Build Advice: Savage Technologist PFS


Advice

Owner - Pikes Comics

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Looking for some advise on how to build a savage technologist for PFS. Build must take Gunsmithing feat to be allowed to have firearms.

Thanks in advance!


Any additional information for us? Point buy, race, etc It helps a lot :)

Owner - Pikes Comics

PFS standard point buy. I am open to any phb race, plus wayaang, kitsune, nagaji, and tiefling.

Gunsmithing is needed feat as otherwise can't buy a firearm in pfs.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

what exactly do you mean by 'savage technologist'? are you looking for someone who uses technology savagely or 'a savage' (as in an unusually primitive person) who has embraced technology far beyond their native culture?

if the first (which seems less likely), i'd suggest a half-elf alchemist starting off with gunsmith (and ancestral arms for EWP[firearms]). add amateur gunslinger at 3rd and the explosive missile discovery at 4th.

if the second... that sounds to me like a multiclass character... start off with a level or two of something suitably primitive and then dive into gunslinger. or just make a gunslinger and say he grew up in a primitive tribe, maybe have him dress that way still or take a trait or feat to represent that heritage.

Owner - Pikes Comics

Savage Technologist is a Barbarian archetype from the technology book. It allows a barbarian to rage and get bonuses to Dex and str. They also get multi fighting with a light weapon and a firearm. Later on they get to add their Dex to damage for firearms.


Looking at the archetype in the Technology Guide, it seems you have two choices:

1. Assuming that an advanced firearm is not going to be available soon. Go tiefling (with tail to reload) and build as a gunslinger somewhat retarded in feats. Gunsmithing, rapid reload (weapon), point blank shot, rapid shot, deadly aim, precise shot.

2. Assume that an advanced firearm is going to be available soon. Go human and build as a gunslinger somewhat retarded in feats and switching out gunsmithing for rapid reload.

It would be nice if sword and gun were a viable option, but it isn't because the S&G Savage Technologist would be relying on DEX for AC without armor and snap shot takes too many feats, resulting in a poor unarmored barbarian taking AoOs when firing. If you intend to use a firearm as a barbarian then you should resign yourself to not being on the front line, consider TWFing pistols.

Rage powers are pretty open, you don't need to go beast for the pounce, elemental is useless and the spirit line would be more useful than for traditional melee focused barbarians.

Alternatively you could pretty much ignore firearms and go with a straight barbarian build. DEX instead of CON when raging isn't that bad, you could have more AC than a straight barbarian. Losing uncanny dodge/improved uncanny dodge and getting nothing in exchange might hurt but isn't crippling. Maybe grab a rifle for ranged combat if you want to use a firearm, but if STR focused you would be better off with an adaptive bow.


Unless the Gm is being super nice and allowing the tail to reload, by RAW all it can do is retrieve things. The archetype does not suffer AoO while TWF with a pistol + weapon if the character limits itself to attacks with those two weapons in a given attack action. What I would do would be grab a race with a +2 racial to Dex (probably human). Assuming human, a starting statline of:
Str12/Dex18/Con14/Int10/Wis14/Cha8
Feats
1:Weapon Finesse
Human Bonus:Weapon Focus (Light/Onehanded Weapon)
3:Slashing Grace (Same Light/Onehanded Weapon)
5: Point Blank Shot
7: Precise Shot
As for Rage Powers, I'd look for ones that compliment the build such as:
Reckless Abandon - Trace AC for to-hit.
Superstitious - Saves, always good.
Fiend Totems - 3rd Attack, attackers take damage, non-evil adjacent to you are shaken.
Fueled by Vengeance - Sustain rage for free.

Build concept, take your dex and use it for your main combat stat.


The biggest problem I foresee a Savage Technologist having in PFS is reloading. The Archetype assumes that more advanced guns will be available, and they probably won't be in PFS. Consider the following:

The archetype gives sword and gun free at 2nd level. This fighting style has issues with reloading however, just like any other TWF style with guns. Either you fire one shot and drop your gun, or you have to do some shenanigans with 3rd "arms" (vestigial arm/tail/hair hex), or you have shenanigans with Gun Twirling (using pistols that are both melee weapons and ranged weapons, like sword cane or dagger pistols).

Worse, you do not get Dex to damage unless you are raging. Even the most lenient GM will say that reloading a firearm is an action that requires concentration.

My advice is: unless you have it on good authority that you will be picking up a non-early firearm, don't do it.


Treefolk wrote:
Unless the Gm is being super nice and allowing the tail to reload, by RAW all it can do is retrieve things. The archetype does not suffer AoO while TWF with a pistol + weapon if the character limits itself to attacks with those two weapons in a given attack action.

The trick with tail reloading is to "retrieve" the weapon in your off-hand and reload while your off-hand is free. Abusive stretch of the rules, certainly, but it makes sword&gun or sword&pistol work. If the GM doesn't allow retrieving items from you hand, you take the grasping tail feat, make a point of free action dropping the weapon in your non-gun hand on the ground within 5', reloading and firing then swift action retrieving it from the ground.

Missed not getting the AoOs for firing bit on Sword & Gun. Character will still draw the AoOs on reloading though.

WRT to the build I assume gunsmithing feat at level 5 and PBS at 7 with precise shot at 9, but is slashing grace fixed so it includes light weapons or does it still have the no slashing weapons which are finessable problem?


There are slashing light weapons, wakizahi would probably be the best bet.


Treefolk wrote:
There are slashing light weapons, wakizahi would probably be the best bet.

Well yes but, unless the feat has been fixed, slashing grace is limited to one-handed weapons and thus cannot be applied to light weapons.


Or...

Another option is to use a Pepperbox. It contains 6 rounds so it should last you an entire fight. Might want to keep a backup to draw, in case you run out of ammo or if you misfire.

Dark Archive

Pepperbox won't work for TWF: it requires a free hand to rotate the barrel housing.

I think the best use of savage technologist for PFS would be to ignore the TWF piece and go with a defensive barbarian: you lose the penalty to AC while raging and gain a bonus to DEX - why not focus on a high AC high STR barbarian? You would still get the DEX-to-damage for guns at level 5, giving you a nice ranged combat option.


The bread and butter of a savage technologist is using a gun and something to hit close.

Human is a really good choice, because you´re a bit feat starved.
From there you can go two ways, ignore guns or take one.
Generaly i would keep stats even, meaning you go for a 14 at least in STR/DEX/CON, then you can decide to have a 14 in WIS too, what is surely a help. Or you go 16/15/15, putting points from leveling into the 15s.
The Raging Vitality feat will help you a lot probably, since it gives you more CON while raging.

Other feats are:
-Power Attack (you´re barbarian after all)

If guns:
-Gunsmithing is obvious in PFS if you want a gun.
-Rapid Reload! Take this over other ranged combat feats. You have high boni and target touch attacks, so you´ll be hitting good anyway.

You still have problems reloading without a free hand, what is really the trap of the archetype. It was most probably written assuming you have reliable access to hightech weapons like lasers etc and be able to rage cycle.
Earlier, a weapon cord would have provided a solution, but thanks to some folks who need to abuse everything they can, there was a FAQ making retrieving a weapon a move action.


Use twin pistol daggers and gun twirling. You can also use a cestus or a glove, or IUS as your off hand weapon to make use of the Sword and Gun feature without losing your ability to reload.

Dark Archive

That's an interesting idea: shooting people with a gun and punching them in the face with the other "free" hand. Unarmed Strike wouldn't be an option for PFS, as the rule book lists unarmed strike separate form either light or one handed melee weapons (a home campaign might reasonably allow that), but a cestus might work pretty well!

Silver Crusade

Hayato Ken wrote:

The bread and butter of a savage technologist is using a gun and something to hit close.

I'd like to respectfully disagree. The combat bonuses gained by doing so are relatively minor. My Savage Technologist for PFS is basically an even more tanky barbarian because of the Dex boosts. I'll only buy him a gun and gunsmithing (though he is a little feat starved) later, when he has plenty of cash. I understand that this is the way lostpike wants it, but I wouldn't go two guns. Depending on how switch-hitting he is, I might spring for a weapon cord on a musket or something.


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You could make use of Opening volley.

Your gun attacks target touch, so even later iteratives can hit. The +4 bonus is really, really good to to-hit and helps with the usually bad TWF accuracy. And it has no requirements to boot, so you can fit it into the build rather easily.


So, sorry to necro but how I figured out how to get around this was to carry 10 swords and use the quick draw feat. Sword attack, Gun attack, drop sword, reload gun, draw a new sword.

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