Calm Emotions - What happens when under it's effect?


Rules Questions


Question -
Calm Emotions
School enchantment (compulsion) [mind-affecting]; Level bard 2, cleric 2
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S, DF
Range medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Area creatures in a 20-ft.-radius spread
Duration concentration, up to 1 round/level (D)
Saving Throw Will negates; Spell Resistance yes

This spell calms agitated creatures. You have no control over the affected creatures, but calm emotions can stop raging creatures from fighting or joyous ones from reveling. Creatures so affected cannot take violent actions (although they can defend themselves) or do anything destructive. Any aggressive action against or damage dealt to a calmed creature immediately breaks the spell on all calmed creatures.

This spell automatically suppresses (but does not dispel) any morale bonuses granted by spells such as bless, good hope, and rage, and also negates a bard's ability to inspire courage or a barbarian's rage ability. It also suppresses any fear effects and removes the confused condition from all targets. While the spell lasts, a suppressed spell, condition, or effect has no effect. When the calm emotions spell ends, the original spell or effect takes hold of the creature again, provided that its duration has not expired in the meantime.

What I'm interested in is this line - Any aggressive action against or damage dealt to a calmed creature immediately breaks the spell on all calmed creatures.
- and a definition of what a Aggressive Action can be considered.

What exactly can you do when under the effect of a Calm Emotion spell?
What is a "Aggressive Action"?

Know this is all subjective but looking for some guide lines as we just found out how powerful and abusive the spell can be.

Example: Big nasty boss with a couple guards. Calm Emotions dropped on guards, fail Will saves.

Can the party then ignore the guards (as they can't take a violent action (although they can defend themselves) or do anything destructive) and just work on the Big Boss?

Liberty's Edge

It's a 2nd-level spell. Agressive actions against the boss could afford the guards a new save every round. I know it's not RAW, because there are no rules written covering this, but that's how I'd consider ruling it as GM.

Also remember duration is Concentration, max 1 round/level: concentration has to be maintained by caster.


What can you do? Everything you normally could except what the spell says: violence. Guards under this effect can't attack. But they can go fetch other guards... calmly. Or stand between the big boss and the PCs to form a calm humanoid wall. But yes, the party can ignore them.

There is no quibbling over what a spell like Deep Slumber would do. How is this spell any different?

What is an aggressive action? It's the things those under the effects of the spell can't do. Any kind of violence. Such as a direct attack.

Liberty's Edge

If a guard saves, he can slap the others to "wake them up", breaking the spell.

Liberty's Edge

Lord Magus wrote:
If a guard saves, he can slap the others to "wake them up", breaking the spell.

Deep Slumber and Sleep also make them helpless.

To me this spell pretty much does what it says, no more or less.


The point I am making here is that calm emotions spell is no more powerful or abusive than any other mass will save spell. In fact it is weaker in that regard since it doesn't completely turn off the opponents. By the calm emotions spells text, if the boss slaps one guard they all snap out of it.

But where calm emotions does shine is the removal of morale bonuses. Because barbarians are known for their Will saves.


Hi,
i'm interested at that line of description that says:

- "It also suppresses any fear effects"
and
- "While the spell lasts, a suppressed spell, condition, or effect has no effect"

It seems that this spell gives you temporary "immunity" to fear effects.
Is it correct to suppose that while this spell lasts, any Fear spells (such as Cause Fear or even Phantasmal killer) that are cast on the immediate next rounds don't affect you??

Waiting for replies and thanks

Grand Lodge

Phantasmal Killer is an instantaneous effect, there is nothing to suppress. It doesn't negate spells and it doesn't block incoming effects.

If you were demoralized, Calm Emotions would suppress the demoralization effect from intimidate for the duration it is active.

If you fail a Scare saving throw, or find yourself near a dragon with Frightful Presence, calm emotions will suppress those effects for the duration it is active.

It does not give you immunity to fear effects that have an instantaneous effect, like Phantasmal Killer.

Also something to note, Calm Emotions is one of few spells that completely removes the Confused condition. Unbreakable Heart and Calm Emotions are the only two spells that can do so before you get to Heal. So if allies are confused you can cast calm emotions and immediately cease concentrating, liberating them from their condition while maintaining buffs.


I mostly agree, but I'm not sure about this line:

Syries wrote:
It seems that this spell gives you temporary "immunity" to fear effects.

What's the basis for this statement?

Grand Lodge

blahpers wrote:

I mostly agree, but I'm not sure about this line:

Syries wrote:
It seems that this spell gives you temporary "immunity" to fear effects.
What's the basis for this statement?

not my quote, that was Pinillo85 and I was responding to them :)


Ack, sorry, quoted the wrong line!

Syries wrote:
It does not give you immunity to fear effects that have an instantaneous effect, like Phantasmal Killer.

Grand Lodge

Ah, I see.

Maybe I just have a different interpretation of suppress means in regards to instantaneous effects. I guess I don’t have any RAW quotes (but then again I also haven’t done any forum research on this subject) so I could be wrong.


Syries wrote:

Ah, I see.

Maybe I just have a different interpretation of suppress means in regards to instantaneous effects. I guess I don’t have any RAW quotes (but then again I also haven’t done any forum research on this subject) so I could be wrong.

You're technically correct, it's not immunity (so antipaladin aura wouldn't negate the spell). However, it would supress phantasmal killer, and since the duration of the suppression is longer than the duration of phantasmal killer, phantasmal killer would expire and not do anything.

Grand Lodge

*shrug* I suppose so. As a personal rule I'd probably say instantaneous effects are still effective, especially since phantasmal killer is a fairly weak 4th level spell as it is. For it to be negated by a 2nd level spell just seems to make the Phantasmal Killer that much worse. But that's just me.


Syries wrote:
Also something to note, Calm Emotions is one of few spells that completely removes the Confused condition. Unbreakable Heart and Calm Emotions are the only two spells that can do so before you get to Heal. So if allies are confused you can cast calm emotions and immediately cease concentrating, liberating them from their condition while maintaining buffs.

Unbreakable Heart: target 1 creature; will suppress confusion for 1r/l, but unless the ally is acting normally, they must save against the spell.

Calm Emotions: Area 20' radius; will remove confused condition while you concentrate up to 1r/l.
Heal: target 1 creature; will remove confused condition.

However, the Confusion spell lasts for 1r/l, and while it lasts imposes the confused condition. These other spells will help, but once they are done, the confusion comes back as an effect of this spell since they don't affect this spell.

/cevah

Grand Lodge

Calm Emotions wrote:
... It also suppresses any fear effects and removes the confused condition from all targets.

Calm emotions completely removes the confused condition; you do not need to maintain concentrating on it after a creature is affected by it.

You're right about Unbreakable Heart, it doesn't remove the condition but it does suppress it for essentially the entire time.

Confusion doesn't do anything until the confused character has to roll. If an enemy casts Confusion in round 1 and the cleric casts calm emotions immediately after, all allies can accept the spell without needing to make a save against it. Allies who have already rolled and are doing anything that isn't "act normally" would have to roll to save, however.

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I once saw a PC run into frustrating helplessness thanks to a magic trap that had this spell on it.
He was invisible, then ran away due to a fear affect from an undead foe. Having identified the magic trap previously, he ran to it, activated it, then intentionally failed his saving throw.
...Unfortunately, he was invisible, which required a violent action - which he was now too ambivalent to perform - to stop. Since his undead foes had no way of seeing him, he was forced to watch the rest of the fight. It didn't occur to him to ask one of his allies to try to slap where he was, but I probably should've given him new saves while he watched violence happen to his allies.


Syries wrote:
Calm Emotions wrote:
... It also suppresses any fear effects and removes the confused condition from all targets.
Calm emotions completely removes the confused condition; you do not need to maintain concentrating on it after a creature is affected by it.

True, but if you are under the Confusion spell, the confused condition comes back as soon as you stop concentrating on Calm Emotions. That is why I pointed out the Confusion spell's interaction.

/cevah

Grand Lodge

What? How would it come back when the condition is completely removed?

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