The requirements for pack flanking make it so that I could never see using it. If anyone has any suggestions, I would love them as the benefit this feat grants is amazing.
This feat is obviously designed for the hunter. I know there are a handful of archetypes that would also qualify, but the fact that the only way it works is if you can grant a feat to an animal companion makes it pretty hunter focused. My problem then becomes that I could never see being able to build a hunter with an intelligence high enough to meet the prerequisite 13. I mostly play pathfinder society, but even when I dont, my GMs always base ability scores off of point buy. If I'm a melee oriented hunter, the only time I could see using this feat, I'm going to need a high strength to be effective, a high constitution to stay alive, and I may or may not throw a few points into dexterity to kep from getting hit to often. I need to have a decent wisdom if I want to be able to cast spells and I can't dump my charisma if I want to be able to handle my companion reliably at low levels. Really, the only stat I don't need is intelligence. Except for this one feat. This is the only reason. Does anyone else see this as a problem? Am I missing something or over exaggerating an issue? If anyone has any thoughts on this I could use the help.
Consider a melee hunter with Pack Flanking and Outflank. While adjacent to your AC you and your AC gain a constant +4 to attack rolls - equivalent to a character with a strength 8 higher. Given that, you do not need to focus so much in strength - The point buy number you need to get 13 intelligence is 3, which is not much at all, and I guarantee your strength score, if nothing else, can take that hit. You might feel like you are doing less damage but no, not really, because accuracy = power.
I have used this feat myself, and seen it used on a Mad Dog barbarian, both for PFS. It makes for devastating combatants. Both characters are a bit MAD, but the feats themselves are so powerful it doesn't matter.
Also, YOU may have less strength, but your AC, not so much. As we all know, animal companions are woefully underpowered, and need help in combat.
I totally feel for you, though. I hate Combat Expertise as a feat tax, that's the one feat I've taken so many times and never used. The intelligence requirement doesn't bother me as much, except for the always annoying 13-and-not-12-or-14 number.
Go lunar oracle with a primal companion. It is very very SAD. Boost your charisma through the roof, and use it for almost everything (Noble Scion: war, prophetic armor, etc). you should then be able to afford a 13 INT, and then you can pick up a Horsemaster's saddle - as long as you ride your companion, it will benefit from your teamwork feats - and then you can get pack flank.
|
It's worth the build points spent on intelligence.
Also, you really don't need Charisma all that much. A training harness (Animal Archive) gets you a +2 bonus. On top of that, the Link you get to your companion is a +4, and it's a class skill so another +3 since you'll certainly be trained. Along with a skill point, that's 10+Cha at level 1, which is funny, because the DC to make your AC do a trick it knows is 10.
Okay, if it's injured that becomes a 12; still doable if you can roll a 2. Or a bit more if you dump Charisma.
Really. The joke is Wild Empathy, since almost every ranger and druid dumps Charisma.
My Hunter started with 14 Wis... Honestly anything higher than that at level 1 is unnecessary since your spells shouldn't be used offensively.
All your best spells just need Caster Level to be effective
-Greater Magic Fang
-Longstrider
-Bloodhound
-CLW
-Lead Blades
and more!
I have used this feat myself, and seen it used on a Mad Dog barbarian, both for PFS. It makes for devastating combatants. Both characters are a bit MAD, but the feats themselves are so powerful it doesn't matter.
How the hell did he get his dog up to 13 INT to take the feat in the first place? Serious question.
I can't see using it outside of hunter, cavalier, or inquisitor dips (usually at least 3 levels to get the teamwork ability).
Thank you to everyone who posted. I retooled my hunter with a higher intelligence and a lower strength. The new access to pack flanking will still make him even more effective than he was before.
Level dip in Brawler?
-TimD
What about a 2 level dip in fighter archetype lore warden?
At 2nd level, a lore warden gains Combat Expertise as a bonus feat, even if he would not normally qualify for this feat.
Would that qualify as the pre-req for Pack Flanking?
What about a 2 level dip in fighter archetype lore warden?
At 2nd level, a lore warden gains Combat Expertise as a bonus feat, even if he would not normally qualify for this feat.
Would that qualify as the pre-req for Pack Flanking?
Well, that would get the feat part of the pre-req for Pack Flanking for the character. However, Pack Flanking still requires an INT 13 and companion class ability, on its own on top of the feat.
With the lore warden example, I was just wondering if it would be like the ranger combat feats. Once you got one feat then you have the pre-reqs for the rest of the feat chain.
With the lore warden example, I was just wondering if it would be like the ranger combat feats. Once you got one feat then you have the pre-reqs for the rest of the feat chain.
No. Abilities, such as the ranger combat feats allow you to ignore prerequisites for specific feats (and in the ranger case at specific levels). They change nothing about follow up feats (i.e. you still need all prereqs for feats outside the specific combat style bonus feats).