If I am using a shield to bash and I have weapon finesse, does the shield count as a light weapon for weapon finesse?
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Only if it's a light weapon.
Light shields = Yes.
Heavy shields = No. It's a one-handed weapon.
If you have the shield-trained Gorum religion trait, then you can finesse a heavy shield as it makes you treat it as a light weapon.
Thank you for the quick response!
I think the armor check penalty of a shield is a negative modifier to attacks when you use weapon finesse.
I think the armor check penalty of a shield is a negative modifier to attacks when you use weapon finesse.
Yea if the shield is strapped on for a shield bonus to AC, the armor check penalty would apply if finessing and bashing. Masterwork light shield or mithral shields should help remedy that.
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I think the armor check penalty of a shield is a negative modifier to attacks when you use weapon finesse.
Source on that, because I've never heard such a thing.
If you're not proficient with the shield you would take the armor check penalty to both your attack and skill checks. However, if you are proficient with shield it only applies to strength and dex based skill checks.
Edit: Found it in the text of weapon finesse.
Benefit: With a light weapon, rapier, whip, or spiked chain made for a creature of your size category, you may use your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier on attack rolls. If you carry a shield, its armor check penalty applies to your attack rolls.
Special: Natural weapons are considered light weapons.
I've even used Klar with slashing grace.
Dosent the klar count as armor spikes?
Edit: now i looked.It is a ligth weapon so it dosent work with slashing grace.
And it is piercing so it dosent work with slashing grace.
Or am missing somthing?
Klar is listed as a 1 handed martial slashing weapon in UE.
It qualifies just fine for slashing grace.
Its description says differently. Generally, text trumps table.
The traditional form of this tribal weapon is a short metal blade bound to the skull of a large horned lizard, but a skilled smith can craft one entirely out of metal. A traditional klar counts as a light wooden shield with armor spikes; a metal klar counts as a light steel shield with armor spikes.
Klar's in specific do slashing rather than B or P like normal shield or shield spikes.
I haven't played it but I've now made a shield champion dex based improvment version.
Cool i was looking at the text only. And it seem to disagree with the table. The text say it counts a ligth shield with armor spikes. That should most likely have been shield spikes at least:) So i Will assume the text to be faulty.
Cool i was looking at the text only. And it seem to disagree with the table. The text say it counts a ligth shield with armor spikes. That should most likely have been shield spikes at least:) So i Will assume the text to be faulty.Klar's in specific do slashing rather than B or P like normal shield or shield spikes.
I haven't played it but I've now made a shield champion dex based improvment version.
When the write up and the "tables" conflict, the write up is what is considered "correct" rules wise.
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I think the armor check penalty of a shield is a negative modifier to attacks when you use weapon finesse.Yea if the shield is strapped on for a shield bonus to AC, the armor check penalty would apply if finessing and bashing. Masterwork light shield or mithral shields should help remedy that.
Or a darkwood shield. You lose a bit of hardness and don't go through DR/Silver vs mithril, but you can get it far cheaper. Besides, you're unlikely to attack with the shield itself very often anyway, you'd be attacking with the spikes. (need to be made mithril seperately)
i know i am about to open the floodgates for the "this is the rules forum, so only the text matters, RAI is irrelevant until a FAQ is issued or errata printed. Long Live RAW!"
That said - the line in Weapon Finesse seems pretty obvious it is referring to you carrying a finesse-able weapon in one hand and shield in in the other. That is what is causing the penalty - the extra weight. but if the light weapon you are using happens to be a shield, and your other hand is empty - It does not seem like the rules intended to penalize you while you use your finesse-able weapon of choice.
When the write up and the "tables" conflict, the write up is what is considered "correct" rules wise.Cool i was looking at the text only. And it seem to disagree with the table. The text say it counts a ligth shield with armor spikes. That should most likely have been shield spikes at least:) So i Will assume the text to be faulty.Klar's in specific do slashing rather than B or P like normal shield or shield spikes.
I haven't played it but I've now made a shield champion dex based improvment version.
Yes but the text claims it is a shield with armor spikes and that is nonsense since shields need shield spikes to do somthing in that department.