With the release of the Technology Guide it seems to me, at least on paper, that Pathfinder can be easily used to run a game set in the Rifts RPG universe.
The problem is that I have little experience running games where firearms are so common in the setting, and my Google fu hasn't turned up anything to help. Do you guys think it would be possible to use PF in RIFTS without a huge amount of work on my end, or if such a setting be viable at all?
The problem with running the PFRPG game in a Rift-esq type setting is... Well to be blunt. Rift wasn't balanced the same. There were classes that relied HEAVILY on gear on "keep up" with some of the OCC/RCC/PCC's. Right off the batt you're talking significant time trying to figure out what level you wanted to let the game start at depending on which character concept was the most powerful and then balancing out the rest of the characters. Then finding/creating level appropriate adventures to challenge them.
This is of course if you are trying to make a "true" version of Rift using PFRPG. If you are only talking setting, that is probably a bit easier but still a decent amount of work. Having a multiverse means having a very "open" sandbox type game. There are MANY ways a group can jump the tracks and completely derail your plans as a GM even innocently and unintentionally. That place you placed a rift and expected the PCs to go through... Well they never even got near it as something about that last D-bee they ran into peaked their interest and they trailer it back to where they came from. You'd have to create the organizations from scratch as well. Even just the "basic" setting will require some serious time investment or preplanning to cover your bases if you don't want to railroad the characters.
I know there was a d20 version of rift being put together at some point which you might be able to crib from, but I believe it was based on d20 modern rules, which aren't the same as PFRPG. So again, the easy way out, still requires some retooling of the rules/setting. Basically if you want to do it, you're going to have to put in some time to get it rolling.
That being said, I did love Rift and how open the game was. But many many people will tell you it was completely unbalanced, and unless you had a very good GM, that was pretty true. Some choices were just so significantly better that they could run the show and make other characters background sadly.
The problem with running the PFRPG game in a Rift-esq type setting is... Well to be blunt. Rift wasn't balanced the same. There were classes that relied HEAVILY on gear on "keep up" with some of the OCC/RCC/PCC's. Right off the batt you're talking significant time trying to figure out what level you wanted to let the game start at depending on which character concept was the most powerful and then balancing out the rest of the characters. Then finding/creating level appropriate adventures to challenge them.
This is of course if you are trying to make a "true" version of Rift using PFRPG. If you are only talking setting, that is probably a bit easier but still a decent amount of work. Having a multiverse means having a very "open" sandbox type game. There are MANY ways a group can jump the tracks and completely derail your plans as a GM even innocently and unintentionally. That place you placed a rift and expected the PCs to go through... Well they never even got near it as something about that last D-bee they ran into peaked their interest and they trailer it back to where they came from. You'd have to create the organizations from scratch as well. Even just the "basic" setting will require some serious time investment or preplanning to cover your bases if you don't want to railroad the characters.
I know there was a d20 version of rift being put together at some point which you might be able to crib from, but I believe it was based on d20 modern rules, which aren't the same as PFRPG. So again, the easy way out, still requires some retooling of the rules/setting. Basically if you want to do it, you're going to have to put in some time to get it rolling.
That being said, I did love Rift and how open the game was. But many many people will tell you it was completely unbalanced, and unless you had a very good GM, that was pretty true. Some choices were just so significantly better that they could run the show and make other characters background sadly.
Yeah, of the few things I have heard about the actual system of Rifts, I heard not so great things about the blatant power creep that existed. That's why I'm only trying to emulate the setting really, ie weird post-apocalyptic setting on Earth with mash-up of cyborgs, mutants, mythological creatures, magic, etc. Improvisation is also something I'm capable of doing, so I'm not too worried if their attention wanders off the campaign idea I had. Right now I'm mostly worried about having firearms everywhere, how to scale the pricing in the Tech Guide to more affordable (but still at least moderately costly) levels, that kinda stuff.
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Dont let the Paladium guys hear u talking like this. I hear they are very litigious, I've been told that's why there isn't much fan stuff on the net. Anyway for the OP can u just drop technology prices 20percent and call it a day? Also loot should have way more Tec in it so increase that vaule maybe?
Mutants & Masterminds is the better way to go - you can have varying power levels within the framework of the game, plus it has mecha, magic and other Scifi, and fantasy settings books.
Just use pathfinder rules with the Rifts skin on it. Bows and Crossbows become guns and laser cannons, and vibro-katana's become regular katanas. None of it is even that much of a stretch; there was the Rifts version of the composite long bow in one of the extra rifts book, where you got to add your strength bonus on damage rolls.Don't bother trying to work in the technology guide unless you're really into laser whips. For the most part, the technology guide isn't going to be as expansive as what you want to do so you'll end up having to create a lot of your encounters from scratch if you try to do it yourself.
Alternatively, if you want to do the planar version of pathfinder instead of Rifts, I think planescape still has a bunch of open source stuff kicking around the internet somewhere that you can look at. We played through a planescape homebrew, and the setting is pretty interesting if you still want fantasy but you want to make it extraplanar.
<@> <@>
This thread makes me want to write up a PF Aboleth R.C.C.
I've got to get my Palladium-style game back on track one of these days...
-TimD
The mere thought of the Simbieda school of editorial review makes me cringe. I played Rifts for a number of years, due to the members of my first steady group wanting to. KS should have stuck to being creative (the thing he's good at) while someone else edited and compiled his writings into books.
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Rifts is, like, the third RPG I ever played, and the one I have the most knowledge of, thematically, if not mechanically. So a few things to keep in mind:
Character Creation -- Humans are pretty much the same as in Pathfinder, since they use the old 3d6 roll to generate stats If you get a 16/18, roll another D6 and add it. Physical Strength is obvious, Physical Prowess is Dex, Physical Endurance is Con, IQ is Int, Mental Endurance is Wis, Mental Affinity is Cha. PB(Physical Beauty) is it's own stat. Keep or discard as you wish. Speed is also a stat, not given by size/race.
Like D20/PF, high stats give bonuses, but there a few differences. The first is that bonuses on the Palladium system don't kick in until the score hits 17 or higher.
Psionics are a thing in Rifts right off the bat. You may have a Psychic Character Class, or just get some psionics on top of your regular Class. It's a result of a percentage roll at character creation, or you can just pick a psychic class.
Character Classes are divided into two types: Occupational Character Classes (O.C.Cs.) and Racial Character Classes (R.C.C.).
OCCs are pretty straightforwardly your basic Character Class. Mercenary Soldier, Operator, Ley Line Walker, etc... The "Occupational" part does give it a little more definition than just the standard model. Where Pathfinder came out with Archetypes, and the classic D&D Prestige Classes, OCCs are effectively both, but entirely separate. Your basic soldier is one class, while a soldier who pilots a mech is another, and a soldier who fights for the Coalition States or New German Republic, or the Republic of Japan, etc..., is each their own class.
Racial Character Classes are a mixed bag. In most cases, it's just your race. Your die rolls to determine your stats may be a little different, and you may have some extra abilities or skills, but you can pick your race, then pick your class just like a Human.
Other RCCs, on the other hand, are so different that they count as an OCC in and of themselves. You pick one of those, and it is your Character Class, from beginning to end. There's no real easy way to define it, but for the most part, the more powerful a race is, or the more limited the examples around are, the more likely they are to be a self-contained RCC.
The first thing to know about Character Classes is they are not balanced, and arguably deliberately so. You can literally have a hobo and a demigod on the same party, and both are legal for PCs straight out of the books. Balance in both character class availability and weaponry (more on that later) is left pretty much entirely to the GM.
The second thing you must know is that Palladium O.C.C.s are for the most part front-loaded. You will get 80-100% of your class features right at first level, and level advancement usually just makes them stronger or the character better at using them. Perhaps because of this, they are extremely unfriendly towards multiclassing, even moreso than Pathfinder. If you change Occupational Character Classes, all progression in the old class comes to an immediate halt, and does not improve unless your new class has the same feature/skill (and then only when the new class catches up). On the other hand, there are so many O.C.C.s that you are unlikely to need to change classes.
Skills are done a lot differently. First of all, they are done on a Percentage die, not d20 roll. This is done as a base percentage, which increases per level. At character creation, they usually come in three flavors:
OCC Skills are Skills that come with the Character Class. You have to have them, so here they are. They also tend to have hefty bonuses to the percentages. Like other class features, you tend to get most of them at first level.
Of course, you have a whole lot more skills in Palladium than in Pathfinder.
Damage -- okay, this is a big one. Palladium is pretty much the opposite of Rocket Tag. You have S.D.C. on top of your hit points (basically bonus HP). Of course, Rifts (and Robotech and Splicers) has an additional wrinkle: Mega-Damage Capacity.
MDC is another level of Hit Points combined with Hardness and Damage Reduction, then inverted on top of that. In short, you have to inflict 100 points of normal(SDC) damage to take off a single MDC point, and it goes both ways, so one MD point inflicts 100 points of normal damage each. Within MD parity, stuff tends to have a lot of M.D.C., and even basic body armor rarely goes down in one or two hits from even "anti-armor" weapons.
Why is that? well, you know how in Alien Invasion stories, you see the army shooting at the alien saucers and death bots to no effect? MDC is pretty much a slightly more merciful version of that. It's basically the line between Modern and Sci-Fi tech. As a rule of thumb, if your infantry-level weapons can hurt a modern tank, you're probably Mega-Damage level.
Many people are unhappy with the MDC distinction, as the prevalence of MDC weaponry in Rifts means that you absolutely have to have some kind of armor (or be a naturally Mega-Damage being) to survive combat. You may want to scrap Mega-Damage altogether, or maybe apply it as Damage Resistance. I suggest DR/10 as a reduction.
Once you get past the MDC barrier, however, weapons are pretty straightforward. You can do a 1/1 damage conversion with no problem even if you drop Mega-Damage entirely.
Easier to have a conversion from D20 Gamma World. Rifts has its unique system charms that might not translate well into Pathfinder (megadamage, or a non-alignment magic system). Any RPG game can be converted, though some things are always lost in translation.
The problem with running the PFRPG game in a Rift-esq type setting is... Well to be blunt. Rift wasn't balanced
That's really all that needs to be said about Rifts. Fun game, but TOTALLY broken five ways to Sunday, and twice on Christmas.
That being said, Numeria and the Technology Guide with Modern Firearms would be enough to give you the High Magi-Tech nonsense of Rifts.
Maybe use the Exalted books for backup, too, because that game is equally as ridiculous.
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No, Exalted is way sillier than Rifts.
Rifts let's you play as a humpback whale.
Exalted let's you punch someone so hard you turn them into a duck.
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Ok, on to the damage capacity rules. This should be quick;
They're pointless. Move on.
Wow, that was easier than I expected. Glad we did this.
What? You want more? Jesus, just take take take.
Ok, fine; Roll your S.D.C. You're a Merc? Great, that's 1d4x10. Wow! A 4! Excellent. Ok, you have 40 S.D.C. What's your P.E.? 22? That's impressive. Roll that 1d6 to add to your total. A 6?! That's awesome, you're a really tough dude. So that's 40 S.D.C. and 28 hit points. Congratulations, seriously.
*whistle*
*clank*
What's that? Oh, that's just a Wilk's laser pistol. Its an extremely low output laser weapon. You just won't find anything weaker on the market, seriously. Old ladies carry these to the Chi-Town bingo parlor to scare off dirty old men and the occasional dog. EVERYBODY has this. Well, at least this. Most have something far, far larger.
It does 1d4x100 S.D.C./Hit Point damage. Per shot. It can do that 20 times before reloading. That's 20 self-cauterizing holes straight through your body that your maximum rolls for S.D.C. and badass faunt of hit points simply can't stop from happening.
This section isn't worth the paper it's printed on. Welcome to Rifts.
I wanna take a second to correct and answer this part.
First of all, a Wilks' 320 laser pistol (which was pictured in that excerpt from the above link) does 1d6 M.D. :)
Second, Rifts runs on Palladium's attempt at a universal system. The whole M.D.C. thing, as I said before, it a factor of the setting. Tech-wise, Rifts is up there with Warhammer 40k and Star Wars, ground wise. Which is closer to the middle than you'd think (See SJ games' Ogre or the Bolos novels for the absurdly high-end stuff).
And third, keep in mind that most civilized areas know the power of MD weaponry and do not allow adventurers and mercenaries to bring that kind of gear into their communities. S.D.C still has its uses in Rifts.
The third party setting Amethyst: Revolution by Dias Ex Machina has a lot of classes and tech equipment/vehicles that could be dropped whole cloth into a PF conversion of Rifts.
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