Malusiocus |
So I'm going to be DMing Curse of the Crimson Throne and so beforehand I wanted to know a little bit about our parties composition as the group I'm playing with tend to be a bit unorthodox. I have learned that my whole party will be more or less evil, and I know that once they have an idea like that in their head, they're going to go through with it whether I say yes or no.
I've been a lurker on these threads for awhile so I know that the most frequent solutions to these problems is that I either suggest switching campaigns to one more suited to their desires or I simply talk with my group and tell them what will and will not work in this campaign.
I'm wondering if there are any alternative solutions. All of the players have backgrounds that tie into the campaign quite well and I want to make sure that they are enjoying themselves as much as I am. What are some of my options to make this all work?
Rynjin |
Crimson Throne is the one where they're trying to overthrow the current regime or some such, isn't it?
In that case, the only thing that really changes is motives:
Good guys: We're overthrowing them because they're oppressive and evil.
Evil: We're overthrowing them because dammit, we want OUR chance to be oppressive and evil!
Malusiocus |
You guys basically nailed it. There main motive is to basically seize Korvosa for themselves. My main concern is how their evilness is going to change the interactions between who the campaign intends to be their allies and who the campaign intends to be their enemies.
I tried to at least restrict them by not allowing CN, CE, and NE characters into the campaign, but this is still going to put them at odds with some of their major intended allies.
Fortunately, there are really only two players I really have to worry about reeking hell on the town. It sounds like the possibility of this turning out well is higher than I thought.
NobodysHome |
3 people marked this as a favorite. |
The problem with evil parties and APs is that most APs assume that the party will do certain things "for the greater good", and evil usually assumes that the "greater good" is letting the weak die.
Book 1 isn't much of a problem: The party starts off on a revenge quest, then gets paid good coin to "help" the city by "dealing with" problem locals. Right up the alley of an evil party. You just have to accept a Hellknight-like attitude of, "They were with the criminals, and they did not act to stop the criminals, and therefore they are just as guilty as the criminals, so killing them wasn't an issue."
Book 2 is the big, bad, "How am I going to run this?" moment. Even the LN temple of Abadar is portrayed as not being willing to help in Book 2 without getting paid. I think you're on the right track here, though: "Hey! We were trying to take over the city! What's with it falling into ruin? We can't have that! We want to run a WORKING city!" It's going to be the big stretch for you as a GM to get the PCs to do what they're supposed to be doing in this book.
Book 3 isn't that hard to re-work to overthrowing the existing government. In fact, I would say Book 3 might be the easiest to run with an evil party, because there's going to be a LOT more diplomacy there! Looking back on it, I'd *LOVE* to try re-running Book 3 with an evil party, because it seems like it would be a *LOT* more fun!
Unfortunately, starting in Book 4 the PCs start learning the fundamentals behind the entire AP. *IF* they decide to fight against the BBEG rather than allying with him/her, you should be OK. If they don't, you lose Books 4 and 5. And I'm afraid that's my big concern here. Check out the entire reason they do Book 5. I think you're going to lose that entire book with an evil party. Book 6 can easily work with an evil party.
In short, books 1, 3, and 6 work fine.
Books 2 and 5 are HUGE concerns.
Book 4 can be re-worked to work with them, I think.
Hope that helps!
Ian Bell |
There are a few spots where the game expects the party to team up with or help good-aligned people, and potentially more troublesome, expects good-aligned people to like them enough to want to help *them*. I expect you'll need, at a minimum, to figure out something to replace Vencarlo's role in the campaign, because it sounds likely he will pretty quickly want nothing to do with them.
Knick |
Getting out of the Donjon in Scarwall ought to be hilarious (although I suppose PFRPG forbiddance is weak sauce compared to 3.5e)... and how on earth can the party hope to use the prize they find there? Depending upon how far away from Lawful aligned they skew it's hard to justify Kroft ever trusting them after a job or two in the first book, and (as Ian Bell stated) it seems extremely unlikely that they will endear themselves to Orisini. So, the written hook for Book 3 is out the window and the hook for Book 4 and Book 5 is killed by association. Hard to imagine the rebellion rallying behind a group of terrible people aiming to take the throne for themselves who only MIGHT be better to them than Ileosa. NobodysHome's point concerning Book 2 is also very valid. Hell, the initial hook for book 2 is also a tough sell for evildoers... Why should they give a damn about Grau's niece?
What it really boils down to is: how much work are you interested in doing to bend this AP to an evil party? The above paragraph highlights several things that have to be rethought and, likely, rewritten to accommodate an evil party--and it is far from complete.
In CotCT, like all APs, the characters have to be built by the players to make sense for the AP. They have to come up with their own motivations and ties to the city. The campaign traits certainly help, but they are not a cure all. I see that you mentioned restricting alignment to a point, but alignment is only two words on a piece of paper. Are they going to play Lawful Evil characters? Or just write it down and play NE or CE as it pleases them? You know your players.
If you are determined to rework CotCT for an evil party, it can certainly be done, but you will likely have to come up with entirely new adventure hooks throughout the entire campaign. Everything in the books assumes a party that is dedicated to the city of Korvosa and willing to do whatever it takes to save it (and their fellow Korvosans). If you don't have "Heroes of Korvosa," the fabric of the story is sort of lost, and it becomes a VERY different story. If you're cool with that, than go for it. My best advice is to carefully examine all of your hooks and NPC attitudes. As written, these will all be strained by an evil group.
If you have any specific questions about adapting any of the adventures, I'm always happy to revisit my favorite adventure path.
Hope that inspires!
P.S. In my personal opinion, you're running the wrong AP. I'm not saying don't do it, but there are other APs that are much better suited for an evil group. APs that don't end up being a different story when run with evil players. Just my opinion, of course.