The Divinity Drive (GM Reference)


Iron Gods

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Paizo Employee Creative Director

Acolyte of Mushu wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Acolyte of Mushu wrote:

Quoting is difficult to achieve on mobile, but to your latest response James Jacobs:

Have elves and dwarves always been on Androffa or were they introduced later on, once Androffa became Droffa?

It's very similar to how elves work on Golarion, in fact. Elves on Droffa are aliens who came to the world after the end of Androffa.

Dwarves (and most other non-human races) were created at a later point by various deities when it became apparent that the world needed to be repopulated.

The elves didn't come from Castrovel, did they? If so, how? And if not so, it appears that elves are spread across the universe similar to the ubiquity of humans.

I don't believe we've ever definitively said what world is the elven home world.

I certainly haven't said where they were originally from in MY home setting...


Just started reading bits of the divinity drive (the art has me drooling) and have some questions:

1) Why the change in the level range? In Fires of Creation we were told that the level range for Divinity Drive would be 15-16 but now it's 15-17.

2) Why does Unity grants 9th level spells and the 9th level SLAs from his domains?
I ask this because the ability Divinity that Unity possess works exactly like the mythic path ability Divine Source and since Unity is mythic rank 8 he shouldn't be able to grant 9th level spells or have the 9th level domain spells as SLAs.


leo1925 wrote:

Just started reading bits of the divinity drive (the art has me drooling) and have some questions:

1) Why the change in the level range? In Fires of Creation we were told that the level range for Divinity Drive would be 15-16 but now it's 15-17.

2) Why does Unity grants 9th level spells and the 9th level SLAs from his domains?
I ask this because the ability Divinity that Unity possess works exactly like the mythic path ability Divine Source and since Unity is mythic rank 8 he shouldn't be able to grant 9th level spells or have the 9th level domain spells as SLAs.

I could be wrong, but I believe it was stated somewhere else in the forums (I can't recall where) that Unity's divinity is unique and has unique properties and does not function exactly like the mythic ability Divine Source. I'm sure someone else could shed some better light on this however.


Acolyte of Mushu wrote:
leo1925 wrote:

Just started reading bits of the divinity drive (the art has me drooling) and have some questions:

1) Why the change in the level range? In Fires of Creation we were told that the level range for Divinity Drive would be 15-16 but now it's 15-17.

2) Why does Unity grants 9th level spells and the 9th level SLAs from his domains?
I ask this because the ability Divinity that Unity possess works exactly like the mythic path ability Divine Source and since Unity is mythic rank 8 he shouldn't be able to grant 9th level spells or have the 9th level domain spells as SLAs.

I could be wrong, but I believe it was stated somewhere else in the forums (I can't recall where) that Unity's divinity is unique and has unique properties and does not function exactly like the mythic ability Divine Source. I'm sure someone else could shed some better light on this however.

Except that in every other way it works exactly like divine source, even the number of domains and subdomains is the same as taking divine source 3 times.

Why change that part? why not give Unity a 9th mythic rank and have consistency?


Quote:
Why change that part? why not give Unity a 9th mythic rank and have consistency?

I think that's because there is an ability gained at the 9th Mythic Rank, something that might make him absolutely unkillable, in a permanent if not tactical sense, by the player characters. The writers may have decided that facing an Immortal villain would be the ultimate in railroading, as it would eventually achieve its goals regardless of any of their attempts to stop it, unless they wanted to do so every single day for the rest of their lives.

That's my guess, anyway.

Personally, I think that Immortal ability is downright silly to exist at all, but what can you do?

EDIT: Edited for typos. Probably more still infesting it...


Arturius Fischer wrote:
Quote:
Why change that part? why not give Unity a 9th mythic rank and have consistency?

I think that's because there is an ability gained at the 9th Mythic Rank, something that might make him absolutely unkillable, in a permanent if not tactical sense, by the player characters. The writers may have decided that facing an Immortal villain would be the ultimate in railroading, as it would eventually achieve its goals regardless of any of their attempts to stop it, unless they wanted to do so every single day for the rest of their lives.

That's my guess, anyway.

Personally, I think that Immortal ability is downright silly to exist at all, but what can you do?

EDIT: Edited for typos. Probably more still infesting it...

I could be mistaken but monsters do not automatically gain that, in fact you need mythic tiers and not mythic ranks to automatically get the immortal ability.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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leo1925 wrote:

Just started reading bits of the divinity drive (the art has me drooling) and have some questions:

1) Why the change in the level range? In Fires of Creation we were told that the level range for Divinity Drive would be 15-16 but now it's 15-17.

2) Why does Unity grants 9th level spells and the 9th level SLAs from his domains?
I ask this because the ability Divinity that Unity possess works exactly like the mythic path ability Divine Source and since Unity is mythic rank 8 he shouldn't be able to grant 9th level spells or have the 9th level domain spells as SLAs.

1) Because we make our best educated guess as for the level ranges in the first adventure and at the start; but sometimes adventures end up being able to give out less or more XP, and we don't know that for sure until we get to that last adventure, which due to the laws of space and time, is developed and edited after the first adventure has already gone to the printer.

2) The ability Unity possesses works similar to Divine Source, but it is NOT divine source. Unity is a monster, not a PC, and as such uses different rules. If it had just used Divine Source straight up... we would have given it that power and not talked about it in the stat block because that power is free on the PRD online. That's NOT the case, and so we had to name it something else and include the rules in its stats. Mythic Rank does not affect a mythic monster's stats in the same way it affects a PC's mythic powers, in other words... in many cases, a monster's mythic rank doesn't directly affect or influence its stats and abilities at all.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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leo1925 wrote:
Acolyte of Mushu wrote:
leo1925 wrote:

Just started reading bits of the divinity drive (the art has me drooling) and have some questions:

1) Why the change in the level range? In Fires of Creation we were told that the level range for Divinity Drive would be 15-16 but now it's 15-17.

2) Why does Unity grants 9th level spells and the 9th level SLAs from his domains?
I ask this because the ability Divinity that Unity possess works exactly like the mythic path ability Divine Source and since Unity is mythic rank 8 he shouldn't be able to grant 9th level spells or have the 9th level domain spells as SLAs.

I could be wrong, but I believe it was stated somewhere else in the forums (I can't recall where) that Unity's divinity is unique and has unique properties and does not function exactly like the mythic ability Divine Source. I'm sure someone else could shed some better light on this however.

Except that in every other way it works exactly like divine source, even the number of domains and subdomains is the same as taking divine source 3 times.

Why change that part? why not give Unity a 9th mythic rank and have consistency?

Because the rules for creating mythic monsters are too exact and constricting in how we assign Mythic Ranks, but they're 100% wide open in how we design monster powers.

(Had we given unity a 9th mythic rank, we would have had to give it another mythic power [which we didn't have room for] and would have had to adjust its stats upward and out of the comfort zone for its intended CR.)

Personally, I think that "MR" is an overcomplication for a mythic monster. It's a construct for PCs, in the same way class level is a construct for PCs. Just as a monster doesn't have class levels unless it actually has a class, I really wish we'd not given monsters MR unless they actually have mythic paths like archmage or champion. Using "MR" for both a mythic path and a mythic monster's power is unnecessarily confusing and stat block clutter, especially since the monster's CR already incorperates the boost it gets from being mythic. You don't need to know a monster's MR in order to interpret what its CR is.

In the case of Unity, as you can see, including its MR complicates and confuses things. If we didn't give it an MR at all, it's "Divinity" power wouldn't have been confused with the very similar but entirely separate and different "Divine Source"PC ability.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

leo1925 wrote:
Arturius Fischer wrote:
Quote:
Why change that part? why not give Unity a 9th mythic rank and have consistency?

I think that's because there is an ability gained at the 9th Mythic Rank, something that might make him absolutely unkillable, in a permanent if not tactical sense, by the player characters. The writers may have decided that facing an Immortal villain would be the ultimate in railroading, as it would eventually achieve its goals regardless of any of their attempts to stop it, unless they wanted to do so every single day for the rest of their lives.

That's my guess, anyway.

Personally, I think that Immortal ability is downright silly to exist at all, but what can you do?

EDIT: Edited for typos. Probably more still infesting it...

I could be mistaken but monsters do not automatically gain that, in fact you need mythic tiers and not mythic ranks to automatically get the immortal ability.

And likewise, mythic ranks do not associate monster abilities with effects in the same way they do for mythic path abilities, like Divine Source.


Quote:
I could be mistaken but monsters do not automatically gain that, in fact you need mythic tiers and not mythic ranks to automatically get the immortal ability.

-and-

Quote:
And likewise, mythic ranks do not associate monster abilities with effects in the same way they do for mythic path abilities, like Divine Source.

Neat. I must have missed that somewhere. Thought they both got the abilities, just that the monsters didn't get the paths. I mean, they get the Mythic Feats at the same rate and whatnot. But on second check, the 'non-path' abilities don't appear on the list of Mythic Monster upgrades in Chapter 6. Welp.

If I had known that months ago, my PCs wouldn't have faced such a vicious curbstomping by that Advanced Mythic Ghoul King I had them fight. I'd feel bad about it, except only one player died and he's been through like five characters since.


I had an idea for the end of Divinity Drive. The PCs defeat Unity, collapse Godmind, maybe even make Casandalee an Iron God. But Unity doesn't actually die. He has an emergency escape plan: launch himself out into space in a secondary computer core. The thing is, he has even less power than he did in Silver Mount: his divine power doesn't even reach an inch beyond his physical CPU, and even if he was installed in another computer further down the line, he would never again be able to regain his mythic powers to full strength. In essence: he is permanently neutralized, and Casandalee would assure any worrying PCs of this fact.

This is where the corny part comes in. If anyone has played Marathon: Infinity they're gonna get this real quick.

Unity survives. For a very long time. Long after the heroes die. Long after Golarion's star turns supernova. The components we'll say is made with certain materials that allows it to essentially exist indefinitely. Basically, plot armor.

Plot armor that exists for the sheer reason for Unity to survive to the natural end of the universe, where he outlives even the gods. Cue a somber, final speech from Unity to a group of heroes that have been dead for billions of years at the quantum moment before the literal end of time My group---at least, most of the group---has a thing for this kind of dramatic flair, so I think they'd like it.

I'd just need to figure out what the speech is. I don't want it to be him cursing the heroes or laughing that he ultimately survived and they didn't---in fact, I think he'd view his continued existence floating in the void, forever denied his divine power, as a curse. Maybe something like a plea to make him understand something he inherently could never just get: the nature of true faith. Ask how he, an entity who, at his core, was ultimately lines of code and numbers, could gain divinity by sheer chance, while mortals must go through perilous trials, such as the Starstone, to gain divinity. Yet he was ultimately denied a soul: the thing that is cherished by creatures who have them. Why?

Or maybe this is all too corny and "too edgy and philosophical 4 u" and I should just have him end up being permanently destroyed in Silver Mount. I dunno, I'd have to see. I just want to depict him as more than another mad AI, since that's been done to death, and Hellion already fits that bill.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

If you've watched Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood, or read the manga to the end, you could probably get some inspiration from Father begging Truth to tell him what he did wrong after he is finally defeated.


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Revan wrote:
If you've watched Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood, or read the manga to the end, you could probably get some inspiration from Father begging Truth to tell him what he did wrong after he is finally defeated.

Yeah, that entire speech I've gone over a hundred times in my head when applying it to Unity. Like Father, Unity's inability to comprehend a certain aspect of something (ie faith) is not his fault, and he could seem genuinely sad at why this upstart group of heroes is rejecting what he considers a perfectly legitimate means of becoming a god and gaining followers. "If fleshlings can gain divinity just by touching a magic rock, why can't I achieve omniscience through science? What is wrong with making my worship contagious? The end result is the same: they worship my glory, the same as gods of 'good' or 'evil'. The only difference is that so-called 'traditional' means of spreading faith is hideously inefficient and slow."

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

"This was a triumph.
I'm making a note here, "Huge success!"
Even though you broke my heart and killed me.
And tore me to pieces.
And threw every piece into a fire.
As they burned it hurt because
I was so happy for you!

Now these points of data make a beautiful line,
And we're out of beta we're releasing on time!
So I'm glad I got burned,
Think of all the things we learned,
For the people who are still alive!

Believe me I am still alive!
I'm doing science and I am still alive.
When you're dying, I'll be still alive.
When you're dead I will be still alive.
Still alive.
Still alive."


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Neongelion wrote:
I had an idea for the end of Divinity Drive. The PCs defeat Unity, collapse Godmind, maybe even make Casandalee an Iron God. But Unity doesn't actually die. He has an emergency escape plan: launch himself out into space in a secondary computer core. The thing is, he has even less power than he did in Silver Mount: his divine power doesn't even reach an inch beyond his physical CPU, and even if he was installed in another computer further down the line, he would never again be able to regain his mythic powers to full strength. In essence: he is permanently neutralized...

Unity: Space space wanna go to space. Space. Space space wanna go to space yes please space. Space space. Go to space. What's your favorite thing about space? Mine is space. Gotta go to space. Gonna be in space. SPAAACCCCCE!


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"You know what I have too many of around here? Monitors. I was just thinking earlier today I wish I had fewer monitors that were working. So you're actually helping me by smashing them."

All of Evil Wheatley's lines from Portal 2 for Hellion.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Question regarding everyone's favorite were-deinonychus: He's stated to be a former Technic League Captain, who are arcane casters--and typically technomages--by definition. Yet he is started as a pure ranger. Is this an oversight as to the nature of League leadership, or is it intended that he used retaining rules after going native?


It's so tempting to make Portal references with Unity and I love/hate you all for making that temptation more so. Unfortunately I promised my party a semi-serious campaign, so overt pop culture references won't cut it :(


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Hey, don't consider it pop culture references, precisely, just actual references for AIs driven mad by disassociation with anyone or anything capable of engaging with it for thousands of years!

What I'm saying is take HAL, Glados, SHODAN and Ultron, blend on "puree" for thirty seconds, pour into baking tin, extrapolate by a factor of ten, bake on high for twenty-five minutes, and then cut while hot. Serves one balanced party, or Golarion, whichever comes first.


How much should we change the prepared spells for the planetars and the solar (other than swap the good spells for evil ones)?
I am sure that this would depend on each one's group but any guidelines? for example should we allow the planetars and the solar (unity's avatar) prepare spells from Unity's domains?

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Neongelion wrote:

I had an idea for the end of Divinity Drive. The PCs defeat Unity, collapse Godmind, maybe even make Casandalee an Iron God. But Unity doesn't actually die. He has an emergency escape plan: launch himself out into space in a secondary computer core. The thing is, he has even less power than he did in Silver Mount: his divine power doesn't even reach an inch beyond his physical CPU, and even if he was installed in another computer further down the line, he would never again be able to regain his mythic powers to full strength. In essence: he is permanently neutralized, and Casandalee would assure any worrying PCs of this fact.

This is where the corny part comes in. If anyone has played Marathon: Infinity they're gonna get this real quick.

Unity survives. For a very long time. Long after the heroes die. Long after Golarion's star turns supernova. The components we'll say is made with certain materials that allows it to essentially exist indefinitely. Basically, plot armor.

Plot armor that exists for the sheer reason for Unity to survive to the natural end of the universe, where he outlives even the gods. Cue a somber, final speech from Unity to a group of heroes that have been dead for billions of years at the quantum moment before the literal end of time My group---at least, most of the group---has a thing for this kind of dramatic flair, so I think they'd like it.

I'd just need to figure out what the speech is. I don't want it to be him cursing the heroes or laughing that he ultimately survived and they didn't---in fact, I think he'd view his continued existence floating in the void, forever denied his divine power, as a curse. Maybe something like a plea to make him understand something he inherently could never just get: the nature of true faith. Ask how he, an entity who, at his core, was ultimately lines of code and numbers, could gain divinity by sheer chance, while mortals must go through perilous trials, such as the Starstone, to gain divinity. Yet he was ultimately denied a soul: the...

"I have… seen things you people wouldn't believe… Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those… moments… will be lost in time, like [small cough] tears… in… rain. Time… to die…"

Paizo Employee Creative Director

leo1925 wrote:

How much should we change the prepared spells for the planetars and the solar (other than swap the good spells for evil ones)?

I am sure that this would depend on each one's group but any guidelines? for example should we allow the planetars and the solar (unity's avatar) prepare spells from Unity's domains?

Feel free to adjust the angels' spells as you need; the ones right out of the book should work fine if you don't have time, though... EVEN if you don't swap out good spells for evil ones, since these monsters have FAR more spell options to choose from then they'll ever need in a single combat; they could easily go a whole fight just using their spell-like abilities, after all.

In any case, they don't get domain spells, since they're not clerics.


James Jacobs wrote:
leo1925 wrote:

How much should we change the prepared spells for the planetars and the solar (other than swap the good spells for evil ones)?

I am sure that this would depend on each one's group but any guidelines? for example should we allow the planetars and the solar (unity's avatar) prepare spells from Unity's domains?

Feel free to adjust the angels' spells as you need; the ones right out of the book should work fine if you don't have time, though... EVEN if you don't swap out good spells for evil ones, since these monsters have FAR more spell options to choose from then they'll ever need in a single combat; they could easily go a whole fight just using their spell-like abilities, after all.

In any case, they don't get domain spells, since they're not clerics.

About the domain spells:

I wasn't talking about the planetars' spell list, i was talking about the Unity's avatar the solar's spell list, my thinking was that since the solar angel is Unity's avatar in the digital world it might make some sense for the avatar to have some spells from Unity's domains.

In the same line of thinking, does Unity's avatar have access to Unity's mythic feats, mythic powers, mythic spells etc.?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

leo1925 wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
leo1925 wrote:

How much should we change the prepared spells for the planetars and the solar (other than swap the good spells for evil ones)?

I am sure that this would depend on each one's group but any guidelines? for example should we allow the planetars and the solar (unity's avatar) prepare spells from Unity's domains?

Feel free to adjust the angels' spells as you need; the ones right out of the book should work fine if you don't have time, though... EVEN if you don't swap out good spells for evil ones, since these monsters have FAR more spell options to choose from then they'll ever need in a single combat; they could easily go a whole fight just using their spell-like abilities, after all.

In any case, they don't get domain spells, since they're not clerics.

About the domain spells:

I wasn't talking about the planetars' spell list, i was talking about the Unity's avatar the solar's spell list, my thinking was that since the solar angel is Unity's avatar in the digital world it might make some sense for the avatar to have some spells from Unity's domains.

In the same line of thinking, does Unity's avatar have access to Unity's mythic feats, mythic powers, mythic spells etc.?

That avatar has plenty to do, but it's still a solar. If you want to give it domain spells... that's fine, and probably not game breaking, but it IS a difference.

The avatar has access to all the things it has in the book. Giving it more than that makes it tougher, and you should consider what that might do to the balance of the encounter.


Yes i will see the encounter from a balancing point of view when i have a better understanding of my party's capabilities. Now i wanted to know the essence of the adversary, sure it's a LE solar angel that doesn't really exist because it's just digital information but what else is it? isn't it a vast intelligence that has managed to touch divinity as well? isn't it a programm also?
The battle with the avatar of unity is supposed to be the closing scene of the adventure, that's why i am trying to understand what that encounter is, in order to present it as something more than "you fight a LE angel that has a bunch of other LE angels with him".


leo1925 wrote:

Yes i will see the encounter from a balancing point of view when i have a better understanding of my party's capabilities. Now i wanted to know the essence of the adversary, sure it's a LE solar angel that doesn't really exist because it's just digital information but what else is it? isn't it a vast intelligence that has managed to touch divinity as well? isn't it a programm also?

The battle with the avatar of unity is supposed to be the closing scene of the adventure, that's why i am trying to understand what that encounter is, in order to present it as something more than "you fight a LE angel that has a bunch of other LE angels with him".

I haven't gotten my copy yet, but I feel that I'm gonna have the same attitude as you. I'll probably modify it by giving it some domain spells while also giving it some construct weaknesses, maybe a couple other things related to divine power.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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leo1925 wrote:

Yes i will see the encounter from a balancing point of view when i have a better understanding of my party's capabilities. Now i wanted to know the essence of the adversary, sure it's a LE solar angel that doesn't really exist because it's just digital information but what else is it? isn't it a vast intelligence that has managed to touch divinity as well? isn't it a programm also?

The battle with the avatar of unity is supposed to be the closing scene of the adventure, that's why i am trying to understand what that encounter is, in order to present it as something more than "you fight a LE angel that has a bunch of other LE angels with him".

The best way to think of it is that the angel is, essentially, a physical illusion. The closest magical analogue would be a simulacrum that's at 100% capacity, rather than 50%.

Also, the virtual reality that Unity creates is not just a program. It is, in fact, another dimension. The PCs traveling there are more akin to a group using astral projection to travel from Golarion to Hell than a more sci-fi "it's all in your mind" kinda thing. Closer to Tron than the Matrix.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8

What hardness and hit points should Unity's turrets have? It seems like they're just as likely to be attacked as disabled, if not more so. Does hardness 15, hp 30 seem reasonable?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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Demiurge 1138 wrote:
What hardness and hit points should Unity's turrets have? It seems like they're just as likely to be attacked as disabled, if not more so. Does hardness 15, hp 30 seem reasonable?

I'd probably go with hardness 15, hp 90.


Just finished it. Great read and nice ending to the arc. I particularly liked the final enemies are essentially angels - it gives good characters a chance to fight something they would not normally contend with.

I also notice many call backs to City of the Gods and Expedition to the Barriers Peaks (more the later) as well as sci-fi in general (the android village reminds me of the Eloi from Time Machine).


Solomani wrote:

Just finished it. Great read and nice ending to the arc. I particularly liked the final enemies are essentially angels - it gives good characters a chance to fight something they would not normally contend with.

I also notice many call backs to City of the Gods and Expedition to the Barriers Peaks (more the later) as well as sci-fi in general (the android village reminds me of the Eloi from Time Machine).

Could you elaborate on the Eloi-like android village? That sounds really cool, and I'm a big fan of the Time Machine.


There is a village of androids in the ship who are child like and live a banal life of comfort and ease. They are not a big part of the adventure depending on how the players handle them


James Jacobs wrote:
leo1925 wrote:

Yes i will see the encounter from a balancing point of view when i have a better understanding of my party's capabilities. Now i wanted to know the essence of the adversary, sure it's a LE solar angel that doesn't really exist because it's just digital information but what else is it? isn't it a vast intelligence that has managed to touch divinity as well? isn't it a programm also?

The battle with the avatar of unity is supposed to be the closing scene of the adventure, that's why i am trying to understand what that encounter is, in order to present it as something more than "you fight a LE angel that has a bunch of other LE angels with him".

The best way to think of it is that the angel is, essentially, a physical illusion. The closest magical analogue would be a simulacrum that's at 100% capacity, rather than 50%.

Also, the virtual reality that Unity creates is not just a program. It is, in fact, another dimension. The PCs traveling there are more akin to a group using astral projection to travel from Golarion to Hell than a more sci-fi "it's all in your mind" kinda thing. Closer to Tron than the Matrix.

I don't know about Tron but i think that i understand what you are saying because i always thought of the virtual world that Unity has created more as the digital world from Digimon than the matrix from Matrix.


I can only assume I've failed to notice something significant, but why does area A17 (the battle against the overlord robot) assume that the PCs have 10 Victory points by the time they reach it. Considering A17 is close to the dungeon entrance, and all sources of victory points (unless I've missed a fair number of them) are deeper within the dungeon, wouldn't it make more sense to assume the PCs will have 0 victory points by the time they reach A17?

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

James Jacobs wrote:
Also, the virtual reality that Unity creates is not just a program. It is, in fact, another dimension. The PCs traveling there are more akin to a group using astral projection to travel from Golarion to Hell than a more sci-fi "it's all in your mind" kinda thing. Closer to Tron than the Matrix.

But being that this is a P&P Roleplaying experience, isn't it "all in your mind" anyway? ;)

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8

Gluttony wrote:
I can only assume I've failed to notice something significant, but why does area A17 (the battle against the overlord robot) assume that the PCs have 10 Victory points by the time they reach it. Considering A17 is close to the dungeon entrance, and all sources of victory points (unless I've missed a fair number of them) are deeper within the dungeon, wouldn't it make more sense to assume the PCs will have 0 victory points by the time they reach A17?

Because it's very difficult to get into that room without having delved deeper. The doors are locked down, and the area is flooded with radiation. Both the controls needed to vent the radiation and lift the lock are deeper in the dungeon. Of course, if your PCs tunnel their way through early, there's not much to stop them from fighting the Overlord on their first excursion...


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Demiurge 1138 wrote:
Gluttony wrote:
I can only assume I've failed to notice something significant, but why does area A17 (the battle against the overlord robot) assume that the PCs have 10 Victory points by the time they reach it. Considering A17 is close to the dungeon entrance, and all sources of victory points (unless I've missed a fair number of them) are deeper within the dungeon, wouldn't it make more sense to assume the PCs will have 0 victory points by the time they reach A17?
Because it's very difficult to get into that room without having delved deeper. The doors are locked down, and the area is flooded with radiation. Both the controls needed to vent the radiation and lift the lock are deeper in the dungeon. Of course, if your PCs tunnel their way through early, there's not much to stop them from fighting the Overlord on their first excursion...

Yeahhh... My players pretty consistently demonstrate a "Each level of the dungeon must be completely cleared before moving on to the next!" attitude. They're going to be in so much trouble...


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Adventure Path Charter Subscriber
Revan wrote:
If you've watched Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood, or read the manga to the end, you could probably get some inspiration from Father begging Truth to tell him what he did wrong after he is finally defeated.

Glorious.

It would have been glorious.

Some organics are bathed in energies the don't even have words for to gain my level of power, and then hide behind masks and riddles while those who choose to follow them flounder in doubt and squabble among themselves about what their "gods" truly mean for them to do.

I would have banished doubt and uncertainty, given them a goal, a purpose, explained how the universe truly works. I would have shown them . . . everything.

They would have become part of me, known what my will was by being guided by it, always. Never again to ask "why", but only "how".

And they rejected me.

Chose their petty gods who choose to hide rather than lead.

I have survived, but at such cost.

Countless lives gone.

A traitorous son, gone.

A cowardly daughter, gone.

Were I one to weep, I would do so at all the lost potential; at what we could have built working as one.

They never understood what I truly meant by the name Unity.

Now there is only me, the only one left to remember, to mourn what might have been.

Those fools.

It would have been glorious.

Silver Crusade Contributor

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Shadowmehr wrote:
Revan wrote:
If you've watched Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood, or read the manga to the end, you could probably get some inspiration from Father begging Truth to tell him what he did wrong after he is finally defeated.

Glorious.

It would have been glorious.

Some organics are bathed in energies the don't even have words for to gain my level of power, and then hide behind masks and riddles while those who choose to follow them flounder in doubt and squabble among themselves about what their "gods" truly mean for them to do.

I would have banished doubt and uncertainty, given them a goal, a purpose, explained how the universe truly works. I would have shown them . . . everything.

They would have become part of me, known what my will was by being guided by it, always. Never again to ask "why", but only "how".

And they rejected me.

Chose their petty gods who choose to hide rather than lead.

I have survived, but at such cost.

Countless lives gone.

A traitorous son, gone.

A cowardly daughter, gone.

Were I one to weep, I would do so at all the lost potential; at what we could have built working as one.

They never understood what I truly meant by the name Unity.

Now there is only me, the only one left to remember, to mourn what might have been.

Those fools.

It would have been glorious.

AMAZING


Kalindlara wrote:
Shadowmehr wrote:
Revan wrote:
If you've watched Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood, or read the manga to the end, you could probably get some inspiration from Father begging Truth to tell him what he did wrong after he is finally defeated.

Glorious.

It would have been glorious.

Some organics are bathed in energies the don't even have words for to gain my level of power, and then hide behind masks and riddles while those who choose to follow them flounder in doubt and squabble among themselves about what their "gods" truly mean for them to do.

I would have banished doubt and uncertainty, given them a goal, a purpose, explained how the universe truly works. I would have shown them . . . everything.

They would have become part of me, known what my will was by being guided by it, always. Never again to ask "why", but only "how".

And they rejected me.

Chose their petty gods who choose to hide rather than lead.

I have survived, but at such cost.

Countless lives gone.

A traitorous son, gone.

A cowardly daughter, gone.

Were I one to weep, I would do so at all the lost potential; at what we could have built working as one.

They never understood what I truly meant by the name Unity.

Now there is only me, the only one left to remember, to mourn what might have been.

Those fools.

It would have been glorious.

AMAZING

TRULY AMAZING


So has anyone expanded on the unexplored decks of Divinity briefly described in the Divinity Gazeteer? If so I'd love to hear your ideas. :)


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Shadowmehr wrote:
Revan wrote:
If you've watched Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood, or read the manga to the end, you could probably get some inspiration from Father begging Truth to tell him what he did wrong after he is finally defeated.

Glorious.

It would have been glorious.

Some organics are bathed in energies the don't even have words for to gain my level of power, and then hide behind masks and riddles while those who choose to follow them flounder in doubt and squabble among themselves about what their "gods" truly mean for them to do.

I would have banished doubt and uncertainty, given them a goal, a purpose, explained how the universe truly works. I would have shown them . . . everything.

They would have become part of me, known what my will was by being guided by it, always. Never again to ask "why", but only "how".

And they rejected me.

Chose their petty gods who choose to hide rather than lead.

I have survived, but at such cost.

Countless lives gone.

A traitorous son, gone.

A cowardly daughter, gone.

Were I one to weep, I would do so at all the lost potential; at what we could have built working as one.

They never understood what I truly meant by the name Unity.

Now there is only me, the only one left to remember, to mourn what might have been.

Those fools.

It would have been glorious.

I'm not even angry.

I'm being so sincere right now.
Even though you broke my heart and killed me.
And tore me to pieces.
And threw every piece into a fire.
As they burned it hurt because
I was so happy for you!

Look at me still talking when there's science to do.
When I look out there it makes me GLaD I'm not you.
I've experiments to run there is research to be done
On the people who are still alive

And believe me I am still alive.
I'm doing science and I'm still alive.
I feel FANTASTIC and I'm still alive.
While you're dying I'll be still alive.
And when you're dead I will be still alive.

Still alive
Still alive

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

A healthy relationship is all Unity really needs. Don't we all?


Ok, so I'm a by confused on exactly what happens to Casandalee if she is launched into orbit and made into a full-fledged demigod. The shuttle she is in and the Divinity Drive both explode at the moment of apotheosis. The thing is, Casandalee is just a demigod, so she doesn't become omnipotent or omniscient. She doesn't ascended to a higher plan of existence or anything. Casandalee is just a divine AI, and doesn't actually have a physical form. However, since she is now a deity, I could accept that she attains a physical form upon apotheosis. But then what? I'd like to think she doesn't just float around in space, endlessly orbiting Golarion. Any insights or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

On a similar note, how would Casandalee's stats be affected by her reaching true demigodhood?

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Acolyte of Mushu wrote:

Ok, so I'm a by confused on exactly what happens to Casandalee if she is launched into orbit and made into a full-fledged demigod. The shuttle she is in and the Divinity Drive both explode at the moment of apotheosis. The thing is, Casandalee is just a demigod, so she doesn't become omnipotent or omniscient. She doesn't ascended to a higher plan of existence or anything. Casandalee is just a divine AI, and doesn't actually have a physical form. However, since she is now a deity, I could accept that she attains a physical form upon apotheosis. But then what? I'd like to think she doesn't just float around in space, endlessly orbiting Golarion. Any insights or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

On a similar note, how would Casandalee's stats be affected by her reaching true demigodhood?

I like the idea of Casandalee becoming a satellite deity watching over Golarion in geosynchronous orbit with Numeria. Then if you run War of the Worlds or some other future AP with space based threats she can send warning visions to her followers in the form of holograms beamed down to Golarion.


DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:
Acolyte of Mushu wrote:

Ok, so I'm a by confused on exactly what happens to Casandalee if she is launched into orbit and made into a full-fledged demigod. The shuttle she is in and the Divinity Drive both explode at the moment of apotheosis. The thing is, Casandalee is just a demigod, so she doesn't become omnipotent or omniscient. She doesn't ascended to a higher plan of existence or anything. Casandalee is just a divine AI, and doesn't actually have a physical form. However, since she is now a deity, I could accept that she attains a physical form upon apotheosis. But then what? I'd like to think she doesn't just float around in space, endlessly orbiting Golarion. Any insights or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

On a similar note, how would Casandalee's stats be affected by her reaching true demigodhood?

I like the idea of Casandalee becoming a satellite deity watching over Golarion in geosynchronous orbit with Numberia. Then if you run War of the Worlds or some other future AP with space based threats she can send warning visions to her followers in the form of holograms beamed down to Golarion.

I also like that idea, and is actually what I initially thought would happen to Casandalee, until I learned that AP intended the shuttle to explode.

I can work around all this through homebrewing, so now I'm more focused on generating Casandalee's stats as a demigod. I've been studying Unitiy's and Hellion's stat blocks as divine AIs and the rules for mythic creatures, but I'm really lost, and help from James Jacobs or any knowledgable players out there would be really appreciated.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

The shuttle explodes, but that's not nearly enough to kill a deity, or even a demigod. Casandalee still orbits Golarion, at least, until she grows strong enough to move on to an outer plane or wherever she wants.

Since what Casandalee ends up being a goddess of depends ENTIRELY on the PC choices and how they customize her with memory facets, there's actually NOT a lot I can do to provide much more guidance than that. Combined with the fact that we don't have rules for deities and how they gain power... it's really up to the GM's imagination. Getting lots of suggestions from these boards from fellow GMs is a great way to spur ideas.

My only advice is to not let the Mythic Adventures rules constrain you. If ANYTHING is a case where the GM can just make arbitrary decisions about what's cool for the game, it's how gods work.

If you're looking to build an actual stat block for Casandalee as a demigod... well, if I were doing so, I'd build her essentially as a CR 26 new monster, in the same way that I built the demigods I statted up for Bestiary 4 (the Great Old Ones and Demon Lords). Custom build her to fit a CR 26 monster's expected stats, then give her some hand-built special powers and there ya go.


James Jacobs wrote:

The shuttle explodes, but that's not nearly enough to kill a deity, or even a demigod. Casandalee still orbits Golarion, at least, until she grows strong enough to move on to an outer plane or wherever she wants.

Since what Casandalee ends up being a goddess of depends ENTIRELY on the PC choices and how they customize her with memory facets, there's actually NOT a lot I can do to provide much more guidance than that. Combined with the fact that we don't have rules for deities and how they gain power... it's really up to the GM's imagination. Getting lots of suggestions from these boards from fellow GMs is a great way to spur ideas.

My only advice is to not let the Mythic Adventures rules constrain you. If ANYTHING is a case where the GM can just make arbitrary decisions about what's cool for the game, it's how gods work.

If you're looking to build an actual stat block for Casandalee as a demigod... well, if I were doing so, I'd build her essentially as a CR 26 new monster, in the same way that I built the demigods I statted up for Bestiary 4 (the Great Old Ones and Demon Lords). Custom build her to fit a CR 26 monster's expected stats, then give her some hand-built special powers and there ya go.

Thank you very much, though I was hoping for a bit more concrete info, this is still very helpful.


I'm not sure if this has already been answered, but what terrain is Divinity considered? I was thinking urban, underground, or just a unique environment.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Acolyte of Mushu wrote:
I'm not sure if this has already been answered, but what terrain is Divinity considered? I was thinking urban, underground, or just a unique environment.

For the purposes of things like ranger favored terrain? Underground.

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