DM Help: Tides of Dread Finale (SPOLIERS)

[macdaddy_o]

I have a party of no less than 8 PCs going through savage tide. We are currently in Kraken's cove. While there have been no PC deaths yet, there have been several very close calls.

I've been adjusting some of the antagonists and combats up a little in order to handle a party of this size. I've been prepping in advance to make things a bit easier down the road.

I'm looking at the final battle in Tides of Dread against Vanthus. I don't really like the way he is constructed (two weapon fighting is meh) and have re-done him as a Sorcadin. This fits with what I have been doing as the party "knew" him as a paladin in an intro adventure I ran prior to starting "There is no Honor". Only now, he has transitioned to a Paladin of Slaughter. :)

The printed incarnation is a CR 14 (11 levels +3 for half fiend. The aristocrat level doesn't count I guess). Since my party consists of 8 PC's I have added 1 to his CR by making him 12th level (Paladin 2, Sorcerer 4, Spellsword 1, Abjurant Champion 5, +3 from half fiend = CR 15).

I have given him very similar equipment to what is in the module (Lucern Hammer +3, Chain Shirt +3, Ring of Protection +2, Cloak of Resistance +2, Boots of Speed). However, with some choice spell effects he ends up with

AC 38 (Shield, Draconic Might, Haste, etc)
Init + 13 (nerveskitter, dex, improved init)
+21/+21/+16 for 4d6 + 13 (Greater Mighty Wallop increases dice from 2d4 to 4d6)
Fort: +22, Ref: +17, Wil: +19

Under the effects of: Draconic Might(12 minutes), Shield(24 rounds), Haste(10 rounds max), Greater Mighty Wallop(12 hours), Heart of Air(12 hours), Heart of Stone(12 hours), Displacement(12 rounds, assume 6 left when the fight starts) and mirror image(12 minutes).

Plus he has the Wings of Cover spell, which kills an attack, but prevents him from using Wraithstrike.

1st round: Evards Black tentacles on those on the ground, activate haste
2nd round: Move up and whack or cast Scorching Ray
3rd Round: Full Attack or repeat

One strike will easily do:
4d6 + 13 + 20 + 5d4(arcane strike) == 59.5 damage

If he ever gets off a full attack action, whatever he hits is DEAD.

I'm worried that perhaps I have over optimized this and made him an easy TPK. A 10th level fighter will have +10 BaB, +1 weapon, +6 from str is +17 to hit. Against a 38 AC, he would need a 20! Then throw in displacement and mirror image and its OVERKILL.

How much should I cut back on this? any ideas/suggestions?

[Mykull]

You should not cut back on this at all. With 8 party members, they will have a significant advantage in the number of actions compared to Vanthus. Keep him as he is, but give him demonic minions of note to occupy several party members. As it is, even as much as you've buffed him, he won't get his full attack and he'll be dead too soon.

[macdaddy_o]

I had intended to add in an additional 4 CR 8 yuan-Ti to go with him (I couldn't think of any appropriate CR 8 demonic servants) with fly spells on them(give a wand of fly to the yuan-ti sorcerer); 2 with bows and 2 with HtH weapons.

But, after reviewing Vanthus, I am not so sure despite your comments.

My party currently consists of
1. Human Cloistered Cleric who will transition into Radiant Servant of Pelor
2. Human Warlock
3. Human Druid
4. Halfling going Rogue/Swashbuckler/Master Thrower/Whisper Knife
5. Goliath Barbarian/Fighter going into Totemic Demon Slayer
6. Dwarf Barbarian/Fighter going into Champion of Gwynharwyf
7. Human Duskblade (using reach weapon)
8. Human Warmage/Divine Oracle/Rainbow Servant

No dedicated arcanist!

The warmage should be able to cast Airwalk at 10th level. That will help get some into the air, and the warlock will be able to zap away for 7d6 with a chausible. All of that depends on them NOT being disabled via grappling tentacles though... which is unlikely (I doubt the druid or cleric will memorize freedom of movement).

Other than that, I don't see how the others will be able to handle someone flying above them them, casting down, and occasionally walloping them with a reach weapon. It would only take ~2 hits to kill any of the fighters, a full attack would be instant death, 1 hit would easily knock off half their health; and it would be nearly impossible for the fighters to hit back.

[Peter Stewart]

Generally speaking I'm more in favor of beefing up boss defenses (especially hit points, DR, resistances) than offense. It produces longer more dramatic fights and cuts down on the swingy nature of it. I'd tone down the offense and stick with the yuan-ti bodyguards. Might even add a posse of pirates just as an added distraction.

We actually ended up running this fight twice in my PF game. The first time the party's two frontliners were both CN and immune to smite (which is a killer in PF), and one of the fighters just couldn't seem to roll anything on him other than crits (he was averaging a crit every round). He trashed Vanthus while the rest of us sort of looked on unable to land much (I think the sorcerer failed like four straight SR checks against him).

The second fight was a 3 on 1 at a slightly higher level (unusual circumstances that replayed the battle of Farshore for two long time PCs that weren't available originally). In that fight the CG fighter got smashed by Vanthus' smite, and we only eeked out a victory because the party wizard was able to pull off lots of dimension door shenanigans, cleric had access to heal, and Vanthus failed a save against a CL 11 harm spell.

Of the two fights the one where he did less damage but was tougher was definitely more fun, and had more of a boss battle feel to it.

[TBA]

My Vanthus for the end of ToD is below, I redesigned him as Gestalt, and was designed like this for a few reasons
- My group is 6 PCs and they're moderately optimised
- Vanthus only turned up at the end of the battle so the party was fairly down on resources
- Vanthus's support was engaged elsewhere, but turned up buffed
- Therefore Vanthus's weakness was action economy, 1 turn against 6

So he was a bit of an experiment. One that turned out to be both great fun and incredibly climatic

I've got a number of stat blocks for him (for unbuffed, etc)... I'll just put 'Nails Vanthus' here...

Vanthus Vanderboren (buffed, hasted)

Male Lemorian Gestalt – Fighter 8th / Aristocrat 1st / Tempest 5th // Rogue 5th / Sorcerer (Abyssal) 9th
CE Medium Outsider (Native)
Init +8; Senses darkvision 60ft, see invisibility; Perception 11

DEFENCE
AC 36, touch 24, flat footed 25 (7 armour, 6 dex, 1 dodge, 2 natural, 2 deflection, 4 shield, 3 tempest, 1 haste), uncanny dodge (cannot be flat footed, retains dex bonus when attacked by invisible attacker), +1 AC vs traps, +4 vs AOOs due to movement
CMB 37 (disarm 41, sunder 43), DR 10/adamantine (first 90 points), DR 10/magic, SR 25
Hp 208 (1d8+13d10+70)
Fort +21, Ref +22, Will +17, evasion, improved iron will, +1 reflex vs traps
Immune poison, magic missile, fire (first 108 points)
Resist electricity 20, acid 10, cold 20, fire 20

OFFENCE
Speed 60ft, Fly 90ft (good)
Melee +3 Longsword +26/+21/+16/+26, 1d8+14 (17-20/x2) and +1 shocking Sickle +23/+18/+13, 1d6+11+1d6 electricity (19-20/x2) and Sting +21, 1d6+11poison (DC 22 Fort, 1d6/1d6 wisdom)
Power Attack +3 Longsword +22/+17/+12/+22, 1d8+22 (17-20/x2) and +1 shocking Sickle +19/+14/+9, 1d6+19+1d6 electricity (19-20/x2) and Sting +17, 1d6+19+poison (DC 22 Fort, 1d6/1d6 wisdom)

Attack Options
Two Weapon Rend – Automatically deals 1d10+12 additional damage on when Vanthus hits with both Sword and Sickle on the same target in the same round
Sneak Attack +3d6 – Deals 3d6 additional damage when an opponent is denied his Dex bonus or Vanthus flanks him
Smite Good – Once per day, declared as a swift action, +5 attack, +14 damage (+28 on first attack on a good cleric or paladin), AC increases by 3 to subject of the smite. (+5 deflection, supersedes +2 from ring)
CMB 21 (Disarm 25, Sunder 27)
Improved Sunder – Sunder attempts do not provoke an AOO
Spring Attack – When using this, Vanthus can attack with both his weapons
Boots of Speed – Activates as a free action, allows 10 rounds per day of Haste, does not need to be consecutive rounds

Spell like abilities (caster level 14, concentration 19, melee/ranged touch +19)
3/day : Command (DC 16), Charm Monster (DC 19), Unholy Aura (DC 23)
1/day : Suggestion (DC 18), Fear (DC 19), Dominate Person (DC 20), Mass Suggestion (DC 21), Unhallow

Sorcerer Spells (caster level 9, concentration 14, melee/ranged touch +19, Save DC 15+spell level)
0 level (8 known, unlimited use) – Detect Magic, Read Magic, Acid Splash, Bleed, Mage Hand, Mending, Message, Prestidigitation
1st level (8 per day, 7 left) – Cause Fear, Shield, Identify, True Strike, Magic Missile, Charm Person
2nd level (7 per day, 3 left) – Bulls Strength, Resist Energy, See Invisibility, Bears Endurance, Invisibility
3rd level (7 per day, 5 left) – Rage, Protection from Energy, Dispel Magic, Nondetection
4th level (5 per day, 4 left) – Stoneskin, Scrying, Reduce Person Mass

STATISTICS
Str 26, Dex 22, Con 20, Int 14, Wis 13, Cha 20
Base Attack +13
Feats - Dodge, Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Mobility, Skill Focus (Bluff), Spring Attack, Two Weapon Defense, Two Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus (longsword), Weapon Specialisation (longsword), Improved Critical (longsword), Greater Two Weapon Fighting, Double Slice, Two Weapon Rend, Improved Sunder, Iron Will, Improved Iron Will
Skills - Acrobatics 16, Bluff 21, Diplomacy 15, Intimidate 13, Jump 14, Knowledge (local) 10, Knowledge (planes) 4, Perception 11 (2 to find traps), Profession (sailor) 13, Sense Motive 1, Swim 20 - +4 to Knowledge checks relating to Sasserine persons, history and locales
Languages – Common, Pirate, Abyssal, Draconic
Gear - +3 Longsword, +1 shocking Sickle, +3 Mithral Shirt, Masterwork dagger, Ring of Protection +2, Belt of Mighty Constitution +4, Boots of Speed, Cloak of Resistance +3, Shadow Pearl, Silver Mirror

[macdaddy_o]

Ok, thanks for the posts guys.

Up his defensive capabilities, lower his offensive.

Option 1:
I keep him as a sorcadin, but drop him to 11th level, so he won't have access to 5th level spells (i.e. Draconic Might). In addition, I will drop some of the stronger offensive capability feats and spells (Greater Mighty Wallop and Arcane Strike in particular; only use wraith strike when he has a single attack or at least don't max PA it when he uses it). Maybe drop boots of speed off him for something else, as hasted, he can do too much dmg (3 attacks + wraithstrike == dooom!).

He'll have 4 8th level human pirate backups. Two melee (Swashbuckler 3/ Fighter 2/ dervish 3) and two Ranged (Ranger 3, Scout 5). They all move around when attacking (vanthus will drop a haste on them in round 2), so that should keep them alive longer with full attacks being unavailable (hit & run).

Option 2:
Redo him as a Swashbuckler 3 / Fighter 2 / Dervish 6. This means he'll have a good AC and be able to run circles around the party (move of ~70 while hasted)while dealing out his damage and not being full attacked by anyone. I'll give him skill tricks to stand from prone and escape grapples (the Goliath is a tripper and the Dwarf is a grappler).

He'll have a greater invisible, flying, blurred, mirror imaged 8th level focused specialist conjurer and three Ranged pirates (Ranger 3, Scout 5). The wizard can drop an evard's tentacles, do the hasting on the pirates, have cast a prep spell or two on Vanthus prior (like displacement) and do some battle field control (benign transposition, grease, glitterdust, etc). He'll die to the warlock eventually (7d6 blasts will do that), but the blur/mirror image should make him last a bit longer.

The first version will allow him to stand toe-toe with the fighters while dealing solid damage (assuming he doesn't get perma-tripped by the goliath), while the 2nd version will be a little more frustrating for them to fight as he deals solid damage while weaving through them unhurt and making them rush about.

[willwrk4internet]

TBA, do you have an approximate CR for your buffed and hasted Vanthus?
Great builds, by the way.

[TBA]

Technically if you ignore the Gestalt, 13, but that's not really accurate.

He took on 6 level 10 PCs, most of which were optimised at the time, confused 3, killed 1 and dumped the Shadow Pearl (which claimed 2 more)

He was buffed too, so if I had to look at his CR against a normal PFS party, probably something like 17.