| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Players are overpowered. They should simply be banned from the game.
And then the DM wrote a hit novel series, creating a high-fantasy setting with deep, beloved characters and compelling drama, which is why he wanted to DM in the first place.
The players moved to LARPing, ditched the annoying people with their "motivations" and "feelings" and got some booze and food IRL with the money they toil endlessly to obtain.
Nothing is overpowered if one is GMing properly.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
the real question is exactly how many of those overpowered threads where started by raving dork himself ravingdork op!
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
The Necromancy School is overpowered.
Just look at Raise Thread. A ban worthy spell if I ever have seen one.
I know this thread is Walking Dead, but I read it start to finish anyway and there's one point that really jumped out at me.
Imbalance between classes worked in Olde Editions because those weren't combat games. They were exploration games. Heck in some of the experience was gained by treasures obtained rather than fights [which were often best avoided entirely when possible] at all.
Pathfinder is a mental/social experience tacked onto a combat simulator.
I have seen plenty of people complain about the way The Old Editions (TM) worked. Heck, I have seen people state that they first experienced the C/MD in an early edition. More than once. Rogue/Thief hate isn't unique to 3.X either.
yes this c/md (if it tis truely a thing) has existed since 1st edition where a 1st level mage was useless at level 1 and depending on fighters to keep them alive till level 6-10 ish where they no longer needed no one but there spells and a good (well versed) player to conquer the world. (provided a higher level mage wasn't there to stop them)
"Kobolds are overpowered"
S~+*, if Kobolds are overpowered, everything else MUST be.
Back to 2nd edition!
ever play that 2nd edition module "dragon mountain"?
A 15th level module where the primary antagonists are kobolds, some with levels, most without. Play that and you'll absolutely see how to make Kobolds overpowered.
c/md = Caster / Martial Disparity ?
Of course everything is overpowered. I mean, have you seen those commoners? Jeez.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
c/md = Caster / Martial Disparity ?
Yep.
As opposed to CMD, which is derived from Strength, Dexterity, BAB and a few miscelaneous modifiers, or cmd, which will start an instance of the Command Interpreter when typed into the "Run" prompt of (most?) Windows Operating Systems.
Its good to be clear on these things. Can't have another level vs level vs level fiasco, can we?
But magic, well thats a whole different ballgame. Magic can literally change the story. Instead of fighting your way through a trapped hallway, you are flying calmly over it while your enemies are blind, confused and in a pit. Instead of having to convince the king to arrest the evil noble, the kings your best friend now, and of course he'll do you a solid and throw that jerk in jail.
Nothing about that requires magic. All that is required is some decent roleplay and an investment in social skills.
Narrative power requires little more than good roleplay and a modest investment in something other than pure killing power.
Nothing about that requires magic. All that is required is some decent roleplay and an investment in social skills.
But magic, well thats a whole different ballgame. Magic can literally change the story. Instead of fighting your way through a trapped hallway, you are flying calmly over it while your enemies are blind, confused and in a pit. Instead of having to convince the king to arrest the evil noble, the kings your best friend now, and of course he'll do you a solid and throw that jerk in jail.
Point is that Magic can imitate almost any classes thing without having to need to be in that class
Point is that Magic can imitate almost any classes thing without having to need to be in that classNothing about that requires magic. All that is required is some decent roleplay and an investment in social skills.
But magic, well thats a whole different ballgame. Magic can literally change the story. Instead of fighting your way through a trapped hallway, you are flying calmly over it while your enemies are blind, confused and in a pit. Instead of having to convince the king to arrest the evil noble, the kings your best friend now, and of course he'll do you a solid and throw that jerk in jail.
I find while magic can imitate almost any class feature it can't be done all the time and it expends heavy resources. Of course a high level with heavy wealth you can get the resources to do it 24/7. I don't find that happens till level 17 or so.
|
But magic, well thats a whole different ballgame. Magic can literally change the story. Instead of fighting your way through a trapped hallway, you are flying calmly over it while your enemies are blind, confused and in a pit. Instead of having to convince the king to arrest the evil noble, the kings your best friend now, and of course he'll do you a solid and throw that jerk in jail.Nothing about that requires magic. All that is required is some decent roleplay and an investment in social skills.
Narrative power requires little more than good roleplay and a modest investment in something other than pure killing power.
But some casters can change what they invest in on a daily basis, and I think every caster can change out at least a few spells over the course of their career.
A nonmagical character who takes Persusasive is not gonna get that Persuasive back the day after they charm King Fancypants and go unto the Hellstorm of Slightly Challenging Encounters. This combines with feat trees and low-ish skill points for an ugly disparity.
This is why I love the Vigilante; those narrative powers are baked into the class, rather than options that HAVE to be taken instead of something else.
So one of the big things causing a lot of this is the general diversifying of role playing game themes. D&D and many of the other old school games were rules for combat and a vague skill system plugged in and often ignored. As times went by some people likes the beer and pretzels monster killing and others liked the detailed character acting. Some new games arose to meet the new demand which drew in more new gamers and so on. Fast forward till today and we have a bunch of different schools of gamer thought that don't all jive with every game out there.
Pathfinder ad a descendant of D&D is a combat heavy dungen crawly sort of game. Combat is a huge majority of the system crunch and no small part of the campaign. Reasonably it can be expected to take up from one to 3 fourths of any gaming session. So the d20 PTB decided to make it that every class had nearly equal opportunity to be useful in combat because players were no longer willing to sit out half a game waiting for their turn. This isn't necessarily a bad thing on their part... Ask anyone who had to wait thirty minutes in a shadowrun game to finish the Decker's 2 seconds of real time battle to do something in the middle of a fire fight how frustrating it can be. Expecting this game to be a collaborative narrative crafting game is not something I'll tell you you can't do, but I will say it's sort of like trying to use a football as a potato masher. Sure it can work with the right effort and setup but that's an improvised use of it. If that sort of game is what you want you might be better served with a different system and/or a different gaming group.
That being said I know that in the world of finding games beggars can't always be choosers and it's not fair that everyone can't always get what they want out of a game but games have to some degree specialize or they become to unwieldy or unfocused to be fun for anyone.
Personally I'm blessed in that my players all trust me enough that they just play in my games and have fun at this point and trust that I'll set the pace to match their capabilities depending on the group and genre i'm fiddling about with at the time.
c/md = Caster / Martial Disparity ?Yep.
As opposed to CMD, which is derived from Strength, Dexterity, BAB and a few miscelaneous modifiers, or cmd, which will start an instance of the Command Interpreter when typed into the "Run" prompt of (most?) Windows Operating Systems.
Its good to be clear on these things. Can't have another level vs level vs level fiasco, can we?
Of course not, Fiasco is an entirely separate RPG.
|
|
But magic, well thats a whole different ballgame. Magic can literally change the story. Instead of fighting your way through a trapped hallway, you are flying calmly over it while your enemies are blind, confused and in a pit. Instead of having to convince the king to arrest the evil noble, the kings your best friend now, and of course he'll do you a solid and throw that jerk in jail.Nothing about that requires magic. All that is required is some decent roleplay and an investment in social skills.
Narrative power requires little more than good roleplay and a modest investment in something other than pure killing power.
But some casters can change what they invest in on a daily basis, and I think every caster can change out at least a few spells over the course of their career.
A nonmagical character who takes Persusasive is not gonna get that Persuasive back the day after they charm King Fancypants and go unto the Hellstorm of Slightly Challenging Encounters. This combines with feat trees and low-ish skill points for an ugly disparity.
This is why I love the Vigilante; those narrative powers are baked into the class, rather than options that HAVE to be taken instead of something else.
Actually, there are rules for retraining feats and skill points now.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/basics-ability-scores/more-character-options/retrai ning
Yes, but I don't believe you can retrain your entire fest selection 1/Day in only an hour.