Fixed, fixed and fixed!
Thanks for the comments!
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Maneuvers: One thing I noticed is that there is no comment regarding your suggestion for using a shield and grapple-focused builds. Using a shield (buckler aside) removes that hand from being able to grapple. This means you are working with a -4 penalty to your CMB roll. If you use a buckler, it's a -1 to all attack rolls using that hand (which a grapple CMB roll counts as).
Related to the above, there is also soooome conflict concerning grappling as the maneuver page states you need both hands free (dan bong is a special case of course), but one of the Grappling Style feats states attempting to grapple with one arm is a -4 penalty (see penalty above). I've never found a resolution for this contradiction, but most GMs I've talked to work with the -4 penalty if you only use one hand (I'd also mention that it implies you can pin two targets at once, significantly reducing the difficulty of a fight for your party, but it's a little outside of the subject at hand).
Hopefully I didn't just completely overlook where you said that, but you covered grappling as a maneuver option without mentioning it, and I would argue it's important enough to include.
Equipment: For unarmed fighters, the Body Wrap of Mighty Strikes chest item isn't a bad choice. Give it a straight enhancement bonus and increase the odds your iterative attacks hitting while Brawler's Flurry-ing, or just increasing your hit-rate for normal attacks. I like to use an Ammy of Mighty Fists for weapon enhancements like Holy (depending on what you fight), flaming/cold/acidic/shocking, and other interesting effects. I suppose it's a "Spare Cash" purchase, but as you said, to-hit bonuses are good.
@Divvox2: I'll make sure to mention it.
GUIDE UPDATED FOR DIRTY TACTICS TOOLBOX.
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There's a provision for that somewhere in there that says that the necessity for mithral shields only increases the gold cost needed for the build to start to gain parity.
Or you could just get a darkwood heavy shield, which is ridiculously cheap.
Dex builds might want to get a buckler instead so they can keep their off-hand free for things like Slashing Grace with a dagger. Yes, it's a two-feat investment (you're going to want Weapon Focus anyway to qualify for Specialization, so I'm not counting it), but being Dex-based is so advantageous that I think it's a viable option.
You can't combine Slashing Grace with Brawler's Flurry.
Dex-based is not good unless the conditions listed are met.
I'll fix the Style description later tonight.
What does "Smashey" want with Combat Expertise?
In your multiclassing section, I have a caveat concerning the blanket statement about caster classes. 1 level of alchemist(vivisectionist) is actually pretty awesome for the Strangler (Strangler trades away Awesome Blow anyway) or the Snakebite Striker. Thanks to its wonky wording: the 1 level dip gives you full SA progression (and two levels nets you the bleeding attack rogue talent). Additionally, mutagen and throw anything are both fairly useful and it also lets you use Enlarge Person and/or Long Arm on yourself, but that's just the icing really.
This is fairly cheesy, so I wouldn't spring it on a GM unsuspectingly, but it leads to some combos that do crazy things to your bonus damage.
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the 1 level dip gives you full SA progression
Um, what? You get sneak attack as a Rogue of your Vivisectionist level, so that's going to be 1d6 forever if you just dip it.
"Your level" always refers to class level within the description of a class, the default assumption being that you're not multiclassing.
from the srdthe 1 level dip gives you full SA progressionUm, what? You get sneak attack as a Rogue of your Vivisectionist level, so that's going to be 1d6 forever if you just dip it.
"Your level" always refers to class level within the description of a class, the default assumption being that you're not multiclassing.
If a character already has sneak attack from another class, the levels from the classes that grant sneak attack stack to determine the effective rogue level for the sneak attack’s extra damage dice (so an alchemist 1/rogue 1 has a +1d6 sneak attack like a 2nd-level rogue, an alchemist 2/rogue 1 has a +2d6 sneak attack like a 3rd-level rogue, and so on).
Since those levels of brawler grant you SA, those levels plus the level of alchemist are your effective rogue level. It even gives an example of how it works.
the vivisectionist and SA stacking doesn't really work now that more things can sneak attack besides the rogue.
the vivisectionist and SA stacking doesn't really work now that more things can sneak attack besides the rogue.
Yes, I've always seen it as a clear case of RAW definitely not being RAI (especially with class archetypes that grant sneak attack but not full progression like the Strangler and the Snakebite Striker). This is why I mentioned in my first post that you should never try to sneak this nonsense in under a GM's nose.
I didn't see any mention of Dedicated Adversary in the guide (although I might have missed it). Seems like a very solid go to feat which turns martial flexibility in a handy +2/+2 buff versus pretty much any foe.
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Dirty Tactics toolbox. You prolly can't find it online yet. It's a combat feat that gives you Favored enemy bonuses against a specific subtype if I recall correctly. It can only be taken if you don't have the favored enemy class feature. It's actually a pretty lackluster feat with martial flexibility however it's golden!
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"Heroes of the Street" has two great feats to grab when needed:
Rat Catcher makes you take only half damage from swarms and allows you to hurt swarms with normal weapons! And some other minor benifits.
Throat Slicer is a great feat for a grappler - it allows you to coup de grace an unconcious, bound or pinned opponent.
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I've been looking closely at the Shield Champion and I noticed this:
At 7th level, a shield champion can use a thrown shield to perform a bull rush, dirty trick, disarm, reposition, or trip combat maneuver as if she were making a melee shield bash attack.
When the SC throws a shield and attempts a bull rush, dirty trick, disarm, reposition, or trip combat maneuver does it go against the opponent's AC or CMD?
One incorrect statement I noted. The guide says that Brawlers do not have access to Reach weapons. They do. The Longspear is a simple reach weapon (though it doesn't have the Trip quality). This means a trip build is probably even better than you assumed.
I appreciate the Guide!
I'm curious about the Strangler archetype. At level 5, they gain the Brawler's Strike (which makes their unarmed attacks overcome DR), yet the archetype loses unarmed strikes to gain Strangle. ??
It's like they forgot to replace this with something!
And the new Dirty Tactics toolbox has made coup-degras pretty easy with Throat Slicer if you manage to pin someone! Forget the whole Knockout or Chokehold routine.
Guide updated with new style feats!
I like T. Slicer but I'd say it's best to Martial Flex it, it probably won't be absolutely necessary.
I am beyond certain Strangler losing Improved Unarmed Strike was a mistake.
Guide updated with new style feats!
I like T. Slicer but I'd say it's best to Martial Flex it, it probably won't be absolutely necessary.
I am beyond certain Strangler losing Improved Unarmed Strike was a mistake.
I'm pretty sure it was supposed to replace Brawler's Strike; however, despite it coming up multiple times on the message boards and in the ACG problem thread... It was not "fixed" in the errata, so... I don't know anymore. It's sad, because Stangler would be a fantastic response to the Tetori monk for a grappling build.
In regards to Throat Slicer... If you're making a grappler, then it is a must. That feat is phenomenal for a dedicated grappler! Unless you're playing PFS... Then it's banned... Can't give Martials anything that might step on the casters toes...
Yeah - Martial Flexibility is sooo worth having! It allows me to use Feats that really have a fringe application, but can be useful given the right circumstances, without being locked into them.
@Faelyn: I think it's more the c-d-g potential. Too easy to do, now, so I expect a nerf.
@ Otherwhere: Yeah, I know... It's just such a really nice feat for martial characters who focus on Grappling. I do agree that for the minimal requirements, the feat is downright phenomenal. I think it should have a more stringent requirement for what it allows one to do.
The other thing I love about the feat is that it somewhat hints that CdC'ing a Pinned target is allowed under the normal rules.
I didn't see any mention of Dedicated Adversary in the guide (although I might have missed it). Seems like a very solid go to feat which turns martial flexibility in a handy +2/+2 buff versus pretty much any foe.
Planning a Warsighted Oracle, this is on my list.
Honestly the Martial Flexibility get list has been a long WIP thing.
I didn't see any mention of Dedicated Adversary in the guide (although I might have missed it). Seems like a very solid go to feat which turns martial flexibility in a handy +2/+2 buff versus pretty much any foe.Planning a Warsighted Oracle, this is on my list.
Yeah buff yourself for +4 to hit and damage at level 1 in one round and show those barbs how to kick arse....
Some situational but conditionally awesome feats could be
deflect arrows if you are fighting archers might take a move action to get rid of an arrow entirely.
deadly aim so your damage against flying enemies is not pathertic.
Step up to make enemy casters and archers not 5 foot step away.
This works by RAW but I am not sure if RAI but since intimidating prowess is a combat feat you can use martial flexibility to make an intimidate check out of combat. This is not overpowering though.
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I'm planning on running a Brawler (Snakebite Striker) with some possibly Unchained Rogue levels. Any pointers?
Also, I see your guide makes a number of references to flanking with yourself, which I'm pretty certain the rules don't allow for. How are you achieving self-flanking? As far as I can see, Snake Feint allows you to count adjacent squares as your square to make it easier to flank, but not flank with yourself. Help?
Updated post UE errata.
I'm planning on running a Brawler (Snakebite Striker) with some possibly Unchained Rogue levels. Any pointers?
Also, I see your guide makes a number of references to flanking with yourself, which I'm pretty certain the rules don't allow for. How are you achieving self-flanking? As far as I can see, Snake Feint allows you to count adjacent squares as your square to make it easier to flank, but not flank with yourself. Help?
I do consider it to allow flanking with yourself, as you could possibly count as attacking from two diagonally adjacent squares around a medium enemy. I thought that was the whole point!
Updated post UE errata.
So now that brawling armor is no longer a thing...any reason to still play an unarmed brawler?
Updated post UE errata.So now that brawling armor is no longer a thing...any reason to still play an unarmed brawler?
It's still a thing. Armor is quite cheap to upgrade.
In any case, to answer your question: Pummeling Charge.
You mention Brawler being able to use the shield in a brawlers furry while retaining the bonus is in a errata. DO you have a link for that? All I can find is that they gained shield proficency. I would still have to take improved shield bash to not lose the AC bonus
So, there are some combat feats in the Haunted Heroes Handbook that would be pretty good martial flexibility pickups for those times when you're fighting ghosts and/or monsters that try to hide by possessing people. Also the Possessed Hand feat reduces the Brawler's Flurry penalties, so that's also nice.
You mention Brawler being able to use the shield in a brawlers furry while retaining the bonus is in a errata. DO you have a link for that? All I can find is that they gained shield proficency. I would still have to take improved shield bash to not lose the AC bonus
Do I? My Shield Champion build has it. I don't think I mention that specifically. Can you provide a link?
So, there are some combat feats in the Haunted Heroes Handbook that would be pretty good martial flexibility pickups for those times when you're fighting ghosts and/or monsters that try to hide by possessing people. Also the Possessed Hand feat reduces the Brawler's Flurry penalties, so that's also nice.
I love Possessed Hand for Brawlers quite a bit. For Monks, not so much, because kicks are more important (to use Flying Kick for example).
I love Possessed Hand for Brawlers quite a bit. For Monks, not so much, because kicks are more important (to use Flying Kick for example).
Possessed Hand is nice, but the real nice feats for Brawlers are (I think): Soulblade, Ghostslayer, and Soulwrecking Strike.
Soulblade: Punch haunts until they stop haunting people.
Ghostslayer: Punch ghosts until they decide to head back to the afterlife
Soulwrecking Strike: Punch possessed people so hard that the possessing entity feels it.
All 3 are combat feats, so...
I love Possessed Hand for Brawlers quite a bit. For Monks, not so much, because kicks are more important (to use Flying Kick for example).Possessed Hand is nice, but the real nice feats for Brawlers are (I think): Soulblade, Ghostslayer, and Soulwrecking Strike.
Soulblade: Punch haunts until they stop haunting people.
Ghostslayer: Punch ghosts until they decide to head back to the afterlife
Soulwrecking Strike: Punch possessed people so hard that the possessing entity feels it.
All 3 are combat feats, so...
Damn. I love all that! Hope they're PFS legal later to use with my brawler!
I love Possessed Hand for Brawlers quite a bit. For Monks, not so much, because kicks are more important (to use Flying Kick for example).Possessed Hand is nice, but the real nice feats for Brawlers are (I think): Soulblade, Ghostslayer, and Soulwrecking Strike.
Soulblade: Punch haunts until they stop haunting people.
Ghostslayer: Punch ghosts until they decide to head back to the afterlife
Soulwrecking Strike: Punch possessed people so hard that the possessing entity feels it.
All 3 are combat feats, so...
Holy Hamon!