Fighting 2 Shields without penalty


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Hi all,
i just figured out this build:
Fighter(Two-Weapon-Fighter). At 11th Level i pick up Shield Master feat, allowing me do negate the Penalty for two weapon fighting.
Also i gain "Improved Balance (Ex)" at Level 11 and i choose the alternative, having a one-handed-weapon in the offhand treated as light.
Now i pick up 3 heavy steel shields, armor enhancement +3.
I will now fight with 2 shields having no Penalty for 2 weapon fighting, getting the +3 armor enhancement also on attack and damage.
I don´t think i got the rules wrong but this seems pretty damn broken.

thanks for your help,
sry for bad english, no native Speaker ;)


You can only have shield a bonus from one source. So you can fight with two shifts but only one of them is going to improve you AC. I am not sure if fight with two shields is allowed but I would not allow that in my game.


Why do you have 3 heavy shields? You can only wield 2 ever.

Also armour bonuses don't stack AC so only one +3 shield would count for your AC.


sorry. ofcause 2 shields, i misstyped.

@smitter: ofc i get the shield Bonus only from 1 shield, no doubt.
But Shieldmaster allows me to use the Armorenhancement from the shield for attackroll and damageroll.

So only 1 shield provides me an ac-bonus, but both provide me +3 on attack and damage roll with the shield master feat.
I enhance it as +3 armor because its the same effect as enhancing it a +3weapon but only cost 9000gp instead of 18000gp.

Using two shield as weapons sounds pretty silly, but a heavy steel shield is also a one-handed-weapon according to the core-rulebook.


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The smitter wrote:
You can only have shield a bonus from one source. So you can fight with two shifts but only one of them is going to improve you AC. I am not sure if fight with two shields is allowed but I would not allow that in my game.

2 shields is allowed by the rules and it has actually been a real fighting style. It is just not as popular as using a sword or other weapon in the opposite hand.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Using a Dire Flail, or Barbazu Beard sounds pretty silly.


i thought so.
this build is so serious, since you get your "Magic weapons" for half the cost. the pure weapon damage doesnt matter anyway as fighter. if you have d6 by the spiked shield or d8 by longsword just doesnt matter at lvl 11 or sth, since the biggest part of you damage is static mods like strenth and feats. combining this build with other two weapon skills ist just awesome. you have better attackrolls (since you have no Penalty), massive ac (even with only 1 shield counting for your ac you easily score 35+ at Level 11) plus massive dmg having many attacks and feats like double slice or two weapon rend.

thx for the answers already. If anyone thinks fighting with 2 shields is not allowed by the rules, pls let me know.


It is rules legal, but I dont think Paizo intended for you to get two weapons at half the enhancement price so I would still shoot this by the GM. If you are in PFS then you are good to go however.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

You can fight with two weapons.

Shields are weapons.

Can you fight with two daggers?

Liberty's Edge

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The smitter wrote:
You can only have shield a bonus from one source. So you can fight with two shifts but only one of them is going to improve you AC. I am not sure if fight with two shields is allowed but I would not allow that in my game.

There is another long thread about dual-shield fighting where James Jacobs also thought it was silly until someone found two historical precedents for it: A Maori warrior style and an oriental martial arts style. The Maori style looked a little more traditional shield-bashy, while the martial artist used the edges of the shield like a large blade, but it looked to me like they were still blunt.

To the OP: you can also use the Weapon and Shield style Ranger, and just make your weapon another shield. That gets you Shield Mastery at 6th level instead of fighter at 11. The ranger is a little more offensive than the Fighter. I played the (non-dual)Shielded Fighter as a high AC tank for PFS and loved pushing things around the battlefield, but I didn't do any real damage with him until about 7th level. The new size stacking FAQ is also going to reduce his damage, as Shield Spikes and Bashing enchantment will no longer stack officially.


I did find the Bashing enhancement aswell, but i dont think its actually good.
The pathfinder weaponsize table is taken from 3.5.
If you have a medium sized heavy spiked steel shield it deals 1d6. making it bashing, granting +2 size categories you go to 2d6.
1d6 Bonus dmg ist just like fire or ice enhancement. and its a weapon enhancesment, so you have to pay more if you want to enhance it with ac aswell, because it is a different Kind of enhancement.
dont think thats worth it. It starts getting worth if you are bigger then medium sized creature, and it gets less worth if you are smaller then medium sized.

i made that build for a fighter in our Group.
we are 4 PCs, and as we started the campaign (our first PF round) we thought having a tank is effective. In fact he had like 30+ AC but srsly 0 dmg, so at least intelligend foes just ignored him. It didnt really work out for us. Thats what i love about the shieldbased two-weapon-fighter. He still has decent defensive but deals a pretty good ammount of damage, having some Utilitys with his shield (like free bullrush) plus scaling pretty well until like Level 15.


You do realize that the shield must be enchanted separately, as weapons and shield, right?

The shield price table does not apply to shield as weapons.
You must pay for them separately.


bigrig107 wrote:

You do realize that the shield must be enchanted separately, as weapons and shield, right?

The shield price table does not apply to shield as weapons.
You must pay for them separately.

There is a feat that allow for your shield enhancement to apply to attacks as if it is a weapon enhancement. That is why the player is trying to do this.


wraithstrike wrote:
2 shields is allowed by the rules and it has actually been a real fighting style. It is just not as popular as using a sword or other weapon in the opposite hand.

I presume you are referring to the video of a martial artist doing forms with two tiger 'shields' that actually seemed much more like scizores due to being a half tube of steel strapped to the forearm that ended in two spikes going beyond the hand? If so I take issue with your statements.

If you were to try and use two normal shields to fight with in a game, I would ask you to show me where it states this is possible rather than just point out it doesn't say you can't.


correct, thats the amazing thing about the shieldmaster feat.

you enhance a shield as a shield +1 (Armorenhancement), and you get:
+1AC from the armor enhancement, and also you get +1 attack and +1 damage because you have the shieldmaster feat.
basicly you get the benefits of the armor enhancement and the weapon enhancement but only need to pay the armor enhancement.

you get into trouble if you want to have the +2 AC (wich gives you also +2 attack roll and +2 damage) and additional on the same shield a weaponenhancement like frost. Then you will need to pay extra. But seriously who wants that. if you can have a shield giving +5AC, +5 attack roll and +5 damage roll for only 25k. cant beat that


please no "thats not realistic" discussion again :D

the rules defenitly allow shields being used as a weapon. just like any other weapon aswell. if anybody feels this is kinda op, feel free to houserule that and ban it. but here is no Chance to assume from rules that this is not working. if im wrong correct me using the rules or official Statements from paizo.

i mean there are op things in this game. like leadership e.g. or whatever. so any Group can choose to ban these. but from the rules i think its 100% okay to fight with 2 shields. cant find anything against that.

and for this:
"If you were to try and use two normal shields to fight with in a game, I would ask you to show me where it states this is possible rather than just point out it doesn't say you can't."

also there is no rule that says "you can fight with 2 daggers".
weapons are classified as light, onehanded, or two handed.
so can use any 2 weapons that require 1 Hand, with the penalties from 2 weapon fighting.
since a heavy shield is a one handed weapon (you can read that in the weapon Chart), you can - without a doubt - use 2 shields, just as you can use 2 longsworts. 100% identical by the rules, so they defenetly allow this. you can just houserule that you dont like the fact cause its unrealistic. but then perhaps, you should start houseruling the Problem that a lvl10 fighter can easily take 10 arrows in his Body without dying or having any impact on his movement or fighting possibilities


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Shield Bash Attacks: You can bash an opponent with a heavy shield. See "heavy shield" on the Martial Weapons table for the damage dealt by a shield bash with a heavy shield. Used this way, a heavy shield is a martial bludgeoning weapon. For the purpose of penalties on attack rolls, treat a heavy shield as a one-handed weapon.

The specific entries for shield do not say they are counted as a one-handed or light weapon per se but only "For the purpose of penalties on attack rolls" it is called out as a specific case for a specific type of attack, shield bash. It's inclusion in the weapon tables is explained in that way as well.

The RW or not stuff is beside the point if it was just to be counted as any other weapon weapon it should be "Used this way, a heavy shield is a martial bludgeoning one-handed weapon".

To me it's you chaps that are house ruling due to exploiting the wording of the shield entry to allow you to do something you want rather than what was intended.

But hey as you say that's just me and my opinion, you won't ever play in a game with me, forget I spoke.


thats some way of argumentation that is helpful. way more then discussing Videos of guys fighting with some "pimped" shields.

I do see your Point, quoting that rule. did not think of it before. basicly its saying "a shield is not a weapon. you can bash with it and in this case its treated as a weapon". Thats said in the Category armor in the equiptment chapter.

Watching in the weapon category, there is also an entry for shields:
"Shield, Heavy or Light: You can bash with a shield instead of using it for defense."

So for me a shield is both at the same time. it is a thing that you can use as a weapon or as an armor. for both cases the rules say how it works. you can even Combine it, havin feats for it such as improved shield bash. this feat pretty much shows that shields are meant to be weapons in this game aswell. you can attack with it still keeping your defense stats.

So i understand what you mean, but there is so much rules about shield as weapon, so many feats, and even said its "treated as a onehanded weapon" in the armor rules, that i think from the rules itself, its way nearer to say: "a shield is a weapon". Saying "a shield is not a weapon, but you can do basicly everything you can do with a weapon. Even enhancing it as a weapon, even use it as off-Hand or main-Hand weapon whilst dual wielding having another weapon, do maneuvers with it as a weapon, but you CANT use 2 shields as 2 weapons since there is no rule that says exactly this." is a bit far in my eyes.

I mean, i wanna attack with attack with my shield. what do the rules say? "treat it as a onehanded weapon". i wanna do 2 attacks with my shield, can i do this?. ofc since is treated "as a one handed weapon".
I have a shield in each Hand. can i attack with both? no, you could do this with a shield and a one-handed-weapon, but not with a shield and a 2nd shield even though it is treated "as a one handed weapon"?. Doesnt sound too logical in my ears.
I think that would go a bit far. Anything you can do with a Weapon, you also can do with a shield, just as i listed. Except for dualwielding?


Even if you are enchanting the shields at a lower cost, you are enchanting 2 of them. Plus you are spending a lot of specialization on the two weapon fighting. Greater Two Weapon fighting requires a dexterity of 19, which will really cut into your budget for buffing strength. Having such a high dexterity and losing armor training means that you will be optimally using lighter armors.

A regular fighter using a two-hander would pump out similar, if not better numbers, without trying so hard. So, it's not like this build is OP. It's just adequate.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

The Two Weapon Warrior archetype is completely unnecessary for this... in fact, I think it might be a mistake... You don't need 'improved balance' at all because shield master makes it so you take no penalties for wielding a weapon in the other hand (it doesn't matter that both are one handed), and you lose armor training! That might not sound like a huge deal, but bear in mind that you need a lot of Dex for the later 2wf feats... if you want to maximize his AC, armor training will be awesome (at 11th level it would let you wear mithril full plate with upto +6 Dex and no penalty to movement).

In fact... Dex is really important for a build like this... Why not run with that... This might be a little bit cheesy, but a 1 level swashbuckler dip might really open up this build... Take weapon versatility with large shield so you can count it as a 1 handed slashing weapon, then take Slashing Grace with it- now you can use your Dex for damage instead of Str, and SG plus swashbuckler's finesse means you get to use Dex for attack rolls too! Weapon finesse makes you take your shield's ACP as a penalty to attack rolls, but shield master doesn't say that you take no 2wf penalties, it says you take no penalties to attack rolls with your shield while wielding another weapon... so, technically, you get to ignore the finesse penalty too!

Sczarni

Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Baumfluch wrote:

I did find the Bashing enhancement aswell, but i dont think its actually good.

If you have a medium sized heavy spiked steel shield it deals 1d6. making it bashing, granting +2 size categories you go to 2d6.

That's actually incorrect as well.

A Heavy Shield deals 1d4
A Spiked Heavy Shield deals 1d6
A Bashing Heavy Shield deals 1d8
A Bashing Spiked Heavy Shield deals 1d8

Bashing and Shield Spikes do not stack together.


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CountofUndolpho wrote:

If you were to try and use two normal shields to fight with in a game, I would ask you to show me where it states this is possible rather than just point out it doesn't say you can't.

If you were to try and use two normal swords to fight with in a game, I would ask you to show me where it states this is possible rather than just point out it doesn't say you can't.

If you were to try and use two normal daggers to fight with in a game, I would ask you to show me where it states this is possible rather than just point out it doesn't say you can't.

If you were to try and use two normal axes to fight with in a game, I would ask you to show me where it states this is possible rather than just point out it doesn't say you can't.

Funny enough, none of the two-weapon fighting rules list which specific weapons you're allowed to fight with. Obviously, this means you're not allowed to use any weapons at all.

Sovereign Court

Yes - that is the most powerful TWF combat style (though feat intensive - plus a trait). You lose a bit of damage vs normal TWF as you have a weaker crit (though +2 to hit higher), but that's more than made up for by having better defense than sword & board (not for AC - but you have another item to spread other defenses around on more cheaply) and getting your enchantment for the same cost as two-handed.

It's superior to sword & board TWF as it's cheaper and you get the static bonuses (especially with fighter weapon training/weapon spec etc) for both weapons.

The main reason to get Bashing is if you're starting the campaign below level 11, before you can get Shield Master. In addition, an extra d6 physical damage is generally better than d6 energy damage. (except against swarms) This is because if the target has just resistance 5, the d6 damage is virtually worthless. Likely the rest of the weapon's damage has already punched through any DR that the target may have, so they virtually always take the extra d6.

Sovereign Court

Nefreet wrote:
Baumfluch wrote:

I did find the Bashing enhancement aswell, but i dont think its actually good.

If you have a medium sized heavy spiked steel shield it deals 1d6. making it bashing, granting +2 size categories you go to 2d6.

That's actually incorrect as well.

A Heavy Shield deals 1d4
A Spiked Heavy Shield deals 1d6
A Bashing Heavy Shield deals 1d8
A Bashing Spiked Heavy Shield deals 1d8

Bashing and Shield Spikes do not stack together.

That's debatable as a Heavy Spiked Shield is listed as a seperate entry on the weapons table.


Nefreet wrote:
Baumfluch wrote:

I did find the Bashing enhancement aswell, but i dont think its actually good.

If you have a medium sized heavy spiked steel shield it deals 1d6. making it bashing, granting +2 size categories you go to 2d6.

That's actually incorrect as well.

A Heavy Shield deals 1d4
A Spiked Heavy Shield deals 1d6
A Bashing Heavy Shield deals 1d8
A Bashing Spiked Heavy Shield deals 1d8

Bashing and Shield Spikes do not stack together.

It's still a bit iffy, because the spiked shield has its own weapon entry. You could argue the bit about sizes in the weapon description is just flavor text.

You could also argue that a shield spike is not a "size changing effect", because it is a real permanent part of that thing and not an "effect".

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
wraithstrike wrote:
bigrig107 wrote:

You do realize that the shield must be enchanted separately, as weapons and shield, right?

The shield price table does not apply to shield as weapons.
You must pay for them separately.

There is a feat that allow for your shield enhancement to apply to attacks as if it is a weapon enhancement. That is why the player is trying to do this.

The feat only allows you to have your +X shield act as a +X weapon.

This still closes out things such as bane and energy bonus damage enchantments and much of anything else that's not a +X enhancement bonus. So don't expect a lot of Paladins, Arcane Duellist Bards, or magi (even the ones with the shield using archetype) to find this of much use.


A flaw in the entire "2 shields" combat style is that you are only allowed to have one magic shield. You only have one shield slot (CRB p459).

So, if you want to TWF with a magic shield and a non-magic shield, you can. But if you want to TWF with two magic shields, one of them is non-functional.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Gauss wrote:

A flaw in the entire "2 shields" combat style is that you are only allowed to have one magic shield. You only have one shield slot (CRB p459).

So, if you want to TWF with a magic shield and a non-magic shield, you can. But if you want to TWF with two magic shields, one of them is non-functional.

They're putting that second shield in the Weapon slot, because they're using it as a weapon.


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Then it needs to be enchanted as a weapon and not as a shield. If it is enchanted as a shield they cannot then use the shield enchantment as a weapon enchantment if they are already doing that with the other shield (due to only one shield slot).

So yes, you can save half the money on one shield but not the other.


LazarX wrote:
Gauss wrote:

A flaw in the entire "2 shields" combat style is that you are only allowed to have one magic shield. You only have one shield slot (CRB p459).

So, if you want to TWF with a magic shield and a non-magic shield, you can. But if you want to TWF with two magic shields, one of them is non-functional.

They're putting that second shield in the Weapon slot, because they're using it as a weapon.

I agree with this ruling, but I do wonder how it affects all of the other shield enchant bits. For instance, the bashing enchant is on the shield part of the shield, and if you aren't using the shield as a shield, should you really be able to benefit from its "shield-ness", when using the shield as a weapon.


@nate-lange:
thx. i had to google all the things you wrote. i´m from Germany, and at the beginning of our campaign, we agreed, that we only wanna use content, as its published in german. unfortunatly i cant use this build due to that Point, or give my mate the hint, but thanks for the Suggestion, i think i might use this in future rounds.
Perhaps we have to rethink the 2WF archetype.

@nefreet: thx. didnt know this one. so actually bashing is even more worthless compared to other +1weapon enhancements. but also a bit cheaper.

@chengar: yes thats what i think aswell. Seems silly, but well.. its still a Fantasy rpg, so why not.

@charon. i agree. i prefer that build (with nate-langes edit even more) over usual 2 weapons or "sword and board" builds. also i'm experiencing a slight Advantage to other fighter classes in our game, since the build is very-well balanced between offense and defense and pretty damn good in both.

@lazar: "The feat only allows you to have your +X shield act as a +X weapon.
This still closes out things such as bane and energy bonus damage enchantments and much of anything else that's not a +X enhancement bonus. So don't expect a lot of Paladins, Arcane Duellist Bards, or magi (even the ones with the shield using archetype) to find this of much use."

its possible to enhance one item with different kinds of enhancements. they just get more expencive, but according to the "create Magic items" chapter in the corerulebook at "Multiple Different Abilities" i think you may enhance your shield with a +x AC Bonus and other +x weapon abilities, increasing the overall cost. i think you could even create a shield with +5AC enhancement and +5 Attack and damage enhancement giving a shieldmaster a total of +10/+10 but im NOT SURE with that.

@gauss: i´m pretty sure lazar is right. as i use the shield as weapon i place them in the weapon Slot. if this would eventually not work, you could enhance 1 shield with AC Bonus and 1 shield with weapon enhancement, then it would surely work.

Thanks all for the great Posts with rulequotes, helps a lot.


Baumfluch wrote:

...stuff

I mean, i wanna attack with attack with my shield. what do the rules say? "treat it as a onehanded weapon". i wanna do 2 attacks with my shield, can i do this?. ofc since is treated "as a one handed weapon".
I have a shield in each Hand. can i attack with both? no, you could do this with a shield and a one-handed-weapon, but not with a shield and a 2nd shield even though it is treated "as a one handed weapon"?. Doesnt sound too logical in my ears.
I think that would go a bit far. Anything you can do with a Weapon, you also can...

The full quote under Weapons in UE is "You can bash with a heavy shield instead of using it for defense. The shield entries for heavy shields appear on page 11." p.11 gives you the specific rules for the shield.

It doesn't actually say if you want to attack treat it as a one-handed weapon though does it? it says for attack penalties treat it as a one-handed weapon. As for anything you can do with a weapon bit, it also works like armour, it has an armour check penalty and really that's the bit that puts the kibosh on it for me, in rule terms, it is so big and awkward and heavy it imposes a penalty on dex and strength based skill checks.

Even if you make it from Mithril it wouldn't alter the fact that it should have an ACP. It also wouldn't allow you to hold anything in your hand for a heavy or wield anything you held for a light. You will also notice that the term bash is used for a shield attack pretty much across the board again indicating it's something different from normal.

As for logic, I apologise for the RW connection but if you have a museum or armory near you go and have a look at a shield. I understand it's not about reality but we already stretch it with shield bashing.

As for why the rules don't specifically ban it I've played D&D and now PFRPG for 38 years and this is the first time I've ever encountered people thinking you could do it and it makes sense. Like I said I'm not your GM so this is just how I see it.

Thanks for trying to answer the points I made.

Edited for too many nows


On another point how would you put the other shield on?

You strap a heavy steel shield to your forearm and grip it with your hand. A heavy steel shield is so heavy that you can't use your shield hand for anything else.

Or You strap a light steel shield to your forearm and grip it with your hand. A light steel shield's weight lets you carry other items in that hand, although you cannot use weapons with it.

So can you manipulate stuff with a light shield on? Pick locks etc?


You can do it all with one shield if you're a shield champion. Talk about saving money!

Shield: +5 to Attack, Damage and AC = 25,000 gp

Unarmed Strike: VS +5 to Attack, Damage = 100,000 gp

And Shield Champions also get a scaled base damage for the shield, which can be raised with Monk's Robes.


Thanks again 4 that post.

Now i fully understood your Argumentation i think.
I wouldn´t say thats false anymore, i try to get my Argumentation straight aswell. i think the rules can be understood in both ways unfortunatly. My idea was:

Case1:
Main Hand: Longsword, Off-Hand: Longsword
-> -4/-4 and works perfectly fine with 2 weapon fighting
Case2:
Mainhand: Longsword, Off-Hand: Heavy Shield
-> -4/-4 and works perfectly fine with 2 weapon fighting
Case3:
Mainhand: Heavy Shield, Off-Hand: Longsword
-> -4/-4 and works perfectly fine with 2 weapon fighting

For all effects of two weapon fighting, a shield acts excactly as a longsword. Also according to str-bonus on offhand, two weapon rend etc.
I think its totally straight to the combat mechanics, that:
Case4:
Mainhand: heavy Shield, Off-Hand: Heavy Shield
would also lead into -4/-4 just the same way.

You can use the shield in the main Hand, you can use it in the offhand, it acts just as a longsword according to all feats you wanna use. It´s meant to be used as a weapon. I wouldnt make a difference then if i take 2 Shields.

But as written above, i understand why you think the rules would not allow this. Once again i guess, truth could only be found by a clarification from the Designers. Until that Point, its to be discussed in the Party.


@ Count:

Problem solved i guess. Put Spikes on it. Quote from Core Rules:
"Shield Spikes: These spikes turn a shield into a martial piercing weapon and"

they TURN it into a martial piercing weapon. no more "treated as" and so on. This passage clearly say that the shield is at least ALSO a martial weapon. thats how i read it.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

The shield is a weapon.

Stain your panties, or houserule as much as the desire hits you.

This doesn't change the fact that, within the real world, and more importantly, within the Pathfinder game, shields are weapons.

Do I have to mention again, there are Metal Fighting Beards, and Bat'leths in Pathfinder?


i've played a dual wielding shield basher in a home game and it was quite fun. did the first 6 lvls as ranger that way i got shield master at lvl 6. used the infiltrator and trapper archetypes and then went into fighter after that. worked quite well.

there can be a couple weird issues when you start enchanting your shields though.

a shield has the potential to have up to +10 armor enchants and +10 weapon enchants. so lets say i make it a +5 shield with +1 ghost touch on the weapon side, do i get the shield bonus to incorporeal touch attacks?


Pathfinder Maps Subscriber
dedpropht wrote:

lets say i make it a +5 shield with +1 ghost touch on the weapon side, do i get the shield bonus to incorporeal touch attacks?

No. Unless you have some ability that lets you use the shield's shield enhancement bonus as a weapon enhancement bonus (there are some), they don't interact.

Sovereign Court

SlimGauge wrote:
dedpropht wrote:

lets say i make it a +5 shield with +1 ghost touch on the weapon side, do i get the shield bonus to incorporeal touch attacks?

No. Unless you have some ability that lets you use the shield's shield enhancement bonus as a weapon enhancement bonus (there are some), they don't interact.

You mean like the Shield Master feat he mentioned getting? (Though I don't think making the shield a ghost touch weapon would affect the AC bonus at all. No indication that it would.)


Pathfinder Maps Subscriber

That's one of them. I think there's an equipment trick too, but I don't have access to my books atm. I agree about the non-enhancement abilities, but there may be some character ability that works on those too.


CountofUndolpho wrote:
wraithstrike wrote:
2 shields is allowed by the rules and it has actually been a real fighting style. It is just not as popular as using a sword or other weapon in the opposite hand.

I presume you are referring to the video of a martial artist doing forms with two tiger 'shields' that actually seemed much more like scizores due to being a half tube of steel strapped to the forearm that ended in two spikes going beyond the hand? If so I take issue with your statements.

If you were to try and use two normal shields to fight with in a game, I would ask you to show me where it states this is possible rather than just point out it doesn't say you can't.

Why would the rules need to state it is possible? Shields are also weapons. You would need to prove that it can't be done. Now if shields were only shields and not listed as martial weapons then you would have a point.

As an out of game argument you can look up the name of the fighting style. It was based out of China if I recall correctly.

However there still may be a rules issue with this, but just using two shields is not one in and of itself.


LazarX wrote:
wraithstrike wrote:
bigrig107 wrote:

You do realize that the shield must be enchanted separately, as weapons and shield, right?

The shield price table does not apply to shield as weapons.
You must pay for them separately.

There is a feat that allow for your shield enhancement to apply to attacks as if it is a weapon enhancement. That is why the player is trying to do this.

The feat only allows you to have your +X shield act as a +X weapon.

This still closes out things such as bane and energy bonus damage enchantments and much of anything else that's not a +X enhancement bonus. So don't expect a lot of Paladins, Arcane Duellist Bards, or magi (even the ones with the shield using archetype) to find this of much use.

I understand that, but that is not a point I was making.


There is no weapon slot that I know of. I guess holding two magical shields is treated as wearing two necklaces or 3 rings etc etc. Once of them turns off.


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I personally think the dual-wielding klars is the way to go with this.

Primarily because they look cool as hell. You're stabbing people to death with giant lizard skulls.


This is all quite interesting. Dotting.

(although, for me, it's in relation to something else)


"There is no weapon slot that I know of. I guess holding two magical shields is treated as wearing two necklaces or 3 rings etc etc. Once of them turns off."
disagree. you can wear a Magic weapon and a Magic shield, no doubt. since a shield is also a weapon, i think you can run 2 shields.
if not, then you take:
1 shield enhanced with armorenhancements
1 shield enhanced with weaponenhancements.
in that case i think its obvious treating 1 as weapon and 1 as shield in Terms of magical item Slots.


Baumfluch wrote:

"There is no weapon slot that I know of. I guess holding two magical shields is treated as wearing two necklaces or 3 rings etc etc. Once of them turns off."

disagree. you can wear a Magic weapon and a Magic shield, no doubt. since a shield is also a weapon, i think you can run 2 shields.
if not, then you take:
1 shield enhanced with armorenhancements
1 shield enhanced with weaponenhancements.
in that case i think its obvious treating 1 as weapon and 1 as shield in Terms of magical item Slots.

Yeah that could work, but the OP partly wanted it for the double reduction in price, however for thematic reasons that should work.

Also when I said one of them turns off I was speaking of as a magical shield. The magic item section specifically says you only get one magical item per slot, and there is a shield slot. Of course rings are the exception. You get two of those.

edit: I see you are the OP, but yeah look at the magic item section and rule on slots.

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