Envisioning Batman (PFS)


Advice


I'm trying to work out a build for a character that I can use when I realize I'm going to be in a party that needs to be saved from itself. I'm saying this because half my (limited number of) games so far have been with children or newer players, and one or two of us had to save the party from a TPK several times.

My first though was a cleric, but I learned that healing a bad team just makes you lose slower.

So the theme for this character is;
I'M NOT THE PARTY MEMBER YOU WANT, BUT I'M THE PARTY MEMEBER YOU NEED!

I'm not actually basing the character on Batman, so I don't want to try and break down the "classes" that Batman would have.

However, there is a LOT I liked about the idea of a Dark Knight of Goodness.

My original thought was a Tiefling Paladin (using the race with +2 Cha) with maybe the first level in rogue for the trap skills, but then it became just a mess.

I also might end up human due to time constraints...

Then, thematically I was maybe thinking Inquisitor or Magus for general utility/badassery.

All I know is I don't want a one-trick pony, but rather the ability to protect the group without being a healbot.

Overthinking a lot, so I've come to the community for help with focus :)

Liberty's Edge

You cannot be everything and cover all bases. Not possible.
That said: A buddy of mine did a tiefling Ninja/Paladin that seemed to do well. High Charisma is a must so take a variation (such as Demon Blooded) that allows for that. Beyond that just remember that your ninja tricks and such don't exempt you from your paladin code.


If you are looking for a utility character your best choices are bard, inquisitor, or ranger. All three get decent amount of skills, and a lot of class abilities. All three are also spell casters of some sort so also increase your versatility.

The ranger will be better at combat then the other two especially if he is fighting his favored enemy. While he is a less powerful spell caster, he is a prepared divine caster so knows every spell on the list. With enough warning he can tailor his spells to what is needed. Since favored terrain and favored enemy bonus’s stack he can get some pretty ridiculous perception rolls in the right circumstance.

If you go for a bard I would recommend taking the archeologist archetype. An archeologist bard is like a rogue on steroids. Since his archeologist luck is of limited duration he will tend not be able to sustain his full potential all the time. Make sure you get lingering performance and maybe play a half elf for the favored class bonus. If traits are allowed pick up fates favored. Between archeologist luck and heroism you will have a huge bonus on just about everything.

The inquisitor is probably the most versatile class in the game. No matter what you are dealing with he has a class ability that will be useful. If you are having trouble hitting use judgment of justice, need more damage judgment of destruction work, fighting in an environment where you are taking fire damage each round use judgment of resistance. Bane allows you to significantly increase your combat ability against any type of creature. You get more bonus’s on skill than any other class in the game.

Overall I would recommend an inquisitor and stay human. The favored class bonus of extra spells knows is pretty hard to beat. For your extra feat chose improved monster lore to get an even higher bonus on identifying your enemies.


It is weird how few talk about playing Rangers anymore. At least not on these boards.

I'm going to have to take a look at the Inquisitor class as I've never really examined it.


Well are you trying to protect them in combat or outside of it? I have a very nice reach trip build that will allow you to put several foes prone a round effectively handing AOO to everyone including yourself who will also be able to do a decent amount of damage and also preventing those foes from harming your party. If this sounds like something you'd want let me know and I will send you the build I am currently using with a +16trip, +11disarm, reach, 6AOO per round, and the ability to trip 2 foes each round at level 4.


Yeah, I've also got a ninja / paladin character. It didn't start out as a batman character, but wow, if you start speaking in a gravelly voice, it just happens! As Altus alluded, watch the poison use, but sneak attack is okay. Sadly, the divine bond can't be a rocket car, but you can say that your armored coat has frosted highlights and nipple decals!


The new Investigator, Slayer, or Brawler classes might fit the theme you are looking for.

Silver Crusade

I'm going to get a lot of flack when I suggest this, but I think it would work great.

Tiefling rogue (straight rogue, don't give up Trapfinding)
-high Dex and Weapon Finesse build
-take Offensive Defensive as your first Rogue Talent to boost AC and Pressure Points as your second to either debuff enemy's Str or Dex
-take Armor of the Pit feat for +2 natural armor
-Armor expert trait and suicidal tiefling trait
-get a mithral breastplate as soon as possible
-with a +2 mithral breastplate and 20 Dex, Armor of the Pit, Ring of Protection, Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier, and Amulet of Natural Armor you're looking at 28 AC before Offensive Defensive kicks in

If you want to save some money on this character, take the Maw or Claw (claw) tiefling alternate racial trait to get 2 1d4 natural attacks so you don't have to upgrade weapons. You can get a Amulet of Natural Armor instead and it will cost you half as much to have 2 +3 claw attacks instead of 2 +3 weapon attacks. Plus you can save your feats for other stuff rather than the Two-weapon Fighting line.

Liberty's Edge

Human Archer Bard focused on buff and utility spells is an excellent "I fit in well with any party and am always handy." character. Few better, really.


For simplicity ill offer this build for batman....

Inquisitor 2/ sensei monk 10

Strength 14
Dex 12
Con 14
INT 12
WIS 16(18)
Charisma 7

Take conversion or heretic inquisition to improve mouth or sneak skills. Ur wisdom will take over almost everything in the end as u get to boost allies as if a bard, u attack based off wisdom, ki pool makes up for a lot, initiative is stronger than most, skill list is strong and number of skills is near bard level. You are master of nothing but good at everything but spells. Traits to grab are reactionary, wisdom in the flesh, and something that grants a skill u need but is t on ur list. Favored class bonus to HP every time. Grab deflect arrows quick with monk feat as that will help u stay alive.


I have a very important question - do you actually want Batman or a character with Batman's ideals?

Key points for Batman:

1. He's human and doesn't have any powers. So, no spells, supernatural abilities or spell-like abilities.
2. He sneaks around, terrifying his foes as a Dark Knight (Oneil & Adams, post-Frank Miller).
3. He generally fights without weapons and deals nonlethal damage.

Martial Batman:
All signs point to a Monk 1/Thug+Scout Rogue X. A Sap Master Build will give you insane nonlethal damage, and Enforcer allows you a free intimidate attempt and attack, causing your enemies to almost always become frightened when you hit them.

How this works:
Monk gives you free Improved Unarmed Strike Proficiency.
=> Sap Master grants double your Sneak Attack Die with a nonlethal attack.
=> Sap Adept doubles that again, giving double your level's worth in bonus damage per attack.
=> Knockout artist grants +1 damage per SA die rolled. You now deal your level in SA die + triple your level nonlethal damage.

=> Offensive Defense rogue talent now gives your level's worth as a bonus to AC.

=> Enforcer gives you a free intimidate attempt per nonlethal hit. Enemies are shaken for rounds = the damage you dealt.
=> Thug's Frightening feature lets you convert 4+ rounds shaken to frightened.
=> Shatter Defenses makes feared enemies flat-footed to your attacks.

This character might seem like a one-trick pony, but there's a two-pronged attack at play here. (1), There's a very decently high amount of damage being dealt here, and (2), You provide damage mitigation when you make the BBEG run away screaming.


Katydid wrote:

I have a very important question - do you actually want Batman or a character with Batman's ideals?

Key points for Batman:

1. He's human and doesn't have any powers. So, no spells, supernatural abilities or spell-like abilities.
2. He sneaks around, terrifying his foes as a Dark Knight (Oneil & Adams, post-Frank Miller).
3. He generally fights without weapons and deals nonlethal damage.

** spoiler omitted **

This character might seem like a one-trick pony, but there's a two-pronged attack at play here. (1), There's a very decently high amount of damage being dealt here, and (2), You provide damage mitigation when you make the BBEG run away screaming.

Actually his power is that he takes the tech from every victory he achieves. As a result a sufficiently old batman has access to apokolips tech. All his rouges gallery tech (Freeze gun/scarecrow fear for example). All the JL rouges gallery.

The best way to manifest itself is with UMD via scrolls. He has to be able to perform great physical hand to hand feats (and have good thrown weapons) while still being able to travel dimensions.

Unfortunately batman is characterized primarily by his infinite wealth which makes reproducing him basically impossible without special character creation rules.


That's not really a power - it's more like a defining advantage that isn't as key as it is for someone like, say, Tony Stark. Batman is still Batman without his tech, grappling hook and utility belt, and Bruce has demonstrated the capacity to work without his tools when sent back in time.

Still a good reason to pick a noncasting class with UMD as a class skill though.

Liberty's Edge

Undone wrote:

Actually his power is that he takes the tech from every victory he achieves. As a result a sufficiently old batman has access to apokolips tech. All his rouges gallery tech (Freeze gun/scarecrow fear for example). All the JL rouges gallery.

The best way to manifest itself is with UMD via scrolls. He has to be able to perform great physical hand to hand feats (and have good thrown weapons) while still being able to travel dimensions.

Unfortunately batman is characterized primarily by his infinite wealth which makes reproducing him basically impossible without special character creation rules.

Nope! Investigator gets the ability to make extracts, which really are (thematically and to some extent mechanically) one-use magic items. At no cost. That and the rest of its class features suit Batman to a tea. Yes, it makes him a sorta spellcaster, but that's a small price to pay for how perfectly it solves this problem and reflects all Batman's other capabilities.


Investigator is the clear choice for the detective without peer. That said, if you want to play up the ninja side of the batman mythos, then ninja works well. Just make sure that if you go that route, take all the necessary traits and feats to make UMD easy for you (to simulate his gadgets).

Liberty's Edge

Trogdar wrote:
Investigator is the clear choice for the detective without peer. That said, if you want to play up the ninja side of the batman mythos, then ninja works well. Just make sure that if you go that route, take all the necessary traits and feats to make UMD easy for you (to simulate his gadgets).

Slayer with the Dangerously Curious Trait also seems viable if you really despise the idea of Investigator for some reason.

Scarab Sages

Investigator really is the best single class option. There is a reason Ra's al Ghul calls him "detective".


Oath wrote:
I'm not actually basing the character on Batman, so I don't want to try and break down the "classes" that Batman would have.

Well, this has become about the bat. That'll teach you to mention Batman offhand. Anyhow... I would guess that you can best try to 'protect' your party either by dominating the encounters with casting, or by getting up front and splitting anyone/anything that wants to hurt the kids in two. What do you do?

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