Suggestions for Subterfuge Achivements


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Goblin Squad Member

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First, Long Knives should be their own weapon type (not light blade along with short sword).

Secondly, Corpse Looting should be added to Subterfuge achievments


Bluddwolf wrote:

First, Long Knives should be their own weapon type (not light blade along with short sword).

Secondly, Corpse Looting should be added to Subterfuge achievments

I agree, i made a similar request on the alpha forum in favor of replacing the Arcane Expert achievement by Staff Expert and Wand Expert.

Even if some desagree, I believe that having only a single weapon achievement (Arcane Expert) from which to gain Category Point Arcana will eventually become a grindfest.

Goblin Squad Member

My other issue with Subterfuge is that it requires running escalations, due to the lack of weapons in this class. The same does not hold true for Martial.

50 kills = level 3

With five weapons you can get to Martial 15 fairly easily (250 kills total)

Subterfuge has only two weapons and so would take over a thousand kills for each to get to the same 15 Subterfuge.

The solution to this imbalance should not be, you have to do escalations! I don't want to have to grind countless days worth of boring PvE to advance my Rogue, nor train a slew of Fighter's weapons to back door my way up the Rogue tree.

Edit:

Martial has six (5 weapons + shield).

Arcane, just two spell ability types.

Divine, has three ability types

Subterfuge, has two ability types and is the only one that requires Escalations.

Goblin Squad Member

Bluddwolf wrote:

My other issue with Subterfuge is that it requires running escalations, due to the lack of weapons in this class. The same does not hold true for Martial.

50 kills = level 3

''' stuff '''

.

AFAIK Level 3 is worth 6 martial points.

Doing that with 5 weapons would get you 30 points not 15.

Goblin Squad Member

Bluddwolf wrote:

Martial has six (5 weapons + shield).

Arcane, just two spell ability types.

Divine, has three ability types

Subterfuge, has two ability types and is the only one that requires Escalations.

It's a bit different than that, as I don't see Escalations required for any of the four categories:

Martial has five weapon, one shield, and no Escalation Achievements.

Arcane has one weapon and one Escalation Achievement.

Divine has one weapon and two Escalation Achievements.

Subterfuge has two weapon and three Escalation Achievements.

Many people, including me, perceive it as too difficult to pursue Escalation Achievements if one's unable to find a group at a given time. That leaves, as others've been doing the math to show, a pretty grindy experience for everyone except Martial-folk.

Goblinworks folk have said they're adding more Achievement categories, and I hope those are high priority, as they also--quite prominently--promised no grind. This is Alpha, and we're far from the time when we can reasonably expect all promises to be kept, but some things, such as grind, have the ability to hurt the game disproportionately.

Goblin Squad Member

T7V Jazzlvraz wrote:
Bluddwolf wrote:

Martial has six (5 weapons + shield).

Arcane, just two spell ability types.

Divine, has three ability types

Subterfuge, has two ability types and is the only one that requires Escalations.

It's a bit different than that, as I don't see Escalations required for any of the four categories:

Martial has five weapon, one shield, and no Escalation Achievements.

Arcane has one weapon and one Escalation Achievement.

Divine has one weapon and two Escalation Achievements.

Subterfuge has two weapon and three Escalation Achievements.

Many people, including me, perceive it as too difficult to pursue Escalation Achievements if one's unable to find a group at a given time. That leaves, as others've been doing the math to show, a pretty grindy experience for everyone except Martial-folk.

Goblinworks folk have said they're adding more Achievement categories, and I hope those are high priority, as they also--quite prominently--promised no grind. This is Alpha, and we're far from the time when we can reasonably expect all promises to be kept, but some things, such as grind, have the ability to hurt the game disproportionately.

If you had to get to Subterfuge 18 in order to advance to Rogue 6, you would have to grind Short Box and Light Blades to 9, each requiring well over 1000 kills.

So Rogues are either forced to run escalations (Thief, Free Slaves, etc) or train and use the full gambit of Martial Weapons to advance in Rogue.

What I suggested is:

1. Shift Long Knives into their own category

2. Add Hand Axes / Throwing Axes (the ones Goblin Scouts use) to Subterfuge.

3. Add Corpse Looting to Subterfuge

This would give 4 weapons and one activity

Goblin Squad Member

Bluddwolf wrote:
If you had to get to Subterfuge 18 in order to advance to Rogue 6, you would have to grind Short Box and Light Blades to 9, each requiring well over 1000 kills.

Actually, Subterfuge and Martial points increase geometrically.

Short Bow kills 1 gives +1 Subterfuge Points. Short Bow 2 gives +2 Subterfuge points, so your total is 3. Short Bow 3 (+3) gets you to 6. Short Bow 4 (+4) gets you to 10. Short Bow 5 (+5) gets you to 15. Short Bow 6 (+6) gets you to 21.

You can get to Subterfuge 21 with Short Bow (Or Light Blade) at 6. That's 500 kills.

You can get to Subterfuge 20 with Short Bow at 4 (100 kills) and Light Blade at 4 (100 kills). It doesn't take over 1000 kills on each.

Goblin Squad Member

It feels as if Arcane and Divine need even more love than Subterfuge, then? Lots of changes needed.

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