Spirit guide questions


Rules Questions

Shadow Lodge

so 1st off this is a PFS Character

tonight I was examining the possibility of retraining my Life Oracle into a Spirit Guide Oracle when I ran into something

Note - Lots of Rules will be quoted and I'll be using the SRD for easy quoting

the point of question is the Following

Pathfinder SRD wrote:
At 3rd level, a spirit guide can form a temporary bond with a spirit, as the shaman's wandering spirit class feature. She must make this selection each day when she refreshes her spells. A spirit guide cannot bond with a spirit that is incompatible with her alignment, ethos, or mystery (GM's discretion).

so Lets Take a look at the spirit text from Shaman

(yes I realize that the Shaman doesn't gain the spirit ability but for this question I believe it becomes Relavent)

Pathfinder SRD wrote:

A shaman forms a mystical bond with the spirits of the world. She forms a lasting bond with a single spirit, which grants a number of abilities and defines many of her other class features.

At 1st level, a shaman gains the spirit ability granted by her chosen spirit. She adds the spells granted by that spirit to the list of spells that she can cast using spirit magic. She also adds the hexes possessed by that spirit to the list of hexes that she can use with the hex and wandering hex class features.

At 8th level, the shaman gains the abilities listed in the greater version of her selected spirit. At 16th level, the shaman gains the abilities listed for the true version of her selected spirit.

If the shaman takes levels in another class that grants a mystery (such as the oracle), the spirit and mystery must match, even if that means one of them must change. Subject to GM discretion, the shaman can change her former mystery or spirit to make them conform.

Pathfinder SRD wrote:
At 4th level, a shaman can form a temporary bond with a spirit other than the one selected using her spirit class feature. She must make this selection each day when preparing her spells. While this feature is active, she gains the spirit ability granted by the spirit. She also adds the spells granted by that spirit to her list of spells that she can cast using spirit magic. She does not add the hexes from her wandering spirit to her list of hexes that she can choose from with the hex class feature. At 12th level, she gains the abilities listed in the greater version of her wandering spirit. At 20th level, she gains the ability listed in the true version of her wandering spirit.

so the Question is - based on the Following lines of text - can a Spirit Guide Life Oracle take the Life Wandering Spirit as so many have suggested for this Archtype

Pathfinder SRD wrote:
If the shaman takes levels in another class that grants a mystery (such as the oracle), the spirit and mystery must match, even if that means one of them must change. Subject to GM discretion, the shaman can change her former mystery or spirit to make them conform.

and

Pathfinder SRD wrote:
At 4th level, a shaman can form a temporary bond with a spirit other than the one selected using her spirit class feature

Or because an Oracle does not gain the Spirit feature do they ignore it

My Gut is they Could not since the mystery must match the spirit .. and the wandering says a spirit Other than that chosen by the spirit (that must match the mystery)

Edit - cleaned up some useless text

Shadow Lodge

Im gonna bet noone saw this - I hate bumping but I wouldnt mind some other opinions


From the ACG:

Quote:
Parent Classes: Each one of the following classes lists two classes that it draws upon to form the basis of its theme. While a character can multiclass with these parent classes, this usually results in redundant abilities. Such abilities don't stack unless specified. If a class feature allows the character to make a one-time choice (such as a bloodline), that choice must match similar choices made by the parent classes and vice-versa (such as selecting the same bloodline).

The mystery of an oracle and the spirit of a shaman are very similar and are one-time choices like a sorceror/bloodrager bloodline. Accordingly, I would say that since the Bonded spirit ability of the Spirit Guide oracle makes reference to the wandering spirit ability of the shaman, then it must follow these rules as well. It's not completely clear from the RAW, but then there's a lot that isn't in the ACG.


The intent is clearly that the spiritguide oracle can pick a wandering spirit each day (will usually be the same anyway), as the shaman does. The rule text indicates that your GM can bar you from picking certain spirits, usually on RP grounds (like picking decay on a life oracle).

Everything else is pretty clear:
- add the spells to your list of known spells for this day (4th)
- you gain one of the spirits hexes
- you gain the spirits ability (7th)
- you gain the greater spirit ability (15th)
And you lose your revelations at 3rd, 7th and 15th level for this.

The thing about spirit and mystery must match has nothing to do with this ability. That comes only into play if you advance into another class which has one of these.

Back to your question, if a Life Oracle could take a life spirit, the answer is yes. There is just not much point to it in my opinion. The spirit abilities are often watered-down revelations. You can access quite a few spirits (granting you access to different spells and spirit abilities), but the usefulness is limited.
Consider this: I am a life oracle, and my job is keep the group going in the face of big chunks of damage. So what do I want the flexibility for? I cannot really drop the healing stuff and go Flame, unless I risk a TPK. And even if I pick another spirit, my feats will be chosen according to what I usually do, so some will become useless and in extension, my oracle less effective. For example, a nuker could use Empower Spell, for a healer it is a waste of a feat, and vice versa. It is even worse, if I am a battle oracle and switch to heavens.
My point is, that the higher the character, the more it grows in a certain direction (choice of feats, spells, gear, etc.). Making a 90° turn will cost you.

The other thing about the versatility is that it is not so versatile at all. Many spells on the mystery/spirit lists are already on the basic divine list, and many of the arcane spells are not that useful (there are a few highlights, of course).
Without a clear idea how to trade on the versatility (and I don't want to cripple my primary role) I stayed with the traditional oracle in the end.

Sovereign Court

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In my opinion, if you do not actually have the Spirit class feature, you are not barred from choosing any of the spirits.

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