Really Simple Prestige Classes [Little Red]


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We feel that oftentimes, prestige classes were not always “worth it”. They rob a character of their higher-level abilities and often dictate many aspects of the character’s growth by way of heavy entry requirements. This upcoming book, aptly named “Really Simple Prestige Classes” allows you to do just that! It includes 9 new 3 level, simplistic, no-frills, straightforward prestige classes! They have low entry requirements, only last a few levels, and provide a bang for their buck, yet are otherwise mundane. They are designed to complement a wide variety of classes and builds as well as to cover some areas that might have been previously overlooked.

Class List

  • Acrobat
  • Arcane Dabbler
  • Beastlord
  • Enchanter
  • Weapon Master
  • Magic User
  • Metamagister
  • Runner
  • Weapon Specialist

In addition we have feat support designed to enhance and reward characters who are taking prestige classes. Feats include: Favored Prestige Class, Best of Both Worlds, Prestigious Leadership, etc.

The book launches this weekend, just in time for the holidays!


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Arcane Dabbler is for those that want to pick up a smidge of spellcasting on a relatively low investment, so think arcane paladin or ranger but without having to play a bloodrager.


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Can you give a quick and dirty to each class without delving into mechanics? Just from the description I'm halfway sold.


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CalethosVB wrote:
Can you give a quick and dirty to each class without delving into mechanics? Just from the description I'm halfway sold.

Yeah sure, no problem :-)

Acrobat: A three level class based around increases to acrobatics, evasion, and uncanny dodge.

Arcane Dabbler: Pick up a few useful spells and metamagic feats without impacting your BAB or HD too much.

Beastlord: Need an animal companion? Gain one that will be useful for the remainder of your levels as well as some nice abilities that focus on defeating/detecting beasts and magical beasts.

Enchanter: Is magical crafting your thing? Enchanter cuts down on crafting time and grants you some of the much-needed feats, allowing you to bypass a lot of red tape.

Magic User: Expand your spell list, boost your casting stats, and overall make your spellcasting more versatile.

Metamagister: Metamagic feats getting you down? Offset them with this class without sacrificing your caster level.

Runner: Need to get somewhere quicker? Runner boost your movement speed, deal with terrain challenges with ease, all while still offering attracting options for skirmishing characters.

Weapon Master: Why be good at one weapon when you can be good at all of them? (As a designer put it, “This one is a golf-bag fighter”.)

Weapon Specialist: Why be good at all the weapons when you can be an undisputed master of one? Gives early access to some weapon specific feats.


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Sold. Thanks.

As an addendum, I'm looking at enhancing a Fighter some, so I'm going to be looking at the Acrobat and the Weapons Master.

I may even use the Arcane Dabbler, if compatible, to enhance my Rogue. Perhaps even Beastlord.

Thanks for the response.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

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Dotting so that I can instantly buy this when you make it available.


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Pathfinder Adventure Subscriber
christos gurd wrote:
Arcane Dabbler is for those that want to pick up a smidge of spellcasting on a relatively low investment, so think arcane paladin or ranger but without having to play a bloodrager.

First edition Ranger (my all time favorite!) here I come. I can now recreate Traine dan Torcan, who was my first DnD character ever.

Dotting!!!!

-- david

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

Was the 1st-edition Ranger an arcane caster? That feels so... strange... to me. (I started in 3.5e)


Pathfinder Adventure Subscriber

At 8th level got a few druid spells (up to level 3), and at 9th level got a few mage spells (up to level 2).

HERE is a link to the OSRIC PDF.

-- david

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

Wow... SO COMPLICATED LOL.


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Hmm... a very clever idea. Definitely grabbing this one.


Papa-DRB wrote:
christos gurd wrote:
Arcane Dabbler is for those that want to pick up a smidge of spellcasting on a relatively low investment, so think arcane paladin or ranger but without having to play a bloodrager.

First edition Ranger (my all time favorite!) here I come. I can now recreate Traine dan Torcan, who was my first DnD character ever.

Dotting!!!!

-- david

well it is only a 3 level prestige, so yeah i dont think anyone will blame you if you delay your favored enemy a bit for some armored arcane casting.


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Pathfinder Adventure Subscriber
Little Red Goblin Games wrote:
The book launches this weekend, just in time for the holidays!

Hey LRGG, it is the weekend, at least where I live. Where's the book !!!!

-- david

ps. Can you tell how excited I am for this one!

Linky


Hi David,
It's being formatted as I type this (we are on AZ time). It'll be out later today.


Pathfinder Adventure Subscriber
Little Red Goblin Games wrote:

Hi David,

It's being formatted as I type this (we are on AZ time). It'll be out later today.

Woot !!!


And... we are live!


Pathfinder Adventure Subscriber

And purchased !


Pathfinder Adventure Subscriber

Since I was most interested in the Arcane Dabbler, I have read that one and have a question or two.

Arcane Dabbler wrote:

Metamagic Focus:

..... he treats its actual level as -1 lower for determining the spell’s final adjusted level.....

Ah, it shows up as -1 when cut'n'paste above, but -I (Capital "I") in the PDF.

Does he get bonus spells cast due to "high" chosen mental score?

By the way, I frackin Love this PrC !

Thank you !!!

-- david


It's -1 (the font probably looks like an I). It's the same font 3.5 uses. Sorry about any confusion it might have caused.

An arcane dabbler does gets bonus spells based on a high casting stat.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

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Purchased!

I'm looking over the classes, and I worry that they might be a bit too strong. The Arcane Dabbler really seems too strong to me. You get to cast as a 6th level Sorcerer by taking 3 levels of this class, and all of your spells are Intensified, and you treat your caster level as your character level! That means you can cast fireball spells with 20d6 damage with a 3-level dip!

I like the Metamagister... the idea of Meta Slots is pretty cool. The only worry I have is that it's adding a bunch of extra spells per day, when you're also getting increased spells per day in your base spellcasting class.

Runner is pretty cool, though Swiftblade might be a bit too strong... it's essentially giving you Pounce but you don't even need to be charging... it's more like Ride-by Attack with a full attack action.

Overall, I enjoy these classes, but I'd have trouble letting my players use them without some adjudication at least.


cartmanbeck wrote:

Purchased!

I'm looking over the classes, and I worry that they might be a bit too strong. The Arcane Dabbler really seems too strong to me. You get to cast as a 6th level Sorcerer by taking 3 levels of this class, and all of your spells are Intensified, and you treat your caster level as your character level! That means you can cast fireball spells with 20d6 damage with a 3-level dip!

I like the Metamagister... the idea of Meta Slots is pretty cool. The only worry I have is that it's adding a bunch of extra spells per day, when you're also getting increased spells per day in your base spellcasting class.

Runner is pretty cool, though Swiftblade might be a bit too strong... it's essentially giving you Pounce but you don't even need to be charging... it's more like Ride-by Attack with a full attack action.

Overall, I enjoy these classes, but I'd have trouble letting my players use them without some adjudication at least.

Thanks for the feedback!

Here is some feedback from the team:

Metaslots:
Metaslots do give you quite a bit of extra spellcasting power but in our experience metamagic feats tend to fall behind a bit as the trade off between decreased save DC and improved effect rarely stacks up this in effect gives you a pool of spells with metamagic feats that you can utilize.

Swiftblade:
Swiftblade is a powerful ability and well you don’t get full charge distance or the bonus to attack rolls we feel that as one race (kitsune) can get the pounce ability with three feats, the barbarian can get it with three rage powers (beast totem), and monks and brawlers can get something arguably better with two feats (in pummeling style), we feel that two feats, three levels, and delaying your BAB progression (and by extension your number of iterative attacks) by one level is a fair trade.

General:
There is this big rant by Sean K Reynolds (love him or hate him) on the usefulness of prestige classes in PF. Basically it comes down to entry level and missed opportunities but in their current form they are underpowered. The opening lines of the product address the notion that these prestige classes are designed to be a cut above the power level expected of a typical prestige class That being said, players and GMs should consider what they want out of the game and judge content accordingly.

Again, thanks so much for your feedback!


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Little Red Goblin Games wrote:

General:

There is this big rant by Sean K Reynolds (love him or hate him) on the usefulness of prestige classes in PF. Basically it comes down to entry level and missed opportunities but in their current form they are underpowered. The opening lines of the product address the notion that these prestige classes are designed to be a cut above the power level expected of a typical prestige class. That being said, players and GMs should consider what they want out of the game and judge content accordingly.

I just watched that video a few minutes ago to find what you were talking about. I agree with what he said there, and with what you've said here as well.

Thanks for going through my big long message earlier. It really gets the point across that, yeah, these PrCs are supposed to be really good compared to what you're giving up.

By the way, for anyone interested, I recommend the Beastlord for any class that doesn't already get an animal companion, even casters.

Rock on.


Glad you liked it. He does a great series of videos (the freebies for PCs one is awesome).
\m/ Rock on yourself!


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Gotta say - this is a bloody brilliant idea. There was, what, one of these in 3.5? The teleportation specialist? Why'd it never catch on?


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Will look into this for sure


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When will it be live on Paizo?


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Bardess wrote:
When will it be live on Paizo?

It should be live in a couple of days, once Paizo checks the compatability and makes sure the PDF does not combust on contact with Adobe.


hey look what i found


A super thanks to Liz for fighting off the North Korean hackers and getting the product up and live on Paizo.com so quick!


Bought it. Love it.

Question:

At 1st level, the magic user chooses three spells from any class’s spell list and thereafter treats it as if it were on the spell list of his base spellcasting class; if one of his base classes could not normally cast that spell, it is treated as a spell of 1 level higher.

I find this confusing. Am I misreading this?


scary harpy wrote:

Bought it. Love it.

Question:

At 1st level, the magic user chooses three spells from any class’s spell list and thereafter treats it as if it were on the spell list of his base spellcasting class; if one of his base classes could not normally cast that spell, it is treated as a spell of 1 level higher.

I find this confusing. Am I misreading this?

That one confused me too.

Can we get a more detailed explanation?


Aye. One would think it'd only apply to that base spellcasting class.


Answer: If you are a wizard and you take heal as one of your extra spells then it acts as a 7th level spell, even though heal is a 6th level spell.


dot


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure, Card Game, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I am intrigued. The gaming budget has been tapped for the month, but this is on my wishlist for the next opportunity.


Little Red Goblin Games wrote:
Answer: If you are a wizard and you take heal as one of your extra spells then it acts as a 7th level spell, even though heal is a 6th level spell.

That's clear.

Any spell not on your spell list is 1 level higher as a bonus spell.

Thanks.


Little Red Goblin Games wrote:
Answer: If you are a wizard and you take heal as one of your extra spells then it acts as a 7th level spell, even though heal is a 6th level spell.

So, if you were playing a multi-class Ranger/Sorcerer, and you took this feat, you could have Longstrider count as a Sorcerer spell at the normal level. You could cast it with Sorcerer spell slots.

It wouldn't be one level higher because its on the Ranger spell list.

Is that correct?


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure, Card Game, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I don't have the book yet. How is the "base spellcasting class" defined for purposes of this prestige class or this specific ability?

I am presuming that when you take the prestige class, you select one of your current classes as your base spellcasting class and then the abilities of the prestige class apply to your spellcasting for that specified class.

If I am interpreting that correctly (based on little evidence, I admit), then I think Doomed Hero's correct as long as sorcerer is selected as his base spellcasting class.

Am I close? Looking forward to getting my hands on this one - but I'm not even close to caught up with everything I bought during the Black Friday sales yet!


Doomed Hero wrote:
Little Red Goblin Games wrote:
Answer: If you are a wizard and you take heal as one of your extra spells then it acts as a 7th level spell, even though heal is a 6th level spell.

So, if you were playing a multi-class Ranger/Sorcerer, and you took this feat, you could have Longstrider count as a Sorcerer spell at the normal level. You could cast it with Sorcerer spell slots.

It wouldn't be one level higher because its on the Ranger spell list.

Is that correct?

That would be how I would read it. I don't see why you couldn't use those extra spells as just a quick "get more spells" for a spontaneous caster given the wording.


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I picked this up today. And 3 or 4 of these fit concepts on characters I am playing or working on to get going.

One of the most useful player-centric books I've purchased this year.


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Lord Mhoram wrote:

I picked this up today. And 3 or 4 of these fit concepts on characters I am playing or working on to get going.

One of the most useful player-centric books I've purchased this year.

Agreed. Great purchase. These classes are immediately going into my home game player options.


cartmanbeck wrote:

Purchased!

I'm looking over the classes, and I worry that they might be a bit too strong. The Arcane Dabbler really seems too strong to me. You get to cast as a 6th level Sorcerer by taking 3 levels of this class, and all of your spells are Intensified, and you treat your caster level as your character level! That means you can cast fireball spells with 20d6 damage with a 3-level dip!

There is a little to what you say - but one of the biggest multiclass issue is what it does to magical ability. Spell progression & Caster level is to important.

So with the prerequisites of AD, you have to have 6 levels before you can quality - so 7th level you can take it. So by 10th level you have 7 levels of something else, and cast as a 6th level caster - yes you do get some 3rd level spells. But a pure caster has got 5th level, and even Bard and Magi are getting 4th level spells.

As for caster level - don't forget the (10d6 max) on a fireball for instance - so our hypothetical above you get 10 dice like a normal sorcerer, but that sorcerer is now casting 5th level spells with a higher cap. And as our hypothetical goes up, intensified moves that cap to 15 max, but he has to have the actual level. So when he's throwing that 15d6 fireball - the sorc has 7th and bards and sorc are hitting 5th level spells.

It does seem fairly powerful at first glance - but from having played a lot of spellcaster/other mutli-classing - this actually makes the spellcasting worth having rather than so weak to not bother with.


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Lord Mhoram wrote:
cartmanbeck wrote:

Purchased!

I'm looking over the classes, and I worry that they might be a bit too strong. The Arcane Dabbler really seems too strong to me. You get to cast as a 6th level Sorcerer by taking 3 levels of this class, and all of your spells are Intensified, and you treat your caster level as your character level! That means you can cast fireball spells with 20d6 damage with a 3-level dip!

There is a little to what you say - but one of the biggest multiclass issue is what it does to magical ability. Spell progression & Caster level is to important.

So with the prerequisites of AD, you have to have 6 levels before you can quality - so 7th level you can take it. So by 10th level you have 7 levels of something else, and cast as a 6th level caster - yes you do get some 3rd level spells. But a pure caster has got 5th level, and even Bard and Magi are getting 4th level spells.

As for caster level - don't forget the (10d6 max) on a fireball for instance - so our hypothetical above you get 10 dice like a normal sorcerer, but that sorcerer is now casting 5th level spells with a higher cap. And as our hypothetical goes up, intensified moves that cap to 15 max, but he has to have the actual level. So when he's throwing that 15d6 fireball - the sorc has 7th and bards and sorc are hitting 5th level spells.

It does seem fairly powerful at first glance - but from having played a lot of spellcaster/other mutli-classing - this actually makes the spellcasting worth having rather than so weak to not bother with.

exactly, that was my logic when i wrote it.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

Lord Mhoram wrote:
cartmanbeck wrote:

Purchased!

I'm looking over the classes, and I worry that they might be a bit too strong. The Arcane Dabbler really seems too strong to me. You get to cast as a 6th level Sorcerer by taking 3 levels of this class, and all of your spells are Intensified, and you treat your caster level as your character level! That means you can cast fireball spells with 20d6 damage with a 3-level dip!

There is a little to what you say - but one of the biggest multiclass issue is what it does to magical ability. Spell progression & Caster level is to important.

So with the prerequisites of AD, you have to have 6 levels before you can quality - so 7th level you can take it. So by 10th level you have 7 levels of something else, and cast as a 6th level caster - yes you do get some 3rd level spells. But a pure caster has got 5th level, and even Bard and Magi are getting 4th level spells.

As for caster level - don't forget the (10d6 max) on a fireball for instance - so our hypothetical above you get 10 dice like a normal sorcerer, but that sorcerer is now casting 5th level spells with a higher cap. And as our hypothetical goes up, intensified moves that cap to 15 max, but he has to have the actual level. So when he's throwing that 15d6 fireball - the sorc has 7th and bards and sorc are hitting 5th level spells.

It does seem fairly powerful at first glance - but from having played a lot of spellcaster/other mutli-classing - this actually makes the spellcasting worth having rather than so weak to not bother with.

I was thinking that fireball was max 15d6, and that Intensifed would increase it to 20. But you're right, a max of 15d6 isn't nearly as strong. I will have to playtest these mini-prestige classes a bit in the near future.


Little Red Goblin Games wrote:
We feel that oftentimes, prestige classes were not always “worth it”. They rob a character of their higher-level abilities and often dictate many aspects of the character’s growth by way of heavy entry requirements.

I am actualy rebuilding the whole game system.

one of my best ways to aproach a prestige class is making them not xp lvl, but Prestige Ranks (much like Mythic Tiers). So, you need to submit the prerreq, and then, you are just Rank 1. By Order, Guild, etc (from the Prestige Class comes from) will give you a task, a letter, or a quest to solve. After that task, you need to upgrade the prerreqs from the beginning for that class. and then you´ll gain another prestige rank.

The stats for a prestige class is as follows:
- 1/2 hd
- Special ability

(i.e) Assassin
Prerrequisites:
Alignment: Any evil.
Skills: Disguise 2 ranks, Stealth 5 ranks*.
Special: The character must kill someone for no other reason than to become an assassin.

You´ll obtain +4 permanent hp, Sneak Attack +1d6, death attack, poison use.

Prestige Rank 2 Requirements:
Skills: Disguise 3 ranks, Stealth 6 ranks*.
Assassin Prestige Rank 1
Special: You must fullfil an assassination task from your guild

You´ll obtain +4 permanent hp, +1 save bonus against poson, uncanny dodge.

Little Red Goblin Games wrote:
In addition we have feat support designed to enhance and reward characters who are taking prestige classes. Feats include: Favored Prestige Class, Best of Both Worlds, Prestigious Leadership, etc.

Please!! no more feat, useless feats, and feats for everything. I guess you can imagine a better way to approach those things. Remembre: there is only 10 feats for a 20th lvl char.

And there are almost 1000 feats from paizo, and at least 2000 from 3rdP and half of that are useless at all (at least 1500 useless feats).

See?
this isn´t so hard to try something new for improve the RPG, with this alternate rule, your not making more intricated system, instead, you are boosting the Roleplay faktor for the game.


christos gurd wrote:
Lord Mhoram wrote:
cartmanbeck wrote:

Purchased!

I'm looking over the classes, and I worry that they might be a bit too strong. The Arcane Dabbler really seems too strong to me. You get to cast as a 6th level Sorcerer by taking 3 levels of this class, and all of your spells are Intensified, and you treat your caster level as your character level! That means you can cast fireball spells with 20d6 damage with a 3-level dip!

There is a little to what you say - but one of the biggest multiclass issue is what it does to magical ability. Spell progression & Caster level is to important.

So with the prerequisites of AD, you have to have 6 levels before you can quality - so 7th level you can take it. So by 10th level you have 7 levels of something else, and cast as a 6th level caster - yes you do get some 3rd level spells. But a pure caster has got 5th level, and even Bard and Magi are getting 4th level spells.

As for caster level - don't forget the (10d6 max) on a fireball for instance - so our hypothetical above you get 10 dice like a normal sorcerer, but that sorcerer is now casting 5th level spells with a higher cap. And as our hypothetical goes up, intensified moves that cap to 15 max, but he has to have the actual level. So when he's throwing that 15d6 fireball - the sorc has 7th and bards and sorc are hitting 5th level spells.

It does seem fairly powerful at first glance - but from having played a lot of spellcaster/other mutli-classing - this actually makes the spellcasting worth having rather than so weak to not bother with.

exactly, that was my logic when i wrote it.

Glad my telepath....analysis was working today.

I'm planning to use this with my cleric of a god of magic. Nice goal for when he reaches "the high Priesthood".

Sovereign Court

What is the average level of entry for these PrCs? It used to be that entry into a prestige class came around level 6 or 7. Nowadays you can become an Eldritch Knight at level 3 or a Mystic Theurge at level 4 or an Arcane Trickster at level 5.

How are the class skills with these classes? For me, getting new class skills is a major incentive to multiclass or to take a Prestige Class.

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