
.Benefit: Members of this race receive Weapon Finesse as a bonus feat.
Quick Reactions:
Benefit: Members of this race receive Improved Initiative as a bonus feat.
Feats:
1. Healing accepted:
• Requirements: level 12 17 wisdom
• At level 12 an alpha can started being healed by magic/energy by other people that means he can be healed by:
• Positive energy
• Potion of healing
• Any healing spells.
2. Becoming more mystical:
• Requirements- level 15
• You can get up to tier two of mystical energy.
3. Alpha’s roar:
• Requirements- Level 20 cha-18, wisdom 20
• The alpha has the ability to roar so powerful that he can either turn all werewolves in 200 feet into their human form or their animal form and make them friendly for 1d6 rounds.
4. Undead hunters:
• Requirements- Level 7 wisdom 16
• The alpha can use his scent ability to tell him of any undead in 60 feet and he can use a standard action to pinpoint them.
Lore:
There are some theories that state that the druid were what created the werewolves in a way to connect man with nature, if that is try then an Alpha werewolf not only does that but also connects nature with civilization. Alphas are born with all their werewolf powers and are very powerful in the way they are in complete control of their hybrid side. These creatures are noble to both nature and man. Helping their fellow wolves embrace and control themselves, the job of an alpha is manly to start and control there pack to help the people in their pack master the wolves within. Like Druid alpha are a part of nature and there for have a nature hate for undead. But unlike druid an alpha may choice to life in a city to be around the people.
Name: Akira Ulricstein
Race: Alpha (Werewolf)
Class: unchained rogue (If possible with scout archetype) then prestige into noble scion at level 8 so I will have 2 level noble scion and 6 levels rogue.
Feats:
Noble scion: Scion of Magic: You gain one of the following languages as a bonus language: Abyssal, Aklo, Celestial, Draconic, Infernal, or Sylvan. Once per day, as a free action, you can gain a +2 bonus on any Spell craft check you make. You must spend the free action to gain this bonus before you make the check
Endurance: You gain a +4 bonus on the following checks and saves: Swim checks made to resist nonlethal damage from exhaustion; Constitution checks made to continue running; Constitution checks made to avoid nonlethal damage from a forced march; Constitution checks made to hold your breath; Constitution checks made to avoid nonlethal damage from starvation or thirst; Fortitude saves made to avoid nonlethal damage from hot or cold environments; and Fortitude saves made to resist damage from suffocation.
You may sleep in light or medium armor without becoming fatigued.
Diehard: When your hit point total is below 0, but you are not dead, you automatically stabilize. You do not need to make a Constitution check each round to avoid losing additional hit points. You may choose to act as if you were disabled, rather than dying. You must make this decision as soon as you are reduced to negative hit points (even if it isn't your turn). If you do not choose to act as if you were disabled, you immediately fall unconscious.
When using this feat, you are staggered. You can take a move action without further injuring yourself, but if you perform any standard action (or any other action deemed as strenuous, including some swift actions, such as casting a quickened spell) you take 1 point of damage after completing the act. If your negative hit points are equal to or greater than your Constitution score, you immediately die.
Two-weapon fighting: Your penalties on attack rolls for fighting with two weapons are reduced. The penalty for your primary hand lessens by 2 and the one for your off hand lessens by 6. See Two-Weapon Fighting.
Rogue talents
Esoteric Scholar (Ex): A rogue with this talent can attempt any Knowledge skill check, even if she is not trained in that Knowledge skill.
Coax Information (Ex): A rogue with this talent can use Bluff or Diplomacy in place of Intimidate to force an opponent to act friendly toward her. When the duration of the attitude shift ends, that opponents' attitude toward the rogue returns to its previous level, rather than dropping one level
Resiliency (Ex): Once per day, a rogue with this ability can gain a number of temporary hit points equal to twice her rogue level. Activating this ability is an immediate action that can be performed only when the rogue is brought to below 0 hit points. This ability can be used to prevent the rogue from dying. These temporary hit points last for 1 minute. If the rogue's hit points drop below 0 due to the loss of these temporary hit points, she falls unconscious and is dying as normal
Traits:
Child of the moon: Your lunar gift becomes much more powerful when the moon is full.
Benefit(s) Choose Climb, Stealth, or Swim. You gain a +1 trait bonus on checks made with the chosen skill. On dates during and after the first quarter of a lunar phase but before end of the last quarter (the half of the lunar cycle where the moon is fuller), this bonus increases to +2. During the full moon, this bonus increases to +4.
Friends in every town: You have no problem making friends and learning information from them wherever you go.
Benefits: You gain a +1 trait bonus on all Knowledge (local) checks and Diplomacy checks. One of these skills (your choice) is always a class skill for you.
Equipment: Depending on how you do it because some people have said because of my level adjustment I get level 10 starting gold which is 62,000 some people say I get my character current level so level 8 which is 33,000.So I will make two basic lists.
In the few parts that I read through I'm just going ahead and going to say no, I would in no way allow that.
Tell him to play a normal lycanthrope. There is no reason he needs a special race to do it.
Or better yet, just have him play a skinwalker. Either one.
If you're inexperienced with balancing races, then don't. Paizo's done a great job giving lycanthrope and lycanthrope-like options so that you don't have to homebrew it. Based on the first draft, I'm going to say that the player also has no idea how to balance races, or he's trying to snow you.
I mean, mythic tiers? That's ridiculous and over the top. Under no circumstances should you allow him to play that race, or, in my opinion, homebrew anything ever.
In the few parts that I read through I'm just going ahead and going to say no, I would in no way allow that.
Tell him to play a normal lycanthrope. There is no reason he needs a special race to do it.
I agree 100%. I didn't even make it half way down and I was saying "hell no".
You guys are echoing my initial sentiment as well. I was hoping I could sort of meet him halfway rather than outright have to tell him no.
You guys are echoing my initial sentiment as well. I was hoping I could sort of meet him halfway rather than outright have to tell him no.
I think he's going to attempt to snow job you if you let him make anything himself. At least that's what it seems like to me.
Just say he has to make some sort of were turtle and be a ninja type character and that is the only way you'll consider it.
He can start as an infected were creature at first level, then become that creature around epic levels.
Is this the same guy who wanted to be a were Roc at first level? It sounds like the same guy.
I didn't really like skinwalkers, just see about giving him lycanthropy at some point.
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I suggest the Skinwalker...but an improved version.
1.) Apply the stat adjustments in all forms. As written they're obnoxious.
2.) Remove the -4 Cha penalty the race has when transformed.
3.) Grant a choice of Extra Feature or Fast Change at 1st level.
And that should make it on par with the better races like Human, Dwarf, Aasimar, etc. Or at least close the gap.
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I suggest the Skinwalker...but an improved version.
1.) Apply the stat adjustments in all forms. As written they're obnoxious.
2.) Remove the -4 Cha penalty the race has when transformed.
3.) Grant a choice of Extra Feature or Fast Change at 1st level.
And that should make it on par with the better races like Human, Dwarf, Aasimar, etc. Or at least close the gap.
yeah, this pretty much deals with all the reasons i don't like the skinwalker.
2.) Remove the -4 Cha penalty the race has when transformed.
Actually the ability state a penalty to cha only when dealing with non shapechangers. That is charisma checks and cha skill checks; if you're a sorcerer you're not going to lose spells.
The real fix is that it shouldn't impose a penalty to Intimidate.
2.) Remove the -4 Cha penalty the race has when transformed.Actually the ability state a penalty to cha only when dealing with non shapechangers. That is charisma checks and cha skill checks; if you're a sorcerer you're not going to lose spells.
The real fix is that it shouldn't impose a penalty to Intimidate.
it also makes NPC skinwalkers easier to diplomacy...
2.) Remove the -4 Cha penalty the race has when transformed.Actually the ability state a penalty to cha only when dealing with non shapechangers. That is charisma checks and cha skill checks; if you're a sorcerer you're not going to lose spells.
The real fix is that it shouldn't impose a penalty to Intimidate.
Not quite. At least, per RAW since it's worded so terribly.
"While in bestial form, a skinwalker takes a –4 penalty on Charisma and Charisma-based checks when interacting with humanoids that lack the shapechanger subtype."
As written ou take a -4 to Charisma, AND THEN a further -4 to Charisma based checks when dealing with 99.99% of everything ever.
Regardless of which, it doesn't make a lick of sense why you would take such a penalty. None of the other animal races do so, and no explanation for it is given other than "you look bestial".
As written ou take a -4 to Charisma, AND THEN a further -4 to Charisma based checks
This is overridden by the rule that bonuses and penalties never stack with themselves.
A similar example is an ability that states you gain a +1 dodge bonus to AC and CMD; you won't get +2 to CMD because the non-armor bonus to AC apply to CMD too as those two bonuses are from the same source.
On the bestial side you may be right.
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2.) Remove the -4 Cha penalty the race has when transformed.Actually the ability state a penalty to cha only when dealing with non shapechangers. That is charisma checks and cha skill checks; if you're a sorcerer you're not going to lose spells.
The real fix is that it shouldn't impose a penalty to Intimidate.
Not quite. At least, per RAW since it's worded so terribly.
"While in bestial form, a skinwalker takes a –4 penalty on Charisma and Charisma-based checks when interacting with humanoids that lack the shapechanger subtype."
As written ou take a -4 to Charisma, AND THEN a further -4 to Charisma based checks when dealing with 99.99% of everything ever.
Regardless of which, it doesn't make a lick of sense why you would take such a penalty. None of the other animal races do so, and no explanation for it is given other than "you look bestial".
Even by RAW, I'd imagine most GMs would interpret that to actually mean "Charisma checks and Charisma-based skill checks" (although I'd definitely agree it could be more clearly worded).
As for the penalty to Charisma-based Intimidate, there's a character trait in the skinwalkers article in Wayfinder #13 that specifically addresses that.
Hahahahahahaahah. haha.
One of my players could Pay Me and i would allow it.
Otherwise hell no. Sorry.
Constructive suggestions would mirror the stuff said by players above. The skinwalkers with the proposed changes feel OK to me as well.
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You guys are echoing my initial sentiment as well. I was hoping I could sort of meet him halfway rather than outright have to tell him no.
You could meet him halfway by letting him play a standard natural lycanthrope.
The skinwalker is the normal solution for the lycanthrope as PC, but the actual lycanthrope isn't unbalancing at higher levels, especially if you add a +1 level adjustment or give the other players a little something extra like a similar template or higher stats. (I've got a player with a toned-down vampire template in the party right now and it's working fine.)
The alpha wolf he's written is much stronger than the +2 level adjustment he's asking for. The regeneration alone means he can't be killed by most forms of damage and makes the "immunity" to magical healing almost irrelevant, especially since the damage he takes will also be reduced by DR. The party's opponents are much less likely to have silver or silver-equivalent weapons than the party itself is.
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Not just a no, but a hell no! I like the idea of the skinwalker to start with. If you go mythic with the party, create a lycan mythic path.
As another option, Nate Love's "Lycanthropic Bloodlines" article in Wayfinder #13 :) has lycanthropic bloodlines for both sorcerors and bloodragers.
Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I'm going to pick up a copy of the 3PP supplement "Bite Me" for PCs that want to play lycanthropes. I'll present that along with the the skinwalker class to him as options. I also dug up a copy of the "Shifter" class from Wayfinder #5. Perhaps one of these options can convince him to abandon his desire to play a superwolf from day one.
I suggest the Skinwalker...but an improved version.
1.) Apply the stat adjustments in all forms. As written they're obnoxious.
2.) Remove the -4 Cha penalty the race has when transformed.
3.) Grant a choice of Extra Feature or Fast Change at 1st level.
And that should make it on par with the better races like Human, Dwarf, Aasimar, etc. Or at least close the gap.
Thanks for the suggestions!
He could also use VMC Oracle with this curse. ^_^
Thank you so much. That link has opened up a mine of curses to be converted into defects. When I can buy more printer ink, I will print them out and put them in my copy of The Advanced Players guide. Beast scarred face can also afflict some humanoid mutated animals.