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Loads of... stuffHey, I answered your questions. Get grumpy if you like.
The fact is that Gimli's "signature weapon" was an axe. Like none before him and like many after.
Other elves in Tolkien may have gotten drunk and passed out (like the jailer in The Hobbit) but that doesn't change the fact that, by far, the most famous elves did not - not Elrond, not Legolas, not Arwen, not Galadriel,...
As far as "graceful elves", you've named none that I can see in your post. All your citations, "Tuatha De Dannan... Tir na nOg... The King of Elfland's Daughter", tell me nothing about Hyper-DEX Elves using bows to shoot BEBGs - that is the trope under discussion after all.
Nor do I see a connection between a romance novel, depicting (in part) the doings of a scout for the British set during the Seven Years' War, to have any but the most incidental relationships to Tolkien's High Fantasy Faery Tale. "Natty" is no "Strider".
And more importantly, "Natty" has had zero impact on the Brooding Ranger trope. A character can be claimed as a precedent, but that does not mean he was an exemplar or template for subsequent characters.
Wow. A finer example of moving the goalposts has not been seen in a long time. Well done, sir.
Editfail for my last message (missed the timer by **1** minute):
Even the part about extreme risk of those who should be your allies wanting to execute you might not be totally insurmountable, just really difficult -- this can't be the only AP where you are at risk of being killed by those who are supposed to be your allies. People you are trying to defend thinking of you as a target can very easily (and to some extent will, even with the best of care) in Curse of the Crimson Throne and Council of Thieves, for instance, and the same thing is likely to happen in Skull & Shackles and Reign of Winter, but with a harder time telling who is going to turn on you. It is extremely likely that the problem in Reign of Winter gets worse if you are a Witch or have visible fey/witchblood heritage. And being a Tiefling in Wrath of the Righteous (and it seems that at least in the PbPs I have seen, more parties have one than not) has the same problem. I probably missed some examples, but these are the most obvious examples of potential for "friendly fire" outside of being a Drow in Second Darkness (which admittedly has got to rank near if not at the top of the list). In other words, Second Darkness is not the only scenario where Spider Man could feel your pain . . . .
Wow. A finer example of moving the goalposts has not been seen in a long time. Well done, sir.Loads of... stuffHey, I answered your questions. Get grumpy if you like.
The fact is that Gimli's "signature weapon" was an axe. Like none before him and like many after.
Other elves in Tolkien may have gotten drunk and passed out (like the jailer in The Hobbit) but that doesn't change the fact that, by far, the most famous elves did not - not Elrond, not Legolas, not Arwen, not Galadriel,...
As far as "graceful elves", you've named none that I can see in your post. All your citations, "Tuatha De Dannan... Tir na nOg... The King of Elfland's Daughter", tell me nothing about Hyper-DEX Elves using bows to shoot BEBGs - that is the trope under discussion after all.
Nor do I see a connection between a romance novel, depicting (in part) the doings of a scout for the British set during the Seven Years' War, to have any but the most incidental relationships to Tolkien's High Fantasy Faery Tale. "Natty" is no "Strider".
And more importantly, "Natty" has had zero impact on the Brooding Ranger trope. A character can be claimed as a precedent, but that does not mean he was an exemplar or template for subsequent characters.
Tink-U <blushing>
But I was only moving the posts back to where they started ;)
Fair enough; but the start wasn't the question asked and answer. :)
In Golarion, an Elf can actually be so evil, that they turn into Drow.
This is, of course, rare.
Drow are the result of the briefly awakened conscience of Rovagug touching the minds of Elves, as their bodies were warped by eldritch radiation within the Caves of the Craven in the Darklands.
They are touched by the greatest evil god of destruction, and it's taint follows through each generation, mind, body, and spirit.
Drow are not evil, simply by choice, or cultural pressure, but rather it is a part of their being.
[derail]If a Drow sustained a good alignment for too long, would they revert back to being a normal elf?[/derail]
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I'm not not the OP, but I'm going to answer anyway, because I also have an axe in the fire (or is that supposed to be an iron to grind?). (@Archpaladin Zousha: Sorry for not putting the same disclaimer in my previous message -- it seemed important for me to be able to answer it too, just as much as for the OP, since your message brought up important points that I need to make sure I have covered if I am going to pull this off. Glad you think this might actually work. Here are some more questions I need to answer even though I am not the OP.)
Happy to help. I've a soft spot for characters like these, though mine are more along the lines of civilized members of tribal human societies. ;)
I could use your help here -- where does this fit on the time line relative to Second Darkness?
According to the wiki, Volume 44 was published in 4707 AR. Going by Paizo's habit of setting APs in the Golarion year linked to the real world year they're published in, that'd mean Second Darkness (published in 2008) starts in 4708, approximately a year after Volume 44's release. However, I hasten to add that just because the volume's been out doesn't mean its contents are common knowledge. Most of the people who read the Chronicles are either Pathfinders themselves, or nobles and rich types who can afford a copy, which are probably rare in a pirate hub like Riddleport.
^Okay, although Reign of Winter (released in 2013) spoils this by
Any thoughts on surviving the Kyonin (Kyonic? Kyonese? Kyonish?) Inquisition, other than be generally prepare for an Inquisition much as if you were in Cheliax, Galt, Geb, Irrisen, Korvosa, Mendev, Nidal, Razmiran, or Rhahadoum? (This is to list just some of the more obvious places one should expect an Inquisition.)
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There's a huge difference between playing a character with a cliche back story and playing a character which actively derails the game.Honestly, I don't see how "drow double-scimitar" is more cliche than "elven wizard" or "halfling rogue" or "half-orc barbarian".
If it is the cliche' itself, that derails a game, for certain groups, then it should be considered.
If that "Halfing Rogue" cliche' you mention, is the one in which, the PC steals from everyone, including from other PCs, and/or important NPCs, then yes, that could be a problem.
[derail]If a Drow sustained a good alignment for too long, would they revert back to being a normal elf?[/derail]In Golarion, an Elf can actually be so evil, that they turn into Drow.
This is, of course, rare.
Drow are the result of the briefly awakened conscience of Rovagug touching the minds of Elves, as their bodies were warped by eldritch radiation within the Caves of the Craven in the Darklands.
They are touched by the greatest evil god of destruction, and it's taint follows through each generation, mind, body, and spirit.
Drow are not evil, simply by choice, or cultural pressure, but rather it is a part of their being.
So, wait a minute - if elves are good and pure of heart, they're pale of skin but if they're evil, they're dark-skinned? No one sees anything even remotely potentially askew about this? For a company that is trying to be as progressive as Paizo is, this is... odd.
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Elves are not good and pure of heart.
At least, not by default.
Many, may not be good at all, and some even evil.
They are not borne with an inclination for either good, nor evil.
Drow, have a natural inclination towards evil, due to an influence by an evil god, and magical radiation, along with a low survival rate amongst non-evil Drow, which, continues to allow Drow to breed more of their kin, with similar inclinations.
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As far as i know good drows can't/don't turn into elves, and not all evil elves turn into drows.
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Hmmm why does everyone talk like everyone knows who Drizzt is. I have no clue who Drizzt is or anything about him. So spouting someone is doing a Drizzt clone with no clue who he is to me seems more close minded on your part.
After all character even if drawn up the same way rolled the same way will never be the same in different campaines with different friends characters. For what truly makes a character a Character is their experiences.
So if you want to play a Drow or any character that might resemble something else or another character. Id say allow it to happen since in all honesty it will be different. You can never mimic fully what they are and if your trying too. Well youd be sorely disapointed.
Tho at this point with how much hate their is for this character. You might as well turn him into a diety.
I'm wasn't sure who Drizzt was either, but I played a good-aligned, exiled noble drow shortly after Queen of the Demonweb Pits came out. Must have been the late 70's or early 80's. From the comments posted here and a quick google search, it sounds like the creators of Drizzt cloned my character. :) I suppose it is good to know that if I ever decide to bring back my old character in a pathfinder game, I can expect people to accuse me of cloning a character who was invented nearly a decade after mine. Of course, my character concept was itself strongly influenced by Moorcock's Elric of Melnibone.
Pretty much every element of any character can be found in previous literature. As people get more experience, they usually get better at mixing elements into new combinations, but most players I know have made least one character taken from a favorite fantasy book. For beginners, this can really be useful because their familiarity with the character's personality leaves them free to focus on the unfamiliar mechanics of the game. And, as you said, circumstances will usually cause the character to diverge from its template soon enough.
But even for experienced...
I can't like this post enough. I am old enough to grown up reading Conan, Fafhrd and Grey Mouser, Lotr, remember Jimmy the Hand from the Riftwar series? Talk about a character that people would call cliche for a rogue...
This whole talk of people playing a cliche character is overdone. There was a writer who once lamented that he could not write anything original because the Greeks and Romans had covered everything. That guy's name was Geoffrey freakin' Chaucer. Somehow he was able to take elements from stories before him and create new stories with elements in the older tales.
So if someone wants to create trope characters who are we to judge? As long as the group and DM are fine with it then this looking down noses at "lesser" fantasy fans is completely elitist and there's enough of that in the real world. Please do not bring it into our fantasy world.
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Hi everybody,thanks for the advice and comments,I appreciate it.Now just for clarity,my character choice is coming from nowhere but my imagination (if its been done before,news to me).I'm not looking to create a "special snowflake" just sounds like a fun roleplaying challenge.If any other player (singular) has a problem with this character then of course I will accomodate them,because this is a game based on teamwork,and the opportunity for this character may come up at another time (fingers crossed).I just want to have fun playing a new game,if I wanted controversy I'd be a politician.I only wanted advice from experienced pathfinder players because I am so new to the game. I welcome all opinions,just don't tell me i'm wrong for a character concept (if you disagree with my choice,say so,I can respect that),I will check with my GM as soon as I finish my characters back story,and I will incorporate some of these fine ideas into his backround.Thanks again,I do enjoy the input.
Loads of... stuffHey, I answered your questions. Get grumpy if you like.
You go on thinking that. Still waiting on a drunken dwarf reference...
Ignoring Celtic and Norse myth (or other literary sources) doesn't make you "right," either.
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Personally, I have more problem with the idea of a race that is biologically destined to be evil. I would find it far more absurd to say that a race cannot produce individuals who are not evil. That is a far more lazy concept than wanting to be a person who defies the expectations of their culture. People do that in the real world all the time.
Amen.
... Would you have an equal issue with a dwarf who shaves? "Not all dwarves are bearded, I'm the one dwarf with a smooth face, and I'm here to show everyone that dwarves have chins."Wait, wait! Let's not bring in the Dwarves of Eberron to this discussion please. ;)
bald-faced dwarves... <shudder>
There are more shaven dwarves beyond Eberron. Dark Sun dwarves don't even have to.
Also, Varric is not only my all-time favorite male dwarven character, he's also the only male dwarf I find physically appealing. His shaving is definitely a factor in that.
No... the transformation is strictly one-way. And incredibly rare. There are plenty of evil elves that don't transform.
You know... except for the ones who had Ancestral Regression cast on them. ;)
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Hi everybody,thanks for the advice and comments,I appreciate it.Now just for clarity,my character choice is coming from nowhere but my imagination (if its been done before,news to me).I'm not looking to create a "special snowflake" just sounds like a fun roleplaying challenge.If any other player (singular) has a problem with this character then of course I will accomodate them,because this is a game based on teamwork,and the opportunity for this character may come up at another time (fingers crossed).I just want to have fun playing a new game,if I wanted controversy I'd be a politician.I only wanted advice from experienced pathfinder players because I am so new to the game. I welcome all opinions,just don't tell me i'm wrong for a character concept (if you disagree with my choice,say so,I can respect that),I will check with my GM as soon as I finish my characters back story,and I will incorporate some of these fine ideas into his backround.Thanks again,I do enjoy the input.
Seems you have it all figured out. A very good approach too.
I doubt you will have trouble, and it should be fun.
You willingness to put the fun of all first, will reap you some mighty rewards.
It will also allow your fellow players, and DM, to be more willing to have you play more exotic PCs, as they will all be comfortable with your willingness to make the PC work within the group dynamic, and desired tone.
Good luck.
Well, I finally did it. Backstory concept is very similar to what I had in mind before, but I made some revisions to accommodate changes in mechanics (not all bad -- switch to Tongues Curse fits into PTSD that is indirectly work-related, while getting me out of a bind with respect to number of languages needed to fit the background). Mechanics turned out to be the really hard part -- Feats and Skill Points are really tight without much wiggle room, and I had to break down and use a few bits of ACG/ACO material, and she's not going to be the most survivable or powerful character (being a Dex-based Warrior Oracle is tough when you have to overcome a Con penalty, especially if Divine Protection is banned like I half expect), but I think I made a reasonable build (and even just barely managed to avoid dumping an ability score = Wisdom), while managing to retain a concept of a non-Evil Drow that won't break the AP. Contrary to what some people complain about Drow, I don't think this character will be at all overpowered (especially if Divine Protection is banned as mentioned above). Channeling the Cosmos by Sean FitzSimon was a huge help. Now to get her into an actual PbP . . . .