Up from the turgid depths of luminous green mist....


Pathfinder Online

Goblin Squad Member

Up from the turgid depths of luminous green mists rose the orb. Eyes on leathery stalks writhing preditoraly scouring every crevice and crook in the hall. A wild glint in his eyes Vernoth took a great gulp from the glass vile before lunging with blurring speed into a crazed sprint. Closing with the beast and leaping past eye beams blasting all the way. Now safely behind the creature it's vulnerable hind exposed Vernoth rained down axe hell. The ancient orb now a wet mess of dead staring eyes falling to the depths to see nothing again.

That fight took place in DDO. Bring me a fight like that in a sandbox please.

Goblin Squad Member

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Have you tried Darkfall? It has by far the most intense fights I've seen in any game since Freelancer, the downside being it's incredibly harsh on anyone without a great machine, fast connection to their server, and viper like reflexes.

Depending on your hardware, macro skills, and twitch skills it may be right up your alley.

Beyond the full manual aim, custom classes, and large ammounts of movement/throw type abilities you also do double damage if you hit your target in the back. ;)

Honestly it's actually probably the most intense PVP game I've ever played. Too intense for the Alaskan connection I was playing it on.

Goblin Squad Member

Twitch gameplay isn't the only way for interesting fights. Give Dark Age of Camelot a try, it's amazing.

I personally despised Darkfall's combat, it required so much twitch that you were lost in twitching and maneuvering rather than enjoying yourself.


Ah, DAoC, such fun. I didn't know it was still around. Played pretty had core through 2004, then stuff happened. Great battles, and oh the tower wars (so many warnings for "terrain manipulation", so many warnings). I've been wondering for a bit now, Saiph, you weren't a hib or mid on Lancelot were you?

Goblin Squad Member

Slammy wrote:
This is what a player with very little twitch gameplay experience would say.

Are you implying that their opinion is somehow less valid than yours?


Caldeathe Baequiannia wrote:
Slammy wrote:
This is what a player with very little twitch gameplay experience would say.
Are you implying that their opinion is somehow less valid than yours?

Na bro.

Goblin Squad Member

Slammy wrote:
Saiph wrote:

Twitch gameplay isn't the only way for interesting fights. Give Dark Age of Camelot a try, it's amazing.

I personally despised Darkfall's combat, it required so much twitch that you were lost in twitching and maneuvering rather than enjoying yourself.

This is what a player with very little twitch gameplay experience would say.

When you make snide comments, it might behoove you to know a thing or two about the person beforehand. For example, in this case your presumption is quite mistaken and actually foolish.


Saiph wrote:
Slammy wrote:
Saiph wrote:

Twitch gameplay isn't the only way for interesting fights. Give Dark Age of Camelot a try, it's amazing.

I personally despised Darkfall's combat, it required so much twitch that you were lost in twitching and maneuvering rather than enjoying yourself.

This is what a player with very little twitch gameplay experience would say.

When you make snide comments, it might behoove you to know a thing or two about the person beforehand. For example, in this case your presumption is quite mistaken and actually foolish.

Atta boy, there you go. Knew you had some arrogance in ya.

Anyways, I love Darkfalls combat. Hoping to see some of the community from that game swing over and give this game a try.

Goblin Squad Member

I don't know how admitting that I have experience in twitch games is arrogance, but to each their own.

PFO doesn't currently have the features that would appease to a Darkfall player; I'd hope they'd wait a bit as I fear they might not give PFO a second try.


Saiph wrote:

*but to each their own.*

PFO doesn't currently have the features that would appease to a Darkfall player

Goblin Squad Member

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I advertized PFO in the DF community back when I believed in this title. Most of them quickly dismissed it outright because it was tab-targeted. Back in that day the word on tab-targetting was that there was a great ammount of space to explore between traditional tab-targetting and full manual aim. Not exploring that space is one of the poor decisions you get pushed into when you market your MMO primarily to table top gamers and then listen to majority rule.

Goblin Squad Member

Andius the Afflicted wrote:
I advertized PFO in the DF community back when I believed in this title. Most of them quickly dismissed it outright because it was tab-targeted. Back in that day the word on tab-targetting was that there was a great ammount of space to explore between traditional tab-targetting and full manual aim. Not exploring that space is one of the poor decisions you get pushed into when you market your MMO primarily to table top gamers and then listen to majority rule.

You're absolutely certain that the majority wants that, eh?

Goblin Squad Member

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I'm fairly certain the majority of the outspoken members of the PFO community want as little twitch as possible while the majority of MMO consumers fall somewhere between the extremes of tab targetting and full manual aim.

Goblin Squad Member

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Oh gotcha, that makes more sense and I can agree with that assumption.


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You two stop being agreeable and rational right this instant!

Goblin Squad Member

Saiph wrote:
Oh gotcha, that makes more sense and I can agree with that assumption.

Troll concurs and implodes against it's nature....Luckily troll's regenerate.

Goblin Squad Member

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I think I got twitch well and truly out of my system lugging PCs and glass screens to LANs playing Doom and Quake and then Half Life and the dust map over and over in the first Counterstrike and Unreal Tournament and the first Tribes and eventually stuff like BF 'nam and a dozen other games I cannot even remember.

Apart from which its pretty hard combatwise to compete with the immersion of a full real historical combat flight sim server with Hotas and Pedals and FFB stick and headtracking with no icons no targeting and having to identify enemies entirely by visuals when there are a dozen planes in the air doing crazy stuff at 600kmh in the rain over Russia.

But i can see why the kids brought up on XBox like it and its probably where the big money is. Though a lot of those games have a huge churn with a small hardcore that play 24/7 and stick around.

Thing is if I wanted to play a twitch game with crazy resolution graphics where you can max level in a week or two and then slag off in chat at everyone - there are stacks of choices out there already I am looking for something different.

Goblin Squad Member

"Thing is if I wanted to play a twitch game with crazy resolution graphics where you can max level in a week or two and then slag off in chat at everyone" dude out of those things the only one I would ask for is the crazy resolution graphics though im not even posting about that so no idea where ya pulled that out of or why.Rate of experience gain and what is said in chat also have zero to do with tab targeting vs "twitch".....

Twitch is a stupid description of real time combat where direction velocity and position count. When playing warthunder I do not twitch I asses my target aim at their weakness and fire. That is not twitching twitch implies no thought. Combat is NOT a series of maneuvers made while ignoring ones position. PNP/TT is position intensive translating that to real time(aka DDO) does not make it twitch it makes it realistic and immersive. Would you rather feel like a warrior or wizard in combat throwing spells and moving to engage foes tactically or a directionless point with an animation running on it trying to effect other directionless points by hitting number keys in sequences? Might as well be pacman with some combo buttons fighting other pacmans the Z coordinate made meaningless as distance is the ONLY factor. Call it what it is lazy garbage.

Goblin Squad Member

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Neadenil Edam wrote:

I think I got twitch well and truly out of my system lugging PCs and glass screens to LANs playing Doom and Quake and then Half Life and the dust map over and over in the first Counterstrike and Unreal Tournament and the first Tribes and eventually stuff like BF 'nam and a dozen other games I cannot even remember.

Apart from which its pretty hard combatwise to compete with the immersion of a full real historical combat flight sim server with Hotas and Pedals and FFB stick and headtracking with no icons no targeting and having to identify enemies entirely by visuals when there are a dozen planes in the air doing crazy stuff at 600kmh in the rain over Russia.

But i can see why the kids brought up on XBox like it and its probably where the big money is. Though a lot of those games have a huge churn with a small hardcore that play 24/7 and stick around.

Thing is if I wanted to play a twitch game with crazy resolution graphics where you can max level in a week or two and then slag off in chat at everyone - there are stacks of choices out there already I am looking for something different.

You first compare any level of twitch to the most extreme examples available when I explicitly stated I feel most MMO players want something between the two extremes such as the targeting found in ESO. Mind not to touch your thermostat if you feel a little chilly. HEAT IS WHAT THEY USE TO TORTURE YOU IN THE FIERY DEPTHS OF HELL!!!!!!!!

Then you go on to rant about a bunch of things you don't like that have nothing to do with the mechanics we are discussing but happen to be in many of the extreme twitch based games you use to frighten children old men. False logic and not relevant to the discussion at hand.

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