My first Pathfinder Society / Pathfinder game EVER n my character is Dead


Pathfinder Society

51 to 100 of 255 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | next > last >>
****

crit confirmed wrote:
Try being a cleric.

Yes and no... While you definitely won't be turned away if you bring a support-capable class to the table, Clerics have alot going on with it. It's a very versatile class that's easily overwhelming for new players. There's a few good guides floating around out on the web that can certainly help give you ideas on how to build one. However, I'd recommend to brand new players to stay away from heavy spellcasting classes until there is a good understanding of the core mechanics of the game.

That's not to say being a cleric or wizard is any more difficult, it's just that the learning curve is much steeper. You're trying to figure out how the game works on top of trying to obtain a mastery of the spell system of this ruleset. A feat, which admittedly, took myself quite a few priests and magi characters to obtain. (Ahh, the good D&D 3.0 days...) An alchemist's curve isn't as steep, but it's definitely more than a ranger or paladin.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I just lost my 1st PFS character last week. Fighting a demon-antelope thing in a tree with a hunter. What I learned:

1) Don't be afraid to NOT ATTACK. This is not D&D, survival is first and foremost. Had I stayed hidden and kept using my crossbow, even though it could only attack once every 2 rounds, I would've avoided the killing blow.

2) Don't be a hero. Being a hero can be nice, but remember that you can't help your party if you are dead.

3) DO NOT assume that you will make your rolls, and do not bank on making a skill check you're good at. I had +9 acrobatics, so I thought I could safely disengage and avoid the opportunity attack. I rolled a 1, got KO'd, and dropped 20 ft to the ground.

4) Invest in CON. It isn't useful for most skills, but having 2 extra hit points means it takes 4 more damage to kill you in one blow. That'll come in handy.

Those are my tips. It sucks losing a character, but you have to remember that Pathfinder is much more strategy-filled than D&D.

Silver Crusade **

Zadocfish2 wrote:

I just lost my 1st PFS character last week...

2) Don't be a hero. Being a hero can be nice, but remember that you can't help your party if you are dead.

Don't be a hero!

Shadow Lodge

A tip when fighting channelers(don't overdo it though): Sunder their unholy symbols. Yeah, it's a bit cheap, but if you are being blown to bits and are seconds away from a TPK, no gm is going to cry foul about this tactic.

If you overdo it though, they get to roll out the big guns and tell you how "there's no symbol listed in their loadout, but the tactics call for channeling so obvs there are symbols all over their robe/armor/loincloth!" I've had it happen!

As an aside the worst thing to do against channelers is to grapple them. Yeah, it's a tried and true anti-caster move, especially at low levels, but channeling doesn't get hindered by it at all.

*****

Zadocfish2 wrote:
3) DO NOT assume that you will make your rolls, and do not bank on making a skill check you're good at. I had +9 acrobatics, so I thought I could safely disengage and avoid the opportunity attack. I rolled a 1, got KO'd, and dropped 20 ft to the ground.

You also need a good handle on how difficult things are likely to be. In that particular scenario you are looking at DC21 to acrobatics away, DC25 in the high tier. With +9 you are looking at a 45%/25% chance of success assuming you move at half speed.


3 people marked this as a favorite.

A holy symbol is required to channel unless they have that tattoo so if the GM tries to pull that excuse he is basically cheating.

Shadow Lodge

But many enemy clerics don't have symbols. It's not cheating when the scenario itself is written wrong.

*****

Muser wrote:
But many enemy clerics don't have symbols. It's not cheating when the scenario itself is written wrong.

Spell component pouches and holy symbols are often not listed, especially in earlier scenarios. I assume these are generally cut for word count reasons, do people really not allow enemy spellcasters to use their abilities because of a badly written stat block?

Edit: Actually it's not just older scenarios. Looking at By Way of Bloodcove the enemy caster doesn't have a spell component pouch listed on either the low or high tier.


Muser wrote:
But many enemy clerics don't have symbols. It's not cheating when the scenario itself is written wrong.

It is still cheating because the rules say you can't channel without a holy symbol so the GM can not let the cleric channel, or he can say the symbol is there. Holy symbol drawn on clothes can not be used to channel or cast spells. Many NPC's don't have things they should such as holy symbols or spell component pouches listed.

* RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

There's a few scenarios that are absolutely brutal, but they're the exception, not the rule. My first PFS game had wights and shadows (monsters that can one-hit 1st level characters and are virtually unkillable by low level characters).

If a new character dies, just register another one with the exact same character sheet.

Liberty's Edge ***** Venture-Lieutenant, Maryland— Baltimore aka Qstor

Sorry that happened. If you want give it a shot again and take Toughness as a feat.

Mike


Or just give it another go. All the advice about toughening up the character is reasonable and useful, but the main point you should take away from this is that your experience was unusual.

Deaths and even TPKs are certainly possible, but they're not that common. Certainly not a couple dead PCs in every session.

I haven't played a lot of PFS, but I've got an alchemist who started with 9 hp and is now 2nd level. Only one near death experience - down to 0 from a crossbow sneak attack.

One more piece of advice, should you decide to try again and restart with the same alchemist, at second level you can take the Precise Bombs discovery which lets you exclude people from your splash damage, thus letting you throw into melee with less trouble.

**** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—St. Louis Park aka BretI

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I am sorry that your first experience was a character death. I am not familiar with the scenario you went through, but judging from the comments the GM went out of their way to kill your character. I do not feel that is appropriate for a "Pathfinder for Beginners" session.

If you haven't already done so, you should download the Guide to Organized Play. It talks about the special rules that are used for Organized Play including some of the changes done to character creation. It and the Additional Resources are needed when creating a character of your own rather than playing a pregenerated character.

If you decide to try Pathfinder Organized Play again, I would strongly suggest that you look for either The Confirmation or The Wounded Wisp scenario. Playing these as a first scenario on a new character has a few advantages. Both of these scenarios are designed for 1-2 level characters, and the very first session on a first level character is the most dangerous. They are both -- you can go through it more than once with different characters. In general you aren't allowed to play the same scenario twice (even with different characters), but there a special scenarios that don't have that restriction.

I am not sure why the person running a "Pathfinder for Beginners" did not run The Confirmation. It is specifically designed to introduce people to both the game and the world that Pathfinder Organized Play is run in.

Now some things that you may not have known:
* Pathfinder Organized Play allows you to rebuild a 1st level character. The rules for this are in the Guide to Organized Play. You can take advantage of this by taking the Toughness feat at first level, and before playing your first adventure of 2nd level changing the feat. This improves survivability.
* There is something called a Favored Class Bonus -- a bonus for any time your character takes the class you decide is their favored class. Basically it is a bonus to encourage you to stay with one class. You can get +1 Hit Point from this.
* Every point of Constitution matters. You die at -CON or greater, so a 13 vs. 12 constitution can make enough of a difference to prevent death. I have had situations where a single hit point is the difference between life and death.
* There is an example Alchemist in the Pregenerated Characters. Although these aren't highly optimized characters it can be useful to look at for an example of how to build a character.
* Alchemists can take Cure Light Wounds as an infusion. This is important because it means you can also use a Wand of Cure Light Wounds without needing the Use Magic Device skill.
* The GM is supposed to run as written in order to reduce table variation. That said, in the GM section of the Guide to Organized Play it specifically states:

Guide to Organized Play, pg. 35 wrote:
While we don’t advocate fudging die rolls, consider the experience of the player when deciding whether to use especially lethal tactics or if a character is in extreme danger of death, especially when the player is new to the game. Most players whose first experience in a campaign results in a character death don’t return to the campaign.

That last part isn't a free pass for characters to be foolish. It is a reminder to the GM that the event is supposed to be fun for everyone at the table. There should be some challenge, but it sounds like your GM went out of their way to kill some characters.

After your first or second successful adventure (once you have two Prestige Points), you can get a free wand of Cure Light Wounds from your faction. Prestige Points and Fame are something used in Organized Play to indicate how many favors you can call in from the society and how famous you are within the society. When I started, I was encouraged to buy a wand of Cure Light Wounds with my first two Prestige Points and having played a while I now encourage others to do the same.

I would suggest you check the list of venture captains to find one in your area. Check if what you experienced is normal in your area, and ask if there are any plans to run The Confirmation in your area.

I have found Organized Play is a fun way to get some games in that match your schedule and meet new people. Although I've had a couple of bad experiences, overall I've enjoyed it.

Have fun!

Grand Lodge

jtaylor, I totaly understand where your coming from. I played my first PFS event about 6 months ago. The scenario we were in had us following a thief and I was the only one able to keep up with him. Suddenly he's gone ... then I get sneak attacked for full damage with a crit at full damage. I dropped and without a cleric in the group there I died. The thing is I watched the DM roll all the dice and there was nothing I could do to stop it. The BBEG was played as written. But the thing is, for me, this is exactly how I would of expected the bad guy to react. I mean wouldn't you do everything possible to try and kill someone that is trying to kill you. We are never guaranteed to live through a scenario 1st lvl, 12th lvl, or even 20th lvl. It happens, some times we end up in a group in a story that just makes it harder than for another group.

I hate that you had a experiance your first time out the gate. But give it anouther try, maybe a different GM if that would help.

The silver lining here is just because that charecter you put all that time and effort into is dead does not mean that you can't use him again exactly the same way he is as you #-2; that's exactly what I did, now hes lvl 3 and getting cooler each time I get to play. Heck when he dies I may just reissue him again.

Scarab Sages ****

BretI wrote:
Guide to Organized Play, pg. 35 wrote:
While we don’t advocate fudging die rolls, consider the experience of the player when deciding whether to use especially lethal tactics or if a character is in extreme danger of death, especially when the player is new to the game. Most players whose first experience in a campaign results in a character death don’t return to the campaign.

Thanks for finding that, Brett. That was the section I was talking about earlier, but I couldn't track it down. A GM is absolutely allowed to alter tactics slightly to avoid killing a new player and creating a situation like this. The GM could have switched to casting Cause Fear, since that's even specifically included in the cleric's tactics as an option. Or the GM could have simply not gone out of his way to move the cleric into position to channel to harm an unconscious character. Her tactics say she channels frequently. Frequently does not mean every round. There were other choices that could have been made, and they were perfectly legal to make.

Dark Archive ****

One of my highest level characters was created as the result of my brother's character death. Ulrik was his dwarven barbarian who was killed in action by three enlarged druids with quarterstaves. So I made Ulrik Ulrikson, who has been an absolute joy to play, and even has an ironclad reason to protect other Pathfinders (especially from druids).

Don't get too attached to the one character. Make another story.

* RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

2 people marked this as a favorite.
jtaylor73003 wrote:
I play to have fun.

One thing about RPGs is that everyone has a different definition of fun.

I played my first core game a few weeks ago with a brand new level 1.(along with 3 other pregens, we played silent tide, which is the first scenario ever, so presumably designed with brand new PCs in mind.)
The GM rolled in the open and blatantly "fudged" her die rolls in the partys favor all game long.
After the first time my PC would have been hit, and she changed the roll I told her It's ok to hit my PC, and if he happened to die, thats ok with me.
I haven't played Pfs since, because for ME, I have fun when things are run as written and I live or die as the dice fall, and for ME, any fudging in my favor cheapens the game.
Maybe your GM is the type who's definition of fun differs from yours.

Scarab Sages

3 people marked this as a favorite.

I just have to say KUDOS to so many of you responders, especially Outshyn. You have answered amicably and reasonably and kept your cool even under pressure of a persistently unhappy newcomer. As a newcomer myself (just finished my 3rd PFS game and have NEVER done ANY RPG games previously), it makes me smile to see how well this particular thread was handled. Just letting you know your messages ARE watched, and they do make a difference in perception to others- and this one was very definitely positive :)


Grumpus wrote:
jtaylor73003 wrote:
I play to have fun.

One thing about RPGs is that everyone has a different definition of fun.

I played my first core game a few weeks ago with a brand new level 1.(along with 3 other pregens, we played silent tide, which is the first scenario ever, so presumably designed with brand new PCs in mind.)
The GM rolled in the open and blatantly "fudged" her die rolls in the partys favor all game long.
After the first time my PC would have been hit, and she changed the roll I told her It's ok to hit my PC, and if he happened to die, thats ok with me.
I haven't played Pfs since, because for ME, I have fun when things are run as written and I live or die as the dice fall, and for ME, any fudging in my favor cheapens the game.
Maybe your GM is the type who's definition of fun differs from yours.

Fudging is pretty strongly discouraged in PFS, though that bit quoted above about trying not to kill new players' PCs can be stretched to allow it.

I'd say come back to PFS if that's your main reason for avoiding it.

Without fudging and even within following the written tactics, there's a lot of wiggle room to make encounters easier or harder. Without knowing all the details of how the OP's encounter played out, it seems the GM had plenty of leeway to back off a little and might even have broken the "follow the written tactics" rule. At least by having the Woman step up to/stay in melee range to keep the OP's character in Channel range and finish him off.


I'll toss out my $.02 here, I for one HATE when GMs fudge to make the PCs always win.

It feels like I should just read a book about how awesome we are. I want a challenge, not the illusion of one.

Silver Crusade

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Jeff Merola wrote:
jtaylor73003 wrote:
How would have a 14 con help me survive the 3 rounds of spamed channel? I don't understand. The Woman even step forward giving both fighters an attack of opprunity just so she could hit me for the 3rd time.
Uhh, okay that definitely goes against her tactics (she avoids melee unless she's stuck). You definitely had a Killer GM. Sorry to hear that, since it means that other games under him aren't likely to be much better and you've said he's the only one in the area.

I wouldn't say that's necessarily a killer DM. That could very well have been the DM giving the players an out. Especially in a low level module, giving two fighters each an attack of opportunity could easily drop a bad guy, trigger her morale failure to flee, or drop her down enough hit points that the PCs will be able to defeat her when they would otherwise have little chance to do so. Doing so ostensibly in order to include an unconscious and almost dead PC (who would probably bleed out in a few rounds anyway and could almost certainly be coup de graced after the fight was over since it's hard to get a low level PC out of deep negatives--and doubly so without a cleric) is unquestionably poor tactics from a Team Monster PoV (even though it does increase the chance of a PC fatality). It obviously didn't work out for the players in this case, but if the Attacks of Opportunity had dropped her, they would have remembered that fight for a long time as the time when they pulled victory from the jaws of defeat.

It could be a killer DM who just wanted to put a notch in his DM screen. Or that could have been the DM pulling his punches and handing the party a chance to win with no fatalities--which they would otherwise not have had.


Thefurmonger wrote:

I'll toss out my $.02 here, I for one HATE when GMs fudge to make the PCs always win.

It feels like I should just read a book about how awesome we are. I want a challenge, not the illusion of one.

That's good, because no one here is advocating "fudging to make the PCs always win".

The closest is the possibility of fudging to not kill a new players's PC in their first scenario. And even that isn't popular.

Grand Lodge **** Venture-Agent, Colorado—Denver aka roll4initiative

1 person marked this as a favorite.

The Devil we Know was a terrible choice for a "Pathfinder for Beginners" game. And, yes, you had a bad GM. Play an actual beginner scenario (First Steps, The Confirmation, Silverhex Chronicles, or Wounded Wisp) to get the hang of things.

***** Venture-Lieutenant, Georgia—Atlanta aka Yiroep

The general rule I follow if enemies need to "change tactics" is whether the players are new. I don't like giving new players a bad experience.

An all first level table that is experienced players? That's different. I will run it as written for them. But for new players, it's not the greatest of ideas when they are having a rough time. It's even written in the guide.

Organized Play Guide wrote:
While we don’t advocate fudging die rolls, consider the experience of the player when deciding whether to use especially lethal tactics or if a character is in extreme danger of death, especially when the player is new to the game. Most players whose first experience in a campaign results in a character death don’t return to the campaign.

Scarab Sages *****

BretI wrote:


I am not sure why the person running a "Pathfinder for Beginners" did not run The Confirmation. It is specifically designed to introduce people to both the game and the world that Pathfinder Organized Play is run in.

I'll point out that middling constitution characters have been known to die in a single hit - in both Confirmation and first Steps part 1 - especially if the GM decides to Power Attack - but not limited to a power attack swing.

*****

I agree with Elder Basilisk. Giving both fighters an attack of opportunity deliberately might've been the GM's way of trying to soft ball. Obviously, it wasn't effective, but if the bad guy had been down to less than ten hit points and let two beefy characters swing swords, it could've been a "here's your chance to kill me and be a hero" moment on the GM's side. I try not to assume the worst of a GM without being there.

That being said, I've had my share of bad or killer GMs. It happens. And I've killed new player's characters before.

My general tactics with new players is before a player takes an action (such as charging a minotaur after their superior has stated that a minotaur is beyond their capabilities and they should run into a nearby cave, for example) is to explain exactly what the potential reprocussions are of a given action, give an alternate strategy, then ask the player if they truly want to complete said action. If they say yes, I let the dice fall where they may. I dislike the outcome, but I play a game in which we use dice for chance purposes. And who knows? The minotaur could miss his AOO, Valeros could crit and drop him to half health, and an archer could come out and longbow crit and roll max damage. Not likely, but if that's what the players are banking on, who am I to cheapen the experience?

Grand Lodge ***

Dhjika wrote:
BretI wrote:

I'll point out that middling constitution characters have been known to die in a single hit - in both Confirmation and first Steps part 1 - especially if the GM decides to Power Attack - but not limited to a power attack swing.

I have to second this. I've seen a high CON barbarian go from full health to dead in one axe critical during The Confirmation. I know axe crits are the exception rather than the norm, but they do happen.


dwayne germaine wrote:
Dhjika wrote:

I'll point out that middling constitution characters have been known to die in a single hit - in both Confirmation and first Steps part 1 - especially if the GM decides to Power Attack - but not limited to a power attack swing.

I have to second this. I've seen a high CON barbarian go from full health to dead in one axe critical during The Confirmation. I know axe crits are the exception rather than the norm, but they do happen.

I'll say it again: I don't like x3 crit weapons in intro scenarios. They're too swingy. Most times they don't crit so they're not as bad as 19-20 x2 weapons, but when they hit they kill.

It's just bad design. For most groups, they don't add any extra challenge. For 1 in 20, they're a dead PC. And it's almost completely random.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Is there a reason your responses are all grey, are you guys f*~%ing with me?

Well thats a smurfy thing to do on a friday


NJHeart2Heart wrote:
I just have to say KUDOS to so many of you responders, especially Outshyn.

Thanks NJHeart2Heart. I appreciate it. Happy gaming!

Grand Lodge ***** ⦵⦵

Hey jtaylor73003,

First of all, sorry your character died. Like you, my very first PC died at the end of my very first PFS scenario, The Confirmation. I spent weeks trying to find a local venue that ran PFS and, once I did, I spend hours agonizing over the character details and backstory of my first PC, a fencing bard.

It was actually a combination of my lack of experience with tactics (I ran through a threatened area) plus the foe's critical confirmation with almost maximum damage. Even the GM and other players seemed shocked. However both the GM and folk I met playing were so much fun that I kept going back.

At least in my PFS experience, death is rare, but it happens. I'm actually surprised it doesn't happen more. And as much as it sucks, it sucks so much less with a brand new character than one you've had for months.

I tried used it as a learning experience to help me mold future characters. Now, over a year later, I also GM PFS as well as still play with that first GM who killed me because he's a great guy and I made some great friends.

So I guess my suggestion is, if you like the group you're with, to keep going back and learning. Personally, I sure wish I had the Strategy Guide last year it probably would have helped me.

For the most part, the Paizo forums can be a great support group and share really useful advice. Whatever you choose, good luck!

* Dead bard jokes are welcome. One of my current PCs is level 8 and going strong :)

The Exchange ***** RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

Hey there, jtaylor. I'm glad you decided to play in a Pathfinder Society game.

I distinguish between a demo and a game. In a demo, we really want the player to walk away with a positive experience, and that includes softballing lethal encounters as needed.

Once you get to the actual game, with two characters already at 2nd level, then I'm not a fan of making sure that all the characters survive.

**** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—St. Louis Park aka BretI

thejeff wrote:

I'll say it again: I don't like x3 crit weapons in intro scenarios. They're too swingy. Most times they don't crit so they're not as bad as 19-20 x2 weapons, but when they hit they kill.

It's just bad design. For most groups, they don't add any extra challenge. For 1 in 20, they're a dead PC. And it's almost completely random.

If you listen to the NPC and follow directions, it isn't a x3 weapon in The Confirmation.

The Confirmation:
The minotaurur's axe is broken if you fight him at the end. It is only if you immediately attack rather than flee that you are fighting a full strength minotaur with an intact axe.

Edit: Fix quotation.

Liberty's Edge ***** Venture-Lieutenant, Maryland— Baltimore aka Qstor

Thefurmonger wrote:

I'll toss out my $.02 here, I for one HATE when GMs fudge to make the PCs always win.

It feels like I should just read a book about how awesome we are. I want a challenge, not the illusion of one.

It's one thing when you have veteran players at the table. But if you have a table of complete newbies and/or kids. Then I'd say its OK to do it a little bit but with veteran players its different.

Mike

*****

thejeff wrote:
It's just bad design. For most groups, they don't add any extra challenge. For 1 in 20, they're a dead PC. And it's almost completely random.

It isn't just at low levels either. Last week I killed a level 5 PC in a 3-7 with a 69 damage great axe crit. Admittedly it came after a 28 damage normal swing but even without that 69 damage in one blow will kill most level 5 characters. A level 5 14 con d10HD character only has 44hp, even with FCB for HP and toughness they only get to 54hp and would still have been dead.

Really greataxes are just very swingy.

Liberty's Edge *****

11 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
DonKeebals wrote:
You abso-freakin-lutely should not return. If you bought any books, see if you can return them or sell them to another new player.

This is a particularly unhelpful post.

Sczarni

Qstor wrote:
Thefurmonger wrote:

I'll toss out my $.02 here, I for one HATE when GMs fudge to make the PCs always win.

It feels like I should just read a book about how awesome we are. I want a challenge, not the illusion of one.

It's one thing when you have veteran players at the table. But if you have a table of complete newbies and/or kids. Then I'd say its OK to do it a little bit but with veteran players its different.

Mike

I understand the hated. I have had only two scenario plays in which I fudged crit rolls. One table was full of new players to any table top rpg play. Another was half filled with new pathfinder/pfs players. Of the seven new players, three ended up dropping with two others close. I have only fudged crit rolls due to the high percentage of pc death for the new player (player at 2 or 3 hp and death at -12 or -14). For seasoned players, I will not fudge the rolls.

I am sorry for any offense if trying not to run off new players. I want people to have fun. I just do not like the idea of running new green players off just to play the dice exactly as they roll, unless they want honest out in the open results.

Liberty's Edge *****

6 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

My view is this:

1) GMs should follow tactics as best they can, until something changes the circumstances so that tactic no longer makes sense. This is often subjective as to when this should happen.

2) GMs have the ability, and I'd go so far as to say responsibility, to "softball" things in the right circumstances (table with brand new players/characters). This is in the guide and has helpfully been posted above.

3) GMs should learn how to run their table based on the temperature of the team taking part that moment. Assume that there is a scale of 0 being cushy, smooshy softball and 10 being hard core. A GM can reasonably stick to written tactics and still make tactical choices for the badguys that are anywhere from a 0 to a 10. And as a GM, part of your responsibility is gauging what the players at your table want. Do they want a easy session with lots of RP, or do they want a tactical and strategic grind? Some GM's have the annoying habit of running on 11, all the time, regardless of who's sitting at their table.

4) In this case, the GM was following tactics as written, by having her channel over and over. But the GM deviated big time from tactics to have her take two AoO's specifically to catch your unconscious character in another 2d6 (almost ensuring death) channel. This is not ok.

5) Typically, even with mistakes like this, I err on the side of sticking up for the GM. GMs need to be able to make decisions at the table without constantly being called front and center to explain themselves or be chastised. That being said, given the circumstances, I'd also be tempted as a Venture-Officer to overturn the death due to the specific circumstances. That isn't to say I would, but I would be tempted.

Andy

Scarab Sages

outshyn wrote:
Before I sign off, I said earlier that the game being run as-is "has advantages." I want to explain that. The reason that we like the GMs sticking to the module as-written is because it means that when we amp up our power and are able to utterly ruin the enemy using some cool new ability, the GM cannot amp up the monsters and pull the rug out from under us. Just as the GM won't weaken the monster and coddle you, the GM won't double the monster HP and screw you over. If you legitimately find a way to destroy a bad guy in a fast and amazing fashion, then you just get to be awesome, the end.

Interestingly enough, back in February I had a GM who made all the kobolds in the final fight have 10 hp instead of the 5 they were supposed to have. He had been complaining that the fights were too easy because most monsters didn't have enough hit points (we were running tier 1-2 of a 1-5 module), so I guess he decided to fix that problem.

Dark Archive

Ferious Thune wrote:
jtaylor73003 wrote:

I wasn't playing online. I was at gaming store, which was Scheduled as Pathfinder for Beginners. Remember I wasn't just a level one character. I haven't played the system or with this group.

Tsriel you say Game Master's aren't require to "pull punches" I am asking are they allowed to. I don't understand why he even didn't limit the amount of channeling, since he knew we didn't have a cleric who could hear us or even had her retreat sooner after the zombie fell. Or pulled her back more to only catch the heavy fighter since we were stuck on ship in close quarters.

I am also asking why the module is set up to ensure a player death. I can't see how 4 level one characters could survive a person channeling 2d6 damage each turn for several turns in close quarters. I mean wouldn't be better to face someone like that in an open space at low level so not everyone is caught in the channel aura every turn?

It's a poor choice of scenario for a Pathfinder for Beginners session. As I mentioned upthread, the channeling mechanic was new when that scenario was written, so I don't think the difficulty of the scenario was intentional on the part of the writer.

Seconded. Advertising this scenario as for beginers, and running it ruthlessly show poor judgement by said GM. But we're all human and make mistakes. Perhaps you could ask if he could run another scenario for you that doesn't have reputation for being so lethal at low levels. There are a couple of scenarios that are designed specifically for new characters.

Sczarni ***** ⦵⦵

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Starfinder Charter Superscriber
andreww wrote:
Muser wrote:
many enemy clerics don't have symbols.
Spell component pouches and holy symbols are often not listed

My running joke is that since PCs aren't required to list items under 25gp on their ITS then NPCs aren't required to have them in their statblock =P.

Grand Lodge ***** Venture-Agent, Florida—Melbourne aka trollbill

Victor Zajic wrote:
Ferious Thune wrote:
jtaylor73003 wrote:

I wasn't playing online. I was at gaming store, which was Scheduled as Pathfinder for Beginners. Remember I wasn't just a level one character. I haven't played the system or with this group.

Tsriel you say Game Master's aren't require to "pull punches" I am asking are they allowed to. I don't understand why he even didn't limit the amount of channeling, since he knew we didn't have a cleric who could hear us or even had her retreat sooner after the zombie fell. Or pulled her back more to only catch the heavy fighter since we were stuck on ship in close quarters.

I am also asking why the module is set up to ensure a player death. I can't see how 4 level one characters could survive a person channeling 2d6 damage each turn for several turns in close quarters. I mean wouldn't be better to face someone like that in an open space at low level so not everyone is caught in the channel aura every turn?

It's a poor choice of scenario for a Pathfinder for Beginners session. As I mentioned upthread, the channeling mechanic was new when that scenario was written, so I don't think the difficulty of the scenario was intentional on the part of the writer.
Seconded. Advertising this scenario as for beginers, and running it ruthlessly show poor judgement by said GM. But we're all human and make mistakes. Perhaps you could ask if he could run another scenario for you that doesn't have reputation for being so lethal at low levels. There are a couple of scenarios that are designed specifically for new characters.

Well, there is a lot we don't know here. We don't know the GM was the one who organized and advertised the event. He could have simply signed up to GM or even volunteered to run it cold because no one else was available. He may also have had an organizer or even a VO who specifically encourages their GMs not to softball (I have encountered this). Not that there weren't mistakes made here, but one bad run does not a bad GM make. The shear variability of PFS makes it so you will occasionally have a bad experience. You just have to take the good with the bad. Unfortunately for the OP, he got the bad right out of the gate.

To the OP, I would say this:

When I first tried Organized Play back in the days of Living Greyhawk, my very first experience was a table that failed the adventure in the first 15 minutes due to the actions of one of the PCs. I could have quit right then and there and never come back. But I decided to give it another try and I was rewarded by doing so. I would recommend giving PFS a second try. It is worth it.

*

Thanks to everyone who been willing to post. I see there is a varity of opinions, but one of the general themes is that the situation could of been handle differently. I also like to thank the posters will to give tips on building the character, especially the ones willing to go into detail. I see now my Alchemist could had 13 hp instead of 9 hp. 1 hp from favorite class, I have find that in the book, and 3 hp from the Feat Toughness since Brew Potion isn't legal in Pathfinder Society. I can't say that would been the deciding factor, but would given more options on what to do on round two. I am still weary of playing Pathfinder Society and with this Game Master again. I admit if my character dies again, even if it isn't a complete slaughter like this time, I will be following the advice of the first post, and asking for my money back. I will think about everyone's advice, and make a decision when I feel comfortable when I can do without anger, hurt, and confusion I feel right now. The Game Master through his actions sent the message that I was unwanted at the group and in his game, and be extension Pathfinder Society.

Grand Lodge ***** Venture-Agent, Florida—Melbourne aka trollbill

There is one more thing I might suggest. I don't normally suggest this because it is kind of cheesy and it disrupts character continuity, but given your circumstances, I might still recommend it. As has been stated previously, you can completely rebuild a character prior to it reaching 2nd level. So you might want to try starting out with a Barbarian, which is probably the toughest 1st-level character you can get. When you reach 2nd level (which practically doubles your chance of survival) and have had a chance to learn the basic rules better, rebuild the character into whatever it is you want to actually play, be that an alchemist or anything else.

Shadow Lodge ****

Jtaylor, if you take this much umbrage at your pretend character dying in a make-believe game, you should re-evaluate why you feel "anger, hurt, and confusion" since character death can happen at any level. Also, if you are making assumptions about the other GM's motives (that you are unwanted at the group), then you may be reading too much into things.

I know everyone here on the PFS boards wants folks to have a good time every time they play (I know I do), but ups and downs are part of the game and you need to be prepared for that. Was this an ideal first experience? No. But you seem to be taking this way too hard for a game.

*****

Jtaylor - first, welcome to Pathfinder; you had a rough entrance game but it really is worth sticking it out.

Second - Lots of good advice above, and the fact that you're still responding means you're getting it. These forums are a great way to learn about the game, share experiences, learn tricks, etc.

On your feats- alchemists automatically get "extra bombs" instead of "brew potion" in PFS, so, you can't swap it for Toughness (although you could take Toughness as your first level feat if you want). The Guide to Organized Play gives the few deviations for character creation.

I hope you give it a chance again - PFS is a great way to game with lots of other people.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Sammy T wrote:

Jtaylor, if you take this much umbrage at your pretend character dying in a make-believe game, you should re-evaluate why you feel "anger, hurt, and confusion" since character death can happen at any level. Also, if you are making assumptions about the other GM's motives (that you are unwanted at the group), then you may be reading too much into things.

I know everyone here on the PFS boards wants folks to have a good time every time they play (I know I do), but ups and downs are part of the game and you need to be prepared for that. Was this an ideal first experience? No. But you seem to be taking this way too hard for a game.

First game. New experience.

It's easy to assume that first experience is typical. It is after all typical of your experiences with the game.

His character died in the only scenario he's played. Half the characters in the session died, IIRC. If that level of lethality was the norm, I'd walk away in a second. I've got no interest in waiting those odds out to get a character to last.

Of course, those aren't the odds, but that's not clear when your only experience looks that way. That's why that first impression is important. It may actually be even more frustrating when a higher level character dies, but at least by then you know death is actually pretty rare - you've survived a bunch of sessions and you've seen most of your fellows survive too.

I think you're being a little too harsh on him and reading too much into his posts as well.

Shadow Lodge ****

1 person marked this as a favorite.
thejeff wrote:
I think you're being a little too harsh on him and reading too much into his posts as well.

Nah.

*

Sammy T wrote:

Jtaylor, if you take this much umbrage at your pretend character dying in a make-believe game, you should re-evaluate why you feel "anger, hurt, and confusion" since character death can happen at any level. Also, if you are making assumptions about the other GM's motives (that you are unwanted at the group), then you may be reading too much into things.

I know everyone here on the PFS boards wants folks to have a good time every time they play (I know I do), but ups and downs are part of the game and you need to be prepared for that. Was this an ideal first experience? No. But you seem to be taking this way too hard for a game.

I am sorry you feel this way. Let me break it down for you bit by bit.

1. The Previous Night before this Session, I played Dungeons and Dragons 5th Encounters. I had a positive experience. Someone help build my character, guided me between choices, and Game Masters approved my character as legal to play. I brought a $50 book and 4 hours(which if I been working overtime instead of playing a game would mean I would earn $30 an hour) which equals a $170 investment.

2. I brought 2 books for Pathfinder, so I could play an Alchemist. $95

3. I spent 5 hours personal time trying to build this character based on rules in the books. Game master barely review it, no guidance on choices, and according to other posters the character was still illegal.

4. I spent 3 hours during the Session. My actual provided value to the party was mostly choosing not kill them along with the enemies. Yes went last in every encounter, by choice and by advice of the Game Master, also whether I was there or not wouldn't had any effect on the outcomes of those encounters.

5. This is a social game along with a results game. Unlike a board game, or video game, the point isn't to win. The point is to have fun and interact with other like minded individuals. Earlier I described how useless my character was, this didn't hamper me enjoying the social aspect of the game just because I wasn't getting results.

6. Final encounter for me. My character is dead, not just dying but slaughtered. There may be various reasons why this happen, but at the moment, during the play, all that matters is that I am removed from both the results aspect and the social aspect of the game.

7. The Game Master's decisions caused this to happen. Starting with guidance from how my character was made, or whether lack thereof, to the tactics of the final character. This idea is not lessened when I ask "Why didn't the Game Master pull his punches?" I told by other players who couldn't. These comments put more reason my character died on the module instead of the decisions of the Game Master.

8. These Results, and the circumstances leading to these Results, create a negative experience leading to negative feelings; anger, unhappiness, and confusion. Since there is an Social Aspect which is group dynamics. In Military understanding Group Dynamics will improve as person as leader, hence they are taught. One part of Group Dynamics is how outsiders are treated. If they are treated inclusively, then ingratiation income is quick and effective. If they are treated exclusively, then they remain outsiders. The Results and Circumstances lead to exclusive treatment of me, which reinforced an unwelcoming experience vs welcoming one.

9. Now $95 from buying books plus 8 hours personal time ($240) equals $335 investment.

10. $335 investment plus negative experience including negative group dynamics vs $170 investment plus positive experience including positive group dynamics.

Now combining all these factors and comparing my experience and how I value my time. My statement "The Game Master through his actions sent the message that was unwanted at the group and his game, by extension Pathfinder Society." Does not reflect his intentions or motives. It reflects his message that was sent to me.

* Venture-Agent, Utah—Provo aka Chess Pwn

Sorry you feel that way, but if it's not fun for you then leave and play a different kind. My understanding is that 1 pathfinder is one of the more complex RPG games, and if you just throw something together it probably wont play too well. and 2 it's harder/you're more likely to die than other systems. For some this is why we like Pathfinder more than other systems.

but here are some notes about you're issues.

2) you could have purchased the PDF instead of the actual book putting the price a lot lower.

3) Did you ask the game master/others in the group to review or give advice on building your character? Also did you mention that you're really new? I know for me, if I was your GM, and you came with a character prepared I'm going to assume you made your character how you wanted.

3.b) Also there is a whole forum for advice. It's a great place to ask advice and get people's ideas about your character. I know you didn't know about it before, but now you do, so if you're interested we're here to help and explain things

7) I'm sorry you feel this way but I support that he felt his hands were tied, sometimes that means people die. I had it happen my second time playing, but me dying stopped the entire party from dying. But I do understand that once you're dead you feel left out.

8) I don't know what happened, but it could just be personality differences, like I said, if you hadn't asked me for advice and just shown up with a character I wouldn't have offered to look it over either. Also there's the time deal I don't know if you showed up early looking for advice, or showed up right as it started, because if it's time to start it's time to start and delaying is bad for all the other players.

10 Again, this very well could be a system that isn't right for you and that you'll never enjoy playing. Or it could be. But having a "casual and just for fun" attitude will probably lead to more character deaths than not in PFS.

51 to 100 of 255 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | next > last >>
Community / Forums / Organized Play / Pathfinder Society / My first Pathfinder Society / Pathfinder game EVER n my character is Dead All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.