Crap, why did I buy THAT?


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Goblin Squad Member

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Swiss Mercenary wrote:


1) Do NOT spend any xp unless you are absolutely sure you need the skill/feat/profession etc.

After the first few days of playing I also felt like this, but looking back after six weeks of xp spending a few thousand here or there on anything can be helpful.

All training is tied to gear. If you gather something and you spent a few xp on gemcutter 2 that you regret no worries. When you're a few months in and it takes tens or hundreds of thousands of xp to boost a rank in something you'll be going back to relatively 'cheap' upgrades to see more progress in your character even if it doesn't fit your original 'concept'.

This game doesn't really reward pure optimization, IMO. The player who can swap out gear and has lots of feats to reward them will do quite well if not better than a specialist. Even someone who can refine basic +0 or +1 resources they're gathering can save some time and help influence the economy.

No matter how you spend your experience you will get the satisfaction of improvement. I lamented spending so many feats on armor to boost my cleric's Con because pre-Alpha 10 that was a prerequisite. Even though I don't need this training it's still helpful. I have the versatility of benefitting from a wider pool of items being developed.

What is the 'worst' xp choice you made and why do you feel it's bad?

Goblin Squad Member

Yes, in the long run, but when we are possibly 7 days from a wipe it is frustrating to have spent XP on something that you can't use. I've made that mistake too many times.

Goblin Squad Member

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The 'ending' in Alpha does feel like a race to see how high my ranks can go before the wipe.

What can't you use Kradlum? Ranks in attacks feel pointless without the gear to match them, but like you said the long run will make all the difference. The versatility will become a strength when you're trying to find vulnerabilities. Keep your enemy guessing what you have up your sleeve!

Goblin Squad Member

Thought I spent way too much on knowledges since they didn't do anything, at least until they finally started to, then they were a good buy.

Beyond that? Nothing really. Even if I rarely use it, I've used it.

Goblin Squad Member

I regret NOT spending XP. The level 7 crafting skills that are now forever out of reach in alpha at 22,000 XP could have been all mine mine mine if I had acted sooner.

Like a lot of other Alpha changes I do not understand why they did that, I presume it was to pander to the more lazy or part time crafters who did not want to build up a portfolio of craft skills and recipes but it kinda killed crafting making it a log out for a week till you get more XP and then login and spend it log out again activity. I suppose it helps fighter types that want to dabble with a sideline in armor and weps but overall a bad move.

Goblin Squad Member

Neadenil Edam wrote:

I regret NOT spending XP. The level 7 crafting skills that are now forever out of reach in alpha at 22,000 XP could have been all mine mine mine if I had acted sooner.

Like a lot of other Alpha changes I do not understand why they did that, I presume it was to pander to the more lazy or part time crafters who did not want to build up a portfolio of craft skills and recipes but it kinda killed crafting making it a log out for a week till you get more XP and then login and spend it log out again activity. I suppose it helps fighter types that want to dabble with a sideline in armor and weps but overall a bad move.

I think it was related to the attribute gating. A tailor can now spend their xp in nothing but tailoring and get their dex bonus requirements and advance continuously with absolutely nothing but tailor training. There's no need to take anything else, but since it means more dex per rank they have to balance it out with making it more expensive in xp.

Would you rather buy a very expensive tailoring with a high dex bonus, or a cheaper one and be forced to train in something else to break that gate?

Goblin Squad Member

You can only get to rank 10 now in crafting before you are attribute-gated.

Goblin Squad Member

Takasi wrote:
Neadenil Edam wrote:

I regret NOT spending XP. The level 7 crafting skills that are now forever out of reach in alpha at 22,000 XP could have been all mine mine mine if I had acted sooner.

Like a lot of other Alpha changes I do not understand why they did that, I presume it was to pander to the more lazy or part time crafters who did not want to build up a portfolio of craft skills and recipes but it kinda killed crafting making it a log out for a week till you get more XP and then login and spend it log out again activity. I suppose it helps fighter types that want to dabble with a sideline in armor and weps but overall a bad move.

I think it was related to the attribute gating. A tailor can now spend their xp in nothing but tailoring and get their dex bonus requirements and advance continuously with absolutely nothing but tailor training. There's no need to take anything else, but since it means more dex per rank they have to balance it out with making it more expensive in xp.

Would you rather buy a very expensive tailoring with a high dex bonus, or a cheaper one and be forced to train in something else to break that gate?

I actually preferred the old system where a character could have a portfolio of gathering and crafting skills with a little bit of combat skills to make gathering safer.

This new system caters to the min/max lets specialise in one thing only and never "waste" XP obsession carried over from old-school MMOs. The very thing GW originally said they were going to oppose.


Takasi wrote:
Neadenil Edam wrote:

I regret NOT spending XP. The level 7 crafting skills that are now forever out of reach in alpha at 22,000 XP could have been all mine mine mine if I had acted sooner.

Like a lot of other Alpha changes I do not understand why they did that, I presume it was to pander to the more lazy or part time crafters who did not want to build up a portfolio of craft skills and recipes but it kinda killed crafting making it a log out for a week till you get more XP and then login and spend it log out again activity. I suppose it helps fighter types that want to dabble with a sideline in armor and weps but overall a bad move.

I think it was related to the attribute gating. A tailor can now spend their xp in nothing but tailoring and get their dex bonus requirements and advance continuously with absolutely nothing but tailor training. There's no need to take anything else, but since it means more dex per rank they have to balance it out with making it more expensive in xp.

Would you rather buy a very expensive tailoring with a high dex bonus, or a cheaper one and be forced to train in something else to break that gate?

Attribute gating seemed to be a big part of what they attributed the decision to. Personally I suspect they also want us to be able to only pursue one craft or refine skill and be really really good at it. It forces more cooperation at low, middle and higher levels of play. I'm not sure I'm happy with it all since I plan to have basic crafting on my main for things like bows, arrows and spears; but I'm finding myself sound more and more like Nihimon: I defer to the devs as much as possible.

@ Takasi, I had an exp budgeting guide for the Stress Test, but decided not to push it back to the top when it finally happened since, at that point, everyone would have at least 30K exp to start with. Don't know if it would have helped you, but sorry I didn't promote it when the game finally opened up to everyone.

Goblin Squad Member

I have a whole bunch of melee and bow attacks that I bought before I learnt that I need at least +1 if not +2 weapons for them to work. I have never seen a +1 weapon.

When I finally found a maneuver and it was a rogue maneuver and it was green and I thought all my dreams had come true at once! Of course I didn't have enough XP to learn it, so I waited a day and learnt it (then teleported and rolled back and learnt it again). Then I couldn't find it in my feats, so I had to ask and some kind person told me it would be bound to my weapon set, so I swapped to my melee weapon set and there in my feats was this sweet, sweet green maneuver so I delicately picked it up and dropped it into that virgin maneuver slot that had been waiting so long to be filled.

"You do not have the required rogue implement for this feat."


Kradlum, I will be handing out some pretty nice +2 and +3 weapons tonight if you can find me in game ;)

Otherwise, there are a lot of friendly crafters in game happy to trade you a weapon or armor for the mats to make it. You just have to ask around in General Chat a bit. That is how I have gotten all my armor.

Goblin Squad Member

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<Kabal> Kradlum wrote:
I have never seen a +1 weapon.

To be clear, you never will see a +1 or better weapon as a drop from any mob. Other than the basic starting gear, all gear is player-crafted.

<Kabal> Kradlum wrote:
"You do not have the required rogue implement for this feat."

Expendables (Maneuvers and Spells) have Levels. Implements (Rogue Kits, Trophy Charms, Spellbooks, Holy Symbols) have slots limited by Maximum Level and Total Levels. You probably had a Level 2 or higher Maneuver, but a Rogue Kit that only had slots for Level 1 Maneuvers.

Goblin Squad Member

I play UK times so I have not been on at the right times to get any crafted weapons or rogue kits. I know they exist and are crafted.

Goblin Squad Member

I dumped 20 or so Rogue kits in the Auction House at Alderwag. There may be a few left. And one rogue maneuver if memory serves.

Goblin Squad Member

Thank you Sspitfire, your items are much appreciated! I will remember the Wilderness Wanderers!

Goblin Squad Member

No maneuvers or rogue kits at Alderwag at the moment. I normally hit up Alderwag AH daily.

Goblin Squad Member

I have at least one rogue kit in OV, but am not on a lot. You can try whispering Cal around 5:00-7:00am UTC if you're about that early.

Goblin Squad Member

I've got basic implements for all 4 roles in Tavernhold. I'm usually on around 10-12PM Central

Goblin Squad Member

I believe Kradlum is in need of a Rogue Kit that will hold higher level Maneuvers.

Goblin Squad Member

I'll be swinging up towards Alderwag again, don't know if I arrive there today/night/whatever, but I have a rogue kit with me. A nice Goblin handed it to me....

Goblin Squad Member

Nihimon wrote:
I believe Kradlum is in need of a Rogue Kit that will hold higher level Maneuvers.

Oh, Right.

Have we established that for sure? I think, at the moment, Kradlum has no Rogue kit at all.

(edit: Ah, yes, I see the "green," now.) Perhaps there are some other maneuvers that he can use with a basic kit.

Goblin Squad Member

<Kabal> Kradlum wrote:

When I finally found a maneuver and it was a rogue maneuver and it was green and I thought all my dreams had come true at once! Of course I didn't have enough XP to learn it, so I waited a day and learnt it (then teleported and rolled back and learnt it again). Then I couldn't find it in my feats, so I had to ask and some kind person told me it would be bound to my weapon set, so I swapped to my melee weapon set and there in my feats was this sweet, sweet green maneuver so I delicately picked it up and dropped it into that virgin maneuver slot that had been waiting so long to be filled.

"You do not have the required rogue implement for this feat."

It sounds like Kradlum already had an Introductory Rogue Kit, but found a Maneuver that was too high level for it.

Goblin Squad Member

Since the topic is: "crap, why did I buy THAT?" Has anyone noticed a loot increase with Knowledge skills? Local 7, History 6, Nature 6. I have not noticed a difference in lootz, amounts or quality...


<Kabal> Kradlum wrote:
Thank you Sspitfire, your items are much appreciated! I will remember the Wilderness Wanderers!

You're welcome! The Short Sword was courtesy of Edam of Ozem's Vigil, but the bow I made myself :)


Bringslite of Fidelis wrote:
Since the topic is: "crap, why did I buy THAT?" Has anyone noticed a loot increase with Knowledge skills? Local 7, History 6, Nature 6. I have not noticed a difference in lootz, amounts or quality...

I feel like I am getting way more loot now. Don't know if taht is a result of my skillz or the new build.


Caldeathe Baequiannia wrote:
Nihimon wrote:
I believe Kradlum is in need of a Rogue Kit that will hold higher level Maneuvers.

Oh, Right.

Have we established that for sure? I think, at the moment, Kradlum has no Rogue kit at all.

(edit: Ah, yes, I see the "green," now.) Perhaps there are some other maneuvers that he can use with a basic kit.

I gave him the one that he can: String Bolos. So at least he has that. Unfortunately, no one seems to have an Student's Rogue kits on offer.

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite of Fidelis wrote:
Since the topic is: "crap, why did I buy THAT?" Has anyone noticed a loot increase with Knowledge skills? Local 7, History 6, Nature 6. I have not noticed a difference in lootz, amounts or quality...

There are persistent rumours that it isn't implemented yet... Atleast I was told it was a XP sink and I should ignore it...

Goblin Squad Member

I cannot independently confirm that Knowledge Skills are working to increase loot.

However, I can confirm that Stephen told us they should be.

Stephen Cheney wrote:
To the best of my knowledge, Knowledges should be contributing to better loot. Survival (animals - wolves), Local (humanoids - goblins, bandits, raiders, knights, cultists), Geography (giants - ogres), Planes (outsiders - hellhounds), and History (undead - skeletons and ghouls) are currently the only ones that have any creatures associated with them, with Local the big winner given our current wealth of humanoids. The other ones will start being useful once we get more creature types.

Goblin Squad Member

Cooolness! *heads towards the library*

Goblin Squad Member

Nihimon wrote:

I cannot independently confirm that Knowledge Skills are working to increase loot.

However, I can confirm that Stephen told us they should be.

Stephen Cheney wrote:
To the best of my knowledge, Knowledges should be contributing to better loot. Survival (animals - wolves), Local (humanoids - goblins, bandits, raiders, knights, cultists), Geography (giants - ogres), Planes (outsiders - hellhounds), and History (undead - skeletons and ghouls) are currently the only ones that have any creatures associated with them, with Local the big winner given our current wealth of humanoids. The other ones will start being useful once we get more creature types.

I did read that. It encouraged me to buy-n-try. I am asking because his answer does not sound 100% sure and I haven't noticed a difference (up to ranks 6 and 7). I guess that I am most curious about how they break down in terms of increase per rank or tier.

That was posted once somewhere.... (I think) :)

Goblin Squad Member

BL, which Knowledge is which Rank, and what are you getting?

I'd be happy to try to independently verify by creating a new character and comparing his loots to yours.

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite of Fidelis wrote:
Since the topic is: "crap, why did I buy THAT?" Has anyone noticed a loot increase with Knowledge skills? Local 7, History 6, Nature 6. I have not noticed a difference in lootz, amounts or quality...

I would have to do a real study then! :(

I will experiment tonight on wolves, undead, and "humaniods". The only problem is that I did not keep records of drops before I bought the feats. All I have is my gut and much time doing this. Not very scientific evidence.

As for Fletcher, he is Figther 7/ Under Powedred Rouge 4.

He farms Razmirans up to all lvls seen: The Collector", "Archpishops" "Cardinal", etc..

Undead up to risen champions.

Wolves, whatever he spots, all types.

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite of Fidelis wrote:
The only problem is that I did not keep records of drops before I bought the feats.

That's where I come in :) I'll be the control group.

It would probably be best to compare hauls on starter Goblins, or something else suitably easy for a brand new Character to farm with no more than 1,000 XP.

Goblin Squad Member

OK. :)

Gimme a number of goblins for my sample.


Nihimon wrote:
Bringslite of Fidelis wrote:
The only problem is that I did not keep records of drops before I bought the feats.

That's where I come in :) I'll be the control group.

It would probably be best to compare hauls on starter Goblins, or something else suitably easy for a brand new Character to farm with no more than 1,000 XP.

Staff + Wraith's Cry + Goblins = hundreds dead in an hour or less. Of course WC got toned down; but I will bet it will still one-shot level 1 mobs.

I'd be happy to help out with this, as well, if yall want. I can have my alt killing gobins with an amount of K(Local) between 0 and whatever BL has.

Scarab Sages Goblin Squad Member

I had an oddball regret - Why didn't I buy that? I had a short bow +0, so I didn't bother buying any of the short bow attacks beyond the first rank. When I finally acquired a short bow +2, it took me a while to buy my attacks up to Rank 3, because I hadn't set any xp aside for them.

In the live game, I think I'd advise people to start purchasing Rank 2 attacks before they have a +1 weapon, then start buying Rank 3 attacks while they look for a +2 weapon.

Goblin Squad Member

I do not make Rogue kits but they look pretty straightforward for anyone that trained Engineer.

The student ones need level 3 craft skill and Steel Plates, Steel Blanks, Weak Deadly Extract, Hemp Twine.

sspitfire1 wrote:


Staff + Wraith's Cry + Goblins = hundreds dead in an hour or less. Of course WC got toned down; but I will bet it will still one-shot level 1 mobs.

Before people try and nerf wraith cry rememeber it will be much more dangerous to use once you cannot can gish it up in heavy armor and need to cast mage resistance before melee combat.

Just remember at +1 or +2 it is a Diminishing Staff you need not Charged for Wraith Cry and Wilting Surge.

Wilting Surge + Wraith Cry are the ultimate combo of goblin killing goodness.

Goblin Squad Member

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I find that an arrow in the eye kills them pretty quick.

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite of Fidelis wrote:

I find that an arrow in the eye kills them pretty quick.

Wilting Surge on a +2 Diminishing has low level mobs of 4 or 5 just all fall over. Kills the lot in one shot from 35 m.

Goblin Squad Member

Magic stuff? <shudder>

;)

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite of Fidelis wrote:

OK. :)

Gimme a number of goblins for my sample.

My Results:
Started with 4 Goblin kills already under my belt.

... that's messed up. I just killed 10 goblins and my Goblin Slayer only advanced by 4. So that method of counting is not going to work.

After I think around 40-50 Goblins, I have:

Apprentice's Charged Wand
Bag of Dangerous Stuff (3)
Bag of Dreamy Stuff
Bag of Fiery Stuff
Bag of Stick Stuff
Copper Coin (46)
Goblin Armor Scraps
Introductory Holy Symbol
Introductory Spellbook
Introductory Trophy Charm (2)
Lesser Token of Awareness
... Dodging (4)
... Freedom (3)
... Parrying
... Riposting
... Striking (2)
Recipe: Weak Adhesive Extract
Recipe: Yew and Iron Splint
Steel Greatsword
Steel Light Mace

I put all that in the bank, then headed back out to kill a confirmed 40 Goblins.

Bag of Fiery Stuff
... Healty Stuff
Broken Goblin Weapon (2)
Copper Coin (38)
Introductory Holy Symbol (3)
Lesser Token of Dodging (2)
... Freedom (3)
... Mind Blanking
... Parrying
... Riposting (2)
Recipe: Introductory Toolkit
Spell: Burning Hands
Spell: Sound Burst
Steel Dagger

This was all on the Goblins around Rathglen.

Goblin Squad Member

Results: 40 Goblins near Rathglen.

Results:
30 cp
bag of bitter stuff
....fiery stuff (2)
....smelly stuff
Goblin armor scraps
Intro Holy symbol (2)
lesser token of Dodging (2)
....freedom
....parrying
....riposting
pot steel plate
runespun robes
steel shortsword

Run 2:

48 cp
Apprentice's charged staff
Bag Dangerous stuff
....fiery stuff (2)
....Itchy stuff
Goblin Armor scraps (2)
Intro Rogue's Kit
Lesser Token of Dodging
....Freedom
....Mind Blanking
....Striking (3)
Steel Dagger
Steel Spear

Goblin Squad Member

At a glance, I don't see a noticeable difference.

Goblin Squad Member

I rised local for 1 to 6 today and there is no notable difference, other than a vague feeling that I get a bit more weapons now...

Goblin Squad Member

Schedim wrote:
I rised local for 1 to 6 today and there is no notable difference, other than a vague feeling that I get a bit more weapons now...

I didn't notice an increase in gushers, greens and blues in my gathering skills until I hit Rank 7.

For mobs and knowledge skills wasn't there a note that Geography is now working for Ogres?

Does higher knowledge only increase the frequency of rarer drops on higher level monsters that have a chance to drop them? Where are people getting their tier 2 recipes? What is their knowledge?

Goblin Squad Member

I can't find the paragraph in the blog but somewhere I read about skills and remember thinking : "That wasn't much".

It was some thing like 1% or something... But it depends on on wich scale, what the base is and a zippilion of factors....

Goblin Squad Member

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I would love to see a "confirm" button when you buy a feat. Missklicking on level 17 will be a pain, and if you have a cat playing on your keyboard you will be liable to end its life in frustration or something.

Goblin Squad Member

Takasi wrote:
...gushers...

When did the gusher-code go in? I missed that.

Goblin Squad Member

T7V Jazzlvraz wrote:
Takasi wrote:
...gushers...
When did the gusher-code go in? I missed that.

I don't think it is. I suspect there's a mis-use here, possibly for the nodes that produce an unusual number of something, like getting 10 coal from a single node.

Goblin Squad Member

Yeah I'm probably not using it right.

Ever since I hit Rank 7 I sometimes get 5 or 6 items from a node filled with greens and blues.

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